Who has encountered a cheater using a hack?

[Screemonster]

as the internet (especially social media) has shown, there are no brakes on the outrage train

if someone posts a false accusation, even if it gets debunked, you can't guarantee that everyone that saw the accusation saw the debunking - and the accusations go viral due to outrage clicks (people tend to share things that make them angry) while the debunking videos don't get anywhere near the same level of signal boosting

 

[Morbad]

Which begs the question if cheaters are so bad (I hate cheaters) why is it so very verboten to out 'em? Never have understood that.

Really - why can't they be outed?

Because some people's standards of proof are quite low and communities have a tendency to reach for the pitchforks and torches without understanding what's going on or who has done what.

Certainly there is clear cut proof of surrounding some cheaters; either something so overt, self-admitted, or such a long and consistent pattern that there is little to no room for doubt; but for every one of those cases, there is probably an order of magnitude more shaky or utterly unfounded accusations with dubious 'proof' attached, not to mention a few malicious lies.

Ultimately, it's up to Frontier to deal with cheaters and though their response has been slow and lackluster, I definitely see why they don't want their forums cluttered with specific accusations.

 

[Arry]

Because some people's standards of proof are quite low and communities have a tendency to reach for the pitchforks and torches without understanding what's going on or who has done what.

Certainly there is clear cut proof of surrounding some cheaters; either something so overt, self-admitted, or such a long and consistent pattern that there is little to no room for doubt; but for every one of those cases, there is probably an order of magnitude more shaky or utterly unfounded accusations with dubious 'proof' attached, not to mention a few malicious lies.

Ultimately, it's up to Frontier to deal with cheaters and though their response has been slow and lackluster, I definitely see why they don't want their forums cluttered with specific accusations.

i wonder why F.D. can't just have a private, 'cheat report' address? Nothing goes public.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Hmmmm....

Actually my question was more about PVP'rs (cheaters or not) welcoming and not opposing Videos posted online and making them visible. I had not considered that they would become visible to FD and thus subject to ban.

Which begs the question if cheaters are so bad (I hate cheaters) why is it so very verboten to out 'em? Never have understood that.

Really - why can't they be outed?

If it turns out the poster lied, misconstrued, falsely accused, prompted revenge/vendetta then appropriate action can be taken against them.

Otherwise I really don't get it.

I don't think its bad to out them per se, except for the risk of false positives. Like i said earlier, people tend to cry cheat without knowing for sure if it is. And when such things get posted, everyone else tends to assume cheat. That's how the witch hunts start against innocent people.

I'm sure plenty of people when ganked have wondered if the person who killed them was cheating, perhaps just because they don't understand how powerful some ships can be vs what they are flying. I know of a few people who have been accused of cheating who i am pretty certain would never cheat.

That is why the best way to out them is simply send the videos/reports to FD. At the end of the day, they are the only ones who can do anything about it anyway.

If someone is convinced FD don't care and are not doing anything, then they might as well quit, because soon enough Open would become like some online games that the cheaters took over. I'm sure most of us have heard about such games, where the developers either couldn't or wouldn't do anything about the cheaters.

 

[Morbad]

i wonder why F.D. can't just have a private, 'cheat report' address? Nothing goes public.

You can already report players in game and via the support site.

 

[Ian Skippy]

i wonder why F.D. can't just have a private, 'cheat report' address? Nothing goes public.

As morbad said, that literally exists already.

 

[Einar Donarsson]

Well, doing my honest pirate buisness in my trusty "The Emperors Defiance" Piracycutter i encountered quite some weird things in this current community goal.

1. Uninterdictable t9 and aspX. They werent close to a planet or anything just could not interdict them.
2. A krait mk II killing half of my 8k shields with resistances (lowest being 30%) with DRAG MUNITION missiles in seconds.
3. A Corvette being faster than my Cutter.

Dont say outright it was cheating.. but you gotta say its quite suspicous.

Did i report them? No. Why? Cause by now im convinced Frontier doesnt care or does NOT KNOW how to properly detect them. One of those 2 things.

Fly dangerous commanders.

 

[dxm55]

Cause by now im convinced Frontier doesnt care or does NOT KNOW how to properly detect them. One of those 2 things.

I'm thinking more along the lines of, since most of the game data is processed on client, FDev can't easily fix this problem without altering major parts of the game's code which may affect/break either the P2P performance, or even the game itself.

Or who knows, maybe what ever is needed to snoop around on our clients might break some kind of privacy laws somwhere in the US, Europe or Australiasia?



Basically, if you make a multiplayer game that doesn't go through a central or regional server, you've already entered the fight with one arm tied behind your back......

.... and the other glued to your face.....

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Well, doing my honest pirate buisness in my trusty "The Emperors Defiance" Piracycutter i encountered quite some weird things in this current community goal.

1. Uninterdictable t9 and aspX. They werent close to a planet or anything just could not interdict them.
2. A krait mk II killing half of my 8k shields with resistances (lowest being 30%) with DRAG MUNITION missiles in seconds.
3. A Corvette being faster than my Cutter.

Dont say outright it was cheating.. but you gotta say its quite suspicous.

Did i report them? No. Why? Cause by now im convinced Frontier doesnt care or does NOT KNOW how to properly detect them. One of those 2 things.

Fly dangerous commanders.

If FD don't care and can't detect, then no point reporting. But what if they do care and they can't detect easily, then your report could be of some use.

Why not take the few seconds to report someone? You could be helping not only FD, but yourself and other players.

