The Star Citizen Thread V10

[Dementropy]

The difference being FD sells stuff that exists whereas CIG sells stuff that doesn't exist and possibly may never exist, or by the time it exists it may be quite different from what was sold.

We call it "surprise mechanics."

For all the railing I've seen backers do against loot boxes and the practices of EA or Activision, CIG is not immune from similar criticism. They are not the humble-yet-plucky independent studio attempting to save PC gaming or bring back the popularity of space games. They are a company valued at over $250 million USD with 10% of the (parent) company owned by the Calders.

As someone put it the other day, without having delivered anything but promotional videos and the chance to watch or clip through development over the years, they have managed to turn"pledging" into their business model. Citizen Con tickets are going on sale - not to celebrate a game, but so people can have a tangible experience and gather as a large group therapy session to reassure themselves that the person they gave money knows where this train is going. How many of these have they had? And for what purpose?

We've witnessed reworks of ships and core mechanics. We've seen the original scope get expanded and pushed while things that aren't part of making a functioning game are inserted that serve absolutely no purpose, and break with later patches. Walkbacks and (to use a malapropism) refactoring do not lead me to believe that ship sales will stop after there is a release, soft or otherwise, and anything fun or fleshed-out has been framed in the future tense by Chris, CI, and backers alike for years.

The risks of crowdfunding are great, and one should never put in more than they can part with, but at some point this stopped being about a product, and became all about funding the funding model, with a very slow drip of something people can point to and say, "Look! I can do this now! I don't know what it means in the long run, and it doesn't seem like the Chairman does, either, but it's something!" And so CI are rewarded for simply doing their jobs (to what degree is debatable) with more funding.

But what's being shown, what's being pushed back, and what may eventually come out have not been nailed down, and when you open that final product, it may be something completely different from both the initial pitch or the implied dreams and theorycrafting that came with the mythical community vote(s) to expand the scope (that came with the caveat that they would deliver sooner rather than later).

Surprise!

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

What this thread needs is a proper starry-eyed SC advocate.

....

Thanks for telling me outright that I suck at this. Dude, I'm trying my best, but the pipelines only take me so far.

 

[n4p0l3on]

Since SQ42 is the current focus, it's no surprise that SC is almost silent. The question though is when SQ42 is going to become visible. We are six months into the year now. Six months till 2020. Surely something should rumble out of the station soon. It's been well over six months since the focus moved to SQ42. When will the hyping engage properly for SQ42. Autumn, Winter or Spring 2020 or should we prepare for a later delay?

remember when they said that developing one would help the other and vice versa? so the question would now be, where are the result? why both games are equally nowhere near finished?

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Thanks for telling me outright that I suck at this. Dude, I'm trying my best, but the pipelines only take me so far.

Have you tried being more positive?

 

[Agony_Aunt]

remember when they said that developing one would help the other and vice versa? so the question would now be, where are the result? why both games are equally nowhere near finished?

Remember when CIG said SQ42 was just around the corner?

Remember when they said that if funding stopped they could finish SC with money from the sales of SQ42.

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

Have you tried being more positive?

You know me, I'm always kind and lenient with the Unbelievers. I know it is not hate that drives them - it's just surprise disappointment.

 

[Skizomeuh]

We've been told Erin joined to help building SQ42, we've been told SQ42 is not the priority because most of the tech needed is needed for SC too, we've been told they're 300/400/500+, scattered around the globe so they can work 24/24 and on both fronts fingers in the nose.

We've been told many things, many were contradictory, many revealed to be not quite true... Always serving the "let's keep CIG under a good light" narrative.

So no since long they're far beyond the line that would allow them the benefit of the doubt. No hypocrisy in me blaming them for things other studios may be guilty of. They sure have a technical debt, but for me they also have a colossal moral debt too.

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

In quite a recent video the devs said they can’t fit any more into the system. I think they’ve hit a road block and I’m not confident they can get around it.

 

[Goose4291]

What’s technically known as burying your head in the sand.

Not really, just not going to squander my time arguing with a wall of 'lol buy an 1dri5' over a game I have neither emotionally or financially invested in.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

In quite a recent video the devs said they can’t fit any more into the system. I think they’ve hit a road block and I’m not confident they can get around it.

Of course they can. They just need more time and money. So, buy an Idris!

