Haters gonna hate

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Oh man, I bought JWE on the reason that it will be a semi-decent game and that I can support FDev. And actually it was up to the point of the totally broken mission system. Broken by design and riddled with bugs.

But now they have cancelled CGs and interstellar initiatives too? Wow...
The thing with Elite that it has shed all the leaders that had any sort of vision for the game. I feel like the core features of the game are still unique and special, having said that, I think the so called New Era will be delayed and broken. I will follow the launch with great interest, but I fear there will be no reason to actually buy it.

What it makes me wonder why the player count (according to Steam Charts) seems to be stable - I guess it is the influx of new players. And I can understand as for them the experience is totally worth it.

Yeah i was quite into jpog so jwe was a dream come true. Or not, it ended up turning out just like elite, above average graphics and sound, bare bones gameplay implying theres a dimension of stuff missing, and a dose of misleading marketing to complete the picture (they actually hinted at a story in the campaign, it was no more than expensive commentary). The guests were the biggest disappointment. Might give it another go actually think turning off the day night cycle feature might make it feel less painful tha theyre just ants.

Also to the op, i lasted about 7 and a half minutes before i turned off the stream. White knights i bet have no idea what theyre abusing forum goers for. Likers gonna like (or will go for any reason they can abuse others on forums and not get moderated).

 

[bitstorm]

Also to the op, i lasted about 7 and a half minutes before i turned off the stream. White knights i bet have no idea what theyre abusing forum goers for. Likers gonna like (or will go for any reason they can abuse others on forums and not get moderated).

I guess Frontier will know the stats on view times.

But just taking your example. It seems reasonable that if you'd had enough after 7.5 minutes that you might click the thumbs down before leaving.

That is three rough scenarios now that could result in early downvotes, all I think reasonable.

 

[Stigbob]

Yeah i was quite into jpog so jwe was a dream come true. Or not, it ended up turning out just like elite, above average graphics and sound, bare bones gameplay implying theres a dimension of stuff missing, and a dose of misleading marketing to complete the picture (they actually hinted at a story in the campaign, it was no more than expensive commentary). The guests were the biggest disappointment. Might give it another go actually think turning off the day night cycle feature might make it feel less painful tha theyre just ants.

Also to the op, i lasted about 7 and a half minutes before i turned off the stream. White knights i bet have no idea what theyre abusing forum goers for. Likers gonna like (or will go for any reason they can abuse others on forums and not get moderated).

The whole abuse thing tends to hinge on requiring the person doing it being very angry about the video game, which just isn't something most people ever do. Whiteknights being fans of the game have no reasons to be angry.

Its just optional entertainment, if you dislike it move on to something you actually like. The alternative is making yourself angry over something really trivial, when other people laugh at that or don't take that anger seriously then it just gets worse.

That's why you only ever see the truly toxic stuff from the haters, nobody else is getting that mad about video games.

 

[MUSKETEER]

I really stopped watching their streams long ago (I clicked at one a month or two ago and I could only bare to watch for 2-3 minutes)... there is nothing exciting to look forward to anymore.
I don't downvote something I don't watch.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

The whole abuse thing tends to hinge on requiring the person doing it being very angry about the video game, which just isn't something most people ever do. Whiteknights being fans of the game have no reasons to be angry.

Its just optional entertainment, if you dislike it move on to something you actually like. The alternative is making yourself angry over something really trivial, when other people laugh at that or don't take that anger seriously then it just gets worse.

That's why you only ever see the truly toxic stuff from the haters, nobody else is getting that mad about video games.

I see players and frontier as 2 different things. Frontier are making a living of us, so the equation is a little bit different. Having said, if frontier spoke to the community as white knights speak to their peers im sure the effect and response would be the same.

