The station actually told him that they revoked his docking rights. He couldn't see it because he wasn't in-game. You can see the station chatter in the logs he posted above.
200 credits bounty, 250M credits punishment
- Thread starter war4peace
- Start date
The station actually told him that they revoked his docking rights. He couldn't see it because he wasn't in-game. You can see the station chatter in the logs he posted above.
Well, in the end
I was in the game, I alt-tabbed back the second I heard the warning and the music changing.
But it is irrelevant whether I was in-game or not paying attention. The scan happened as my ship was entering the station, the ship was inside the station when they starting shooting at it. I never had time to turn around and GTFO, I was dead in four seconds.
19:44:23 - Docking request was granted
19:45:16 - Scanned for cargo (my ship was in the station entry point, going in)
19:45:16 - "You are wanted in this sector. Engaging."
19:45:16 - Docking denied
19:45:16 - Matthews City becomes hostile
19:45:16 - "Submit to justice, criminal."
19:45:23 - Station started shooting, as I was trying to maneuver my ship around
19:45:27 - Killed by Federal Security Service (Deadly Viper)
The first irony: Federation sees me as ally.
The second irony: This was my first ever bounty: 200 credits.
All things considered, it doesn't matter how much I lost, screw it, I'll take my Dolphin out again and explore some more, make more credits, no problem there. The takeaway here is (aside learning how to deal with this game mechanic) is the fact that is, hands down, bad design.
I was in the game, I alt-tabbed back the second I heard the warning and the music changing.
But it is irrelevant whether I was in-game or not paying attention. The scan happened as my ship was entering the station, the ship was inside the station when they starting shooting at it. I never had time to turn around and GTFO, I was dead in four seconds.
19:44:23 - Docking request was granted
19:45:16 - Scanned for cargo (my ship was in the station entry point, going in)
19:45:16 - "You are wanted in this sector. Engaging."
19:45:16 - Docking denied
19:45:16 - Matthews City becomes hostile
19:45:16 - "Submit to justice, criminal."
19:45:23 - Station started shooting, as I was trying to maneuver my ship around
19:45:27 - Killed by Federal Security Service (Deadly Viper)
The first irony: Federation sees me as ally.
The second irony: This was my first ever bounty: 200 credits.
All things considered, it doesn't matter how much I lost, screw it, I'll take my Dolphin out again and explore some more, make more credits, no problem there. The takeaway here is (aside learning how to deal with this game mechanic) is the fact that is, hands down, bad design.
Oh I can see now, thanks
so you fired upon a station, then proceeded to attempt to dock at a station owned by that faction?
you were wanted. more than just owing a simple fine. if you went to a station where you were not wanted this would not have happened.
to provide a better analogy than your paper littering false equivalence...
'while attempting to hack into a secure facility you instead discharged a laser blast setting off alarms and labeling you a wanted criminal. you then stroll into the main port of entry to "pay a fine" whereby you are identified and properly disposed of'
you were wanted. more than just owing a simple fine. if you went to a station where you were not wanted this would not have happened.
to provide a better analogy than your paper littering false equivalence...
'while attempting to hack into a secure facility you instead discharged a laser blast setting off alarms and labeling you a wanted criminal. you then stroll into the main port of entry to "pay a fine" whereby you are identified and properly disposed of'
OP, as frustrating as it can all be, you probably need to take a slight step back and have a think about things.
There seems to be a misconception there that's coming up in other places.
This is why I'm saying you need to have a step back and think about things - because you seem to be expecting that the game should not treat a bounty as a bounty. 'game treated a bounty as a bounty' is not really a legitimate gripe. The big question really is why did you think a bounty wouldn't be treated as a bounty.
Most of what happened to you really stems from that one point. If you were expecting a bounty to be treated as a bounty, would you still have gone and tried to dock normally at a station where the bounty was valid?
Not sure what's happened to leave you with the misconception about the nature of bounties. As far as I can recall (and have been able to double check) bounties have always been bounties, so this isn't something to do with something that had changed while you were away from the game.
As for the loss of all the exploration data - well... what made you think doing other stuff before going and handing in the exploration data was a good idea? The more you do before handing it in, the more risk you have of losing it. It's always been thus, and always will (barring a change by FD so that exploration data survives death).
If you don't want the same thing to happen again, then the best thing you can do is look at it all, understand what it was you did personally that contributed to the situation, and work out what you could do differently in future.
Plenty of salient advice from other cmdrs already to help you with that. Best of luck!
This doesn't actually make any sense. A bounty is money that's being offered as a reward for your death. In what way could there be an attempt to enforce payment of the bounty prior to ship destruction? - without your ship's destruction, then no one has done what's needed to claim the bounty.
There seems to be a misconception there that's coming up in other places.
A bounty is always a reason for ship destruction. That is literally what a bounty is. - it is a faction saying 'we are offering x amount of credits as a reward to anyone who 'kills' such and such a cmdr.'
If there's a price on your head, you can't just turn up to the faction who put the price on your head and pay them the money - they're not asking for money. They are saying they want you killed, and will pay a certain amount of money to whoever does it.
This is why I'm saying you need to have a step back and think about things - because you seem to be expecting that the game should not treat a bounty as a bounty. 'game treated a bounty as a bounty' is not really a legitimate gripe. The big question really is why did you think a bounty wouldn't be treated as a bounty.
Most of what happened to you really stems from that one point. If you were expecting a bounty to be treated as a bounty, would you still have gone and tried to dock normally at a station where the bounty was valid?
Not sure what's happened to leave you with the misconception about the nature of bounties. As far as I can recall (and have been able to double check) bounties have always been bounties, so this isn't something to do with something that had changed while you were away from the game.