I also demonstrated earlier in the thread how FD are detecting and banning cheats. Weaksauce bans, but they are doing it.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

I can see a situation where someone is wrongfully banned and file a suit because they were outed in public. People are litigious, and they're becoming increasingly more entitled.

Whilst the daily mail inside me also wants to get my pitch fork out and name and shame....my sensible part of me does mostly agree with FD on this. That said I doubt anyone could sue either way based on someone posting a video of an alleged cheater and people commenting on it.
We essentially give up the right not be be seen on a videogame the moment we log into a public instance in a videogame. Imo of course.
I do chuckle at the comments from some who say the community here are not the cheaters..... Sure some , most even, won't be recognisable people here but the 5:1 cheat caught plenty of these forums. (Some of who have the stones to have been part of the git gud brigade and who moan about cheaters and cloggers themselves )

Just like some moaning about people hiding in solo have been seen playing many hrs in solo. Hypocrisy is popular as ever here as anywhere else

 

[Frank]

I have zero interest in PvP in ED... but CQC is great. only problem is, like so many things in ED, FD got 80% of the way there then let it rot

it needs more content, and some proper events imo, double XP days as well as the odd new map chucked into rotation. I was convinced a couple of planet side maps would have been thrown in back in the day, maybe even an SRV combat one, if only to act as a sales pitch for people to buy horizons. Also needs options for lobbies for friends as well as bots tbh so you can get a game (i have never ever yet got into a game of KOTH and only managed half a dozen TDM games, normally its FFA or bust)

but mechanically.... there is not much to hate in CQC from my gaming POV

I completely agree with you.

The best way to avoid fighting against someone who uses cheats is to avoid cheaters. Arranged PVP is the best way to do that. I wish there was some way to arrange CQC get-togethers with good honest folks you know and trust. Not anything that will increment your stats in any way, just for a bit of fun

 

[Rick6549]

I'm thinking more along the lines of, since most of the game data is processed on client, FDev can't easily fix this problem without altering major parts of the game's code which may affect/break either the P2P performance, or even the game itself.

Or who knows, maybe what ever is needed to snoop around on our clients might break some kind of privacy laws somwhere in the US, Europe or Australiasia?



Basically, if you make a multiplayer game that doesn't go through a central or regional server, you've already entered the fight with one arm tied behind your back......

.... and the other glued to your face.....

It reminds me how easy it is to cheat in payday 2

 

[[VR] M4st0d0n]

In many other games you could check your multiplayer partners connexion quality and ping.

You cant have a satisfying encounter with someone 2000 ms of ping away, be there in the main game or in CQC, regardless of how imaginative lag compensation is.

 

[joshman72nd]

iv only seen ai cheat.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dHdsYrmKnM

 

[Rick6549]

iv only seen ai cheat.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dHdsYrmKnM

Woah

 

[Nomad-01]

Ran into another cheater today... and there is a video of a well known PVPer using hacks now.

There’s more to that story if it is who I think you are referring too. Don’t let that video fool you because it did fool a lot of people. Always too sides remember.

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Well, doing my honest pirate buisness in my trusty "The Emperors Defiance" Piracycutter i encountered quite some weird things in this current community goal.

1. Uninterdictable t9 and aspX. They werent close to a planet or anything just could not interdict them.
2. A krait mk II killing half of my 8k shields with resistances (lowest being 30%) with DRAG MUNITION missiles in seconds.
3. A Corvette being faster than my Cutter.

Dont say outright it was cheating.. but you gotta say its quite suspicous.

Did i report them? No. Why? Cause by now im convinced Frontier doesnt care or does NOT KNOW how to properly detect them. One of those 2 things.

Fly dangerous commanders.

Without any video these observations are virtually worthless.

1) Where were these two ships (there are other situations where ships cannot be pulled)? Where they being pulled by someone else?
2) How do you know they were only using drag munition missiles? How many PIPs did you have in SYS? 30% is pretty low resistance wise, what were your others?
3) How fast is your Cutter?

Considering the possibilities under legit engineering none of it may be suspicious at all and yet you expect anyone to take your scare mongering at face value.

 

[Einar Donarsson]

Without any video these observations are virtually worthless.

1) Where were these two ships (there are other situations where ships cannot be pulled)? Where they being pulled by someone else?
2) How do you know they were only using drag munition missiles? How many PIPs did you have in SYS? 30% is pretty low resistance wise, what were your others?
3) How fast is your Cutter?

Considering the possibilities under legit engineering none of it may be suspicious at all and yet you expect anyone to take your scare mongering at face value.

You seem to be quite the aggressive type.

1. No they werent pulled by someone else, they were flying in a straight line towards the Station.
2. I always have 4 pips in Systems when i assume i get engaged. 30% is my lowest wich is thermal. The others are 55% and 57% with some legacyboosters.
3. My Cutter is fully grade 5 engineered and goes up to 470+ Boostspeed.

 

[Hermione Granger]

You seem to be quite the aggressive type.

1. No they werent pulled by someone else, they were flying in a straight line towards the Station.
2. I always have 4 pips in Systems when i assume i get engaged. 30% is my lowest wich is thermal. The others are 55% and 57% with some legacyboosters.
3. My Cutter is fully grade 5 engineered and goes up to 470+ Boostspeed.

Times like this are why I always encourage everyone to record their gameplay.

 

[Schmack]

Due to the gap between fully engineered specialty weapons/hulls/shields/performance and stock ships, it's hard to tell sometimes. You can still die in seconds from someone who isn't cheating, and you can drain your capacity over and over and not dent their shields, depending on your build.