ANNOUNCEMENT September Update out now!

Ozric · Sep 22, 2019

Do you think they do internal testing on the live server?

Remember when we do betas that Exploration data isn't brought over because it is stored on a separate server. Lots of things are stored in lots of different places and something can not be an issue when testing, but then when you hook it into the live servers something you couldn't have noticed springs up.

I'm not saying it's the right way to do it, or suggest a better way of doing it. I just don't like QA always getting the blame when something goes wrong

Ebel · Sep 22, 2019

Ozric said:
...something you couldn't have noticed springs up...

Couldn't have noticed? Really? If they knew and brought this live they should be fired. In my line of work I would have been. On the other hand, I am "giving the benifit of the doubt" and ascribing it to no type of meaningful testing.

Tyres O'Flaherty · Sep 22, 2019

In my days of system testing, your test environment was an exact mirror of your live/production one.

Bugs still crept in mind you, normally if version control went a bit awry, but the bulk of stuff got caught before being pushed live.

Just an observation...

Ebel · Sep 22, 2019

Tyres O'Flaherty said:
In my days of system testing, your test environment was an exact mirror of your live/production one.

Bugs still crept in mind you, normally if version control went a bit awry, but the bulk of stuff got caught before being pushed live.

Just an observation...

Yeah, I don't sweat the little stuff that will of course pop up.

Ozric, they had to dumpster dive for the remains of this steaming pile.

Soron Silin · Sep 22, 2019

Ozric said:
Do you think they do internal testing on the live server?

Remember when we do betas that Exploration data isn't brought over because it is stored on a separate server. Lots of things are stored in lots of different places and something can not be an issue when testing, but then when you hook it into the live servers something you couldn't have noticed springs up.

I'm not saying it's the right way to do it, or suggest a better way of doing it. I just don't like QA always getting the blame when something goes wrong

That's different from what you said last time.

Every QA team I've met do a great job and I expect that the FDev team are the same, given enough time and resources. The fact remains that they didn't find these bugs. I don't know why that is; I have no idea what their processes are but, as a developer, the first thing to ask when you find a new bug is "how can I make sure this never happens again?" QA must be the same. If a bug slips through the net, especially one as damaging as these, Frontier need to look at their processes and decide what went wrong and how to fix it. Just like in airplane maintenance, ego has no place in software development. Nobody should point fingers but everyone should recognise when something has gone wrong.

If Frontier had a beta test then either these would have been spotted or not. If they included the upgrade process in the test, then they absolutely would have been spotted. They just need to copy the existing database over and start from there.

If they had had a beta test and this had still gone wrong, then they would have community members batting for them, saying that these problems definitely didn't crop up in the beta test and this must be a problem with the upgrade.

Diagbar · Sep 22, 2019

Ozric said:
Do you think they do internal testing on the live server?

Remember when we do betas that Exploration data isn't brought over because it is stored on a separate server. Lots of things are stored in lots of different places and something can not be an issue when testing, but then when you hook it into the live servers something you couldn't have noticed springs up.

I'm not saying it's the right way to do it, or suggest a better way of doing it. I just don't like QA always getting the blame when something goes wrong

that is, sorry, in your opinion. is it very difficult to make a copy of the game world on a separate server and install an update for the test there? I understand that it’s your duty as a moderator to protect fd, but ... are you serious now?

Ozric · Sep 22, 2019

It's not my duty. I say what I think.

Diagbar said:
that is, sorry, in your opinion. is it very difficult to make a copy of the game world on a separate server and install an update for the test there? I understand that it’s your duty as a moderator to protect fd, but ... are you serious now?

Soron Silin said:
If Frontier had a beta test then either these would have been spotted or not. If they included the upgrade process in the test, then they absolutely would have been spotted. They just need to copy the existing database over and start from there.

If they had had a beta test and this had still gone wrong, then they would have community members batting for them, saying that these problems definitely didn't crop up in the beta test and this must be a problem with the upgrade.

They use and outdated snapshot for the betas and they never bring exploration data and a few other bits across. We had a very similar thing to the engineering display issue, with the Codex records not displaying the correct information from the database in the December release. It all looked fine in the beta, because it wasn't trying to pull through live data.

The only real difference is that it took a day to get the engineering one fixed and 6 months for the Codex one

Again, all just from my own observations of testing the game for 5 years.

Soron Silin · Sep 22, 2019

Ozric said:
They use and outdated snapshot for the betas and they never bring exploration data and a few other bits across. We had a very similar thing to the engineering display issue, with the Codex records not displaying the correct information from the database in the December release. It all looked fine in the beta, because it wasn't trying to pull through live data.