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Not really, just not going to squander my time arguing with a wall of 'lol buy an 1dri5' over a game I have neither emotionally or financially invested in.

You do understand the whole buy an Idris is basically a joke and not meant seriously right? It comes from the time when the Idris was the most expensive ship available (but that didn't stop CIG topping that!) and absoloutely shocking that they would charge so much for something... well, anything. And here we are, how many years later? 6 is it since the Idris first went on sale? And its still not actually flyable!

Every year, CIG whip up a bit of marketing or place the model in game, and whip up some excitement with it, but you can't actually fly it. One of the theories is that its too big to be flyable with the current tech, which is why none of the really big ships are in game yet and flyable.

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

Of course they can. They just need more time and money. So, buy an Idris!

I could probably push to a modders handbook.

 

[askavir]

I don't think SC is a case of being developed by an "Evil" company, it's more a case of "we can't commit to a set number of features for the initial launch and keep changing things and pushing feature creep, ending up getting ourselves into a gargantuan, most likely irrecoverable project management mess" company.

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

I don't think SC is a case of being developed by an "Evil" company, it's more a case of "we can't commit to a set number of features for the initial launch and keep changing things and pushing feature creep, ending up getting ourselves into a gargantuan, most likely irrecoverable project management mess" company.

And whilst we fail spectacularly get rich in the process!

 

[Tippis]

remember when they said that developing one would help the other and vice versa? so the question would now be, where are the result? why both games are equally nowhere near finished?

That's not really much of a question, though.
It's a bit like asking why the local lottery company hasn't delivered their tomato harvest yet (and whether their talk of using polonium as fertiliser is indicative of their prowess in the cultivation of berries).

 

[askavir]

And whilst we fail spectacularly get rich in the process!

Well it's not like they're pointing guns at people's heads and saying "buy our imaginary ships for our not yet existing game for thousands of dollars"... People are free to do whatever they want with their thousands of dollars, it's their own choice but ultimately also their own responsability.

If I would decide to shell out a thousand bucks for an not-yet-existing item for a not-yet-a-game, it is I who am to blame. It's not like they're being victims of false advertising or scam, those people know that the game doesn't exist yet, and that they're buying things that are just imaginary at this point.

 

[Tippis]

It's not like they're being victims of false advertising or scam, those people know that the game doesn't exist yet

This is highly debatable in some instances…

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

Well it's not like they're pointing guns at people's heads and saying "buy our imaginary ships for our not yet existing game for thousands of dollars"... People are free to do whatever they want with their thousands of dollars, it's their own choice but ultimately also their own responsability.

If I would decide to shell out a thousand bucks for an not-yet-existing item for a not-yet-a-game, it is I who am to blame. It's not like they're being victims of false advertising or scam, those people know that the game doesn't exist yet, and that they're buying things that are just imaginary at this point.

Unless you’ve created a ton of propaganda full to the brim with broken promises and lies.

 

[Asp Explorer]

Unless you’ve created a ton of propaganda full to the brim with broken promises and lies.

And repeatedly state "the game is basically complete at this point" and "Feature X is just around the corner"

 

[MTBFritz]

I was amused by the recent post detailing the unfulfilled KS goals. It crosses my mind that the backers are playing a single system pre release. Transportation is available. Command and control is exercised but mostly by forum postings and meanwhile we meow like cats at each other as if we were pets.

Since SQ42 is the current focus, it's no surprise that SC is almost silent. The question though is when SQ42 is going to become visible. We are six months into the year now. Six months till 2020. Surely something should rumble out of the station soon. It's been well over six months since the focus moved to SQ42. When will the hyping engage properly for SQ42. Autumn, Winter or Spring 2020 or should we prepare for a later delay?

Come now you didnt REALLY THINK 2020 was a realistic goal for SQ42 did you? Its CIG we are talking about after all

I don't think SC is a case of being developed by an "Evil" company, it's more a case of "we can't commit to a set number of features for the initial launch and keep changing things and pushing feature creep, ending up getting ourselves into a gargantuan, most likely irrecoverable project management mess" company.

Evil never was a term used to describe CIG. That was used by the SC defenders and "moral policemen" to derail arguments and give it all a ridiculous spin. But terms like "incompetent" and "greedy" certainly are applicable.