Also, as it happens i finally read old ducks post.. so hes puffing up the white knits by soapboxing that his method of pressing dislike on a stream is better than anyone elses disliking style, and people who press dislike differently should in exasperation just go away? Seriously this not too much irony? Im awestruck

 

[znôrt]

Well I previously mentioned two perfectly valid reasons why you might downvote within the first 5 minutes

i still don't get it. since when do people need valid reasons to downvote anything? more specifically, how is that anybody else's business?

even if he were right he would be just making a moral statement which doesn't necessarily apply to anybody but himself. and i completely understand he was miffed and wanted to rant, happens to us all, but there is no issue here, just hurt feelings. okay, message received, sorry to hear and all that but he really doesn't have a valid case.

 

[Dutchman141]

I don't up or down vote what I don't watch, like the fdev streams, but I think that those downvotes, how appropriate or not, come from somewhere.
It's not like people watch ED streams and downvote them just for the fun of it, there's a reason why they do that and imho fdev is responsible for that reason because various things that have been discussed here time and time again.

When you treat your playerbase as fdev does then you can expect these sorta things.

 

[Stigbob]

I see players and frontier as 2 different things. Frontier are making a living of us, so the equation is a little bit different. Having said, if frontier spoke to the community as white knights speak to their peers im sure the effect and response would be the same.

There's real players, forum undead and the comedy video gaming casualties. I tend to tailor what I say to who I say it to.

Also, as it happens i finally read old ducks post.. so hes puffing up the white knits by soapboxing that his method of pressing dislike on a stream is better than anyone elses disliking style, and people who press dislike differently should in exasperation just go away? Seriously this not too much irony? Im awestruck

He's blazing his own trail.

 

[[VR] optimal_909]

The whole abuse thing tends to hinge on requiring the person doing it being very angry about the video game, which just isn't something most people ever do. Whiteknights being fans of the game have no reasons to be angry.

Its just optional entertainment, if you dislike it move on to something you actually like. The alternative is making yourself angry over something really trivial, when other people laugh at that or don't take that anger seriously then it just gets worse.

That's why you only ever see the truly toxic stuff from the haters, nobody else is getting that mad about video games.

As an ex-white knight (I liked the original Engineers, defended the game during the beigegate and other controversies), I moved on long ago. However, no other space game comes close to the core features of Elite, and this makes me keep coming back - hoping to be positively disappointed and triggering me to reinstall the game.

It is so sad to see the one step forward two steps back biowaste show, and really, all we can do is to debate an empty stream with an SJW feature.

 

[[VR] optimal_909]

Yeah i was quite into jpog so jwe was a dream come true. Or not, it ended up turning out just like elite, above average graphics and sound, bare bones gameplay implying theres a dimension of stuff missing, and a dose of misleading marketing to complete the picture (they actually hinted at a story in the campaign, it was no more than expensive commentary). The guests were the biggest disappointment. Might give it another go actually think turning off the day night cycle feature might make it feel less painful tha theyre just ants.

Also to the op, i lasted about 7 and a half minutes before i turned off the stream. White knights i bet have no idea what theyre abusing forum goers for. Likers gonna like (or will go for any reason they can abuse others on forums and not get moderated).

I think Elite had a lot of substance, but it was cut adrift. I believe the tides turned around the Salome event. Ever since Drew abandoned ship, the lore and on-game events, story stalled. Shortly afterwards (?), Brookes left too and we haven't seen Braben since the Frontier Expo. The mad-hat man was just a technocrat, but at least someone was at the helm.

Now Elite looks like a house with all lights on, but nobody inside.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

I think Elite had a lot of substance, but it was cut adrift. I believe the tides turned around the Salome event. Ever since Drew abandoned ship, the lore and on-game events, story stalled. Shortly afterwards (?), Brookes left too and we haven't seen Braben since the Frontier Expo. The mad-hat man was just a technocrat, but at least someone was at the helm.

Now Elite looks like a house with all lights on, but nobody inside.

Your post is so on topic because its exactly that sentiment that makes people err, this post. You're not the only one to notice this im sure.

My reading was just around 2.4 it all collapsed and became different. Was it the end of 2017? That's when they went away one day and came back a different entity, yeah and I thought exactly that too the wizard of oz and without the man behind the curtain.

The point is to land on your feet however we're here for fun, so pending any transformations by frontier (don't hold you breath but leave the door open), you can only accept that frontier really isn't the chosen one any more. Even as much as I love sparring with the chivalry here the topic isn't worth the battles anymore.