Then they need to do the job properly. Not a public beta but a closed and supported one, maybe even with different phases for different tests. Maybe a few dozen testers that have signed an NDA and have access to a private bug database,

Chuckgofer · Sep 22, 2019

If it's not QA not catching bugs, then it's Devs not fixing bugs or management planning poorly. There really isn't an explanation of what IS happening that doesn't Necessitate change.

Diagbar · Sep 22, 2019

Ozric said:
They use and outdated snapshot for the betas and they never bring exploration data and a few other bits across. We had a very similar thing to the engineering display issue, with the Codex records not displaying the correct information from the database in the December release. It all looked fine in the beta, because it wasn't trying to pull through live data.

The only real difference is that it took a day to get the engineering one fixed and 6 months for the Codex one

Again, all just from my own observations of testing the game for 5 years.

as I said, if the PD posted the September update on a public beta test, there wouldn’t be such a wave of indignation. I do not condemn the fd for the fact that they had errors during the work, but, it is completely incomprehensible to me why the fd threw the assembly with such obvious and serious errors into the release.

Cryvern · Sep 23, 2019

Thundar_ said:
Harness that anger Cmdr, then kill some Thargoids with it

Being given 400 Arx for doing exactly the same things you did before the Sept update is something to thank Frontier for is it not?
Choosing to attain the weekly Arx limit is a Cmdr's choice, as is buying a paint job with real-world currency. Doing the former might save you some of the latter (that was not an option before this update).

Enjoy the black Cmdrs.

It's really easy to hit the cap, you don't need a whole week, 3 days if you play it moderately. If frontier think they can bore me to submission waiting for the weekly reset to make me put money into the game by making me invest 3 months worth of gameplay to buy one thing for one ship, they are dead wrong. If anything I'm even more inclined not to waste anymore money with ED. They are not going to get away with scummy monetization practices, ship customizations should have been a staple in the game from the start and only now they are making it more accessible. And let's get real here, the paintjobs for most of the ships are ridiculously bad, uninspired and such a low effort job. Nowadays they just copy and paste the same pattern to other ships and expect me to waste several weeks of my like to buy them separetly. Stop being so nice to them and start pressuring to improve the game. Do you honestly think that in 6 years of the game existence we are in a good state? Don't you think the game is underdeveloped? Almost like it has gigantic potencial that is being wasted? Fine if they want focus on microtransactions and nickle and dime it's player, then I'll be dam sure not to let them get away with it. If they want my money then I want to see massive improvements and faster developments and so should you. Nothing is going to improve if you white knight for them, they only care about profit, frontier is a company let's not forget, so changes are only coming if we, the community, force them to do it.

CMDR Disco Cat · Sep 23, 2019

Diptera said:
In rude health means "very healthy" - it's not a negative thing.

Well then, I learned some more English today. Rude isn't rude when it comes to health ? I'm curious about the history that led to that expression.

Thanks

Tyres O'Flaherty · Sep 23, 2019

It's an idiom but I can't find its origins. Yes, in this sense it means "sturdy" - just one of the myriad of confusing phrases in the English language

CMDR Nathan Atterlein · Sep 23, 2019

Cryvern said:
Nothing is going to improve if you white knight for them, they only care about profit, frontier is a company let's not forget, so changes are only coming if we, the community, force them to do it.

Pregnancy takes nine months, unlocking a ship kit takes one month less. Gaining arghs at this rate is nothing but a clever way to pull in more whales. It's not nice of them, or anything. FD isn't a person. It's a company you payed 2x full price to have fun. Don't thank them for utterly messing up.

Kekkonshiki · Sep 23, 2019

Servers are going down at 13:00 UTC for a patch!

Tzebra · Sep 23, 2019

All else is moot, when you have coffee.
Time for nice Cuban cigar, a hot cup of coffee, while watching the soft rain fall across the small botanical garden.

Commander Onesimus · Sep 23, 2019

Hello,
Does anyone know who long the servers will be down for?

YukeHunt · Sep 23, 2019

Whatever happened to the 'Beta Test Servers' that they rolled out 2 years ago, just before the 'Horizons' update - they caught (AND FIXED) 70% more bugs that were not discovered during 'dev testing'!

Fetch back betas, so we can real life test the next update - then we can report any 'fluff ups' (use your own expletive), before it goes live and we end up with this mess we are in now!!

Kekkonshiki · Sep 23, 2019

Commander Onesimus said:
Hello,
Does anyone know who long the servers will be down for?

They didn't say but the moment the clock hit 13:00 UTC the patch was available and it seems to be the same size as the original Sept update. Downloading it still.

This is as of 13:35 UTC

Lightspeed · Sep 23, 2019

Cmdr Thrust says the green STORE tab is not an improvement