As for the loss of all the exploration data - well... what made you think doing other stuff before going and handing in the exploration data was a good idea? The more you do before handing it in, the more risk you have of losing it. It's always been thus, and always will (barring a change by FD so that exploration data survives death).
If you don't want the same thing to happen again, then the best thing you can do is look at it all, understand what it was you did personally that contributed to the situation, and work out what you could do differently in future.
Plenty of salient advice from other cmdrs already to help you with that. Best of luck!
Usually once you are inside the station security can no longer scan you. I also don't understand how a Viper managed to kill you inside the station. I guess you had bad luck on top of your bad decisions.
The viper would simply have been the ship that dealt the final blow, the station would have already done the donkey work.
Does security follow you through the letterbox?
I often get scanned right as I enter/exit the station. I'm literally in the doorway and hear "scan detected".
1. Those cowboy movies... where criminals had bounties on their heads... to be brought "dead or alive". Claiming a bounty does not mandate the criminal to be dead.
2. If a bounty could only be claimed through death, then it would be impossible for the criminal to pay it.
And this is exactly the game mechanic I am disputing here, thank you.
Because bounties do not necessarily involve killing the criminal. Especially not if he's your ally. Furthermore, if a bounty is worth less than the ammo spent killing the criminal, it makes no sense to even bother. That is where the game logic breaks down.
The fact that it worked very well until a poorly-thought game mechanic got in the way
...and in the meantime expose a shallowly-developed game mechanic that should be changed to make more sense and better fit with logic.
You all got used to it and treat it like it being normal. Then someone from the outside comes along, gets hit by it and realizes it's stupid. However, older players have this defective game mechanic so ingrained in their way of playing that they dismiss the fresh pair of eyes as belonging to a noob who doesn't know any better. And so nobody is trying to better the game in this area, the same game mechanic remains and its only effect is being a trap for newbies.
Please note I am not trying to make this game mechanic go away, however I'm stating it has to be reworked in such a way that makes sense to everyone, which is:
- Be less cryptic ("Anonymous access" is not, by far, a clear message)
- Be more informative ("you have a bounty of X on your head, it mandates you be killed, pay it at a low security station")
- Not allow docking in stations belonging to the entity that put a bounty on your head, or at least mark the station with a certain color (red would look nice, don't you think?)
- Scale with bounty size (high bounty prompts immediate fire, low bounty has a delay of X seconds)
They can deal the final blow and momentum will take you the rest of the way through. I dare say as long as they can see you they can shoot you...
In any case, even if the viper hadn't fired the last shot the results would have been the same, but the station would have used it's god rays instead.
It's like I said, bad luck on top of bad decisions. If the scan would've started a second later he would still be alive. We would now read a rant about being transported to the next detention center though.
It does in elite.
Well not really, since we never die in Elite but it mandates ship destruction.
In the cowboy analogy you are the criminal who complains that his horse got shot.
understand scans at a station.
security ships do not have kill warrant scanners, they have manifest scanners. so when you hear 'scan detected' that has nothing to do with whether you have fines/bounties in other jurisdictions.
the reason you were detected was because a passive scan is all that is needed to determine local wanted status. you will not be notified of this taking place as all that is required is to target a ship and point in its general direction and complete the 3 levels of a passive scan: ID, health, status.
security ships do not have kill warrant scanners, they have manifest scanners. so when you hear 'scan detected' that has nothing to do with whether you have fines/bounties in other jurisdictions.
the reason you were detected was because a passive scan is all that is needed to determine local wanted status. you will not be notified of this taking place as all that is required is to target a ship and point in its general direction and complete the 3 levels of a passive scan: ID, health, status.
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OP: yep, the game's crime and punishment mechanic is messed up. And, aside from all the cute "it's your fault" replies from the fanbase, the only possible mistake you made is making this post and expecting rational replies!
FDev should have got the message a loooong time ago that so many things are out of balance just like this. But here (we) are. It hasn't changed.
FDev should have got the message a loooong time ago that so many things are out of balance just like this. But here (we) are. It hasn't changed.
And to my point. It's your fault OP. You shouldn't play the game the way you want. It's your fault. Game is perfect. There's nothing wrong with the punishment system. /sarcasm
Perhaps it's with the post itself where you simply blame the player maybe? IDK...
Get out of here with that.
We're insisting the pilot that alt tabbed out of the game when something was happening he didn't understand instead of maybe not doing that and paying attention to what was going on somehow has something to learn.
How dare we, indeed! Or whatever.
Yeah, there's just so much that went wrong here and it's OK but jeeze some responses here are just silly.
You're an extremely active member of this forum and I have no doubt whatsoever that you understood the difference on Day Zero. Like others here, I also followed the development of the C&P changes closely so by the time the update rolled out I knew how it all worked. Nonetheless I have seen thread after thread from newcomer and veteran alike where fines and bounties are repeatedly conflated, confused, or otherwise misunderstood, and the in-game communication about this stuff and its consequences is just terrible to the point of being counterproductive. If most players think the two things are the same, if they don't know what to expect will happen to them when they go to a station where they're wanted vs merely fined, if they don't know how and where to pay their fines vs bribe away their bounties vs "turn themselves in", etc; then the whole thing doesn't work.
I think "under the hood" most of the mechanisms are logical once you know them (although "Hot Modules" is basically a broken mechanic in its current state), but they are presented in-game very poorly and in some cases incorrectly. There are some easy things Frontier could have done and still should do if they want to make this game approachable without a wiki tab open at all times.