 

[Patrick_68000]

Criticism is necessary if it is constructive.

Hate is not mandatory.

 

[Stigbob]

Hate is not mandatory.

Misery loves company, so from the perspective of a hater it most definitely is.

 

[Tharrn]

Do white knights get a special paint job or decal? Asking for a friend.

 

[M00ka]

Hate is not mandatory.

Hate might not be mandatory but it can be self perpetuating.

 

[Stigbob]

I think Elite had a lot of substance, but it was cut adrift. I believe the tides turned around the Salome event. Ever since Drew abandoned ship, the lore and on-game events, story stalled. Shortly afterwards (?), Brookes left too and we haven't seen Braben since the Frontier Expo. The mad-hat man was just a technocrat, but at least someone was at the helm.

Now Elite looks like a house with all lights on, but nobody inside.

My take on it is that after Horizons went down pretty badly with a fair few people they reassessed release schedule, pricing point and financial viability. Which they told us was a possibility way back at kickstarter.

The 2020/1 paid DLC reflects that change. In that it took longer either through more time to become worth the outlay or as a switch from seasons in advance to compete season available outright at the point of sale. Or both.

Its all looking good to me, the worst outcome would have been what you've got is all it'll ever be. But when I bought the game I based my decision on being happy with what it was at the time I clicked buy, so everything we've had since (and to come) is a bonus and a positive thing.

Perspective.

 

[Stigbob]

Do white knights get a special paint job or decal? Asking for a friend.

Oddly enough they gave me all the black Friday ones as a surprise freebie .

 

[bitstorm]

The whole abuse thing tends to hinge on requiring the person doing it being very angry about the video game, which just isn't something most people ever do. Whiteknights being fans of the game have no reasons to be angry.

Its just optional entertainment, if you dislike it move on to something you actually like. The alternative is making yourself angry over something really trivial, when other people laugh at that or don't take that anger seriously then it just gets worse.

That's why you only ever see the truly toxic stuff from the haters, nobody else is getting that mad about video games.

I don't agree at all.

I honestly believe that the quickest way to turn a thread toxic is to dismiss criticism out of hand, pretend there's no issue and apportion all blame to the poster for being at fault.

It's a pattern you see over an over again here and the people constantly doing this are contributing just as much to toxicity as the frustrated dude posting a rant in the heat of the moment does.

The way to make this place less toxic is to try to listen to the criticism, regardless of whether you like the poster's tone or not (not always easy). Assume good faith and try to address it as something legit.

 

[Stigbob]

I don't agree at all.

I honestly believe that the quickest way to turn a thread toxic is to dismiss criticism out of hand, pretend there's no issue and apportion all blame to the poster for being at fault.

It's a pattern you see over an over again here.

The way to make this place less toxic is to listen to all criticism, regardless of whether you like the poster's tone or not. And address it as something legit.

A pattern I see is angry ex-players who can't move on for whatever reason repeating each others trivial video gaming gripes without any fact checking whatsoever. Which isn't really feedback worth reading unless you fancy having a laugh.

It does very neatly explain downvoting a stream before it even starts though.

 

[bitstorm]

I think Elite had a lot of substance, but it was cut adrift. I believe the tides turned around the Salome event. Ever since Drew abandoned ship, the lore and on-game events, story stalled. Shortly afterwards (?), Brookes left too and we haven't seen Braben since the Frontier Expo. The mad-hat man was just a technocrat, but at least someone was at the helm.

Now Elite looks like a house with all lights on, but nobody inside.

FWIW (probably not much) I'm pretty sure Drew didn't abandon ship.

If you ever watch his weekly ED stream (you should!) you'll occasionally hear him talk about how he's sent off emails to Frontier offering to write some stuff but gets no response back. (paraphrasing there from memory, but it's not that Drew isn't/hasn't offered)

IMHO Formidine Rift/Salome was ED's peak of interactive story telling, sure there's probably a number of complains folk may have about these events but they both did so much to engage the community in the game. (both Drew creations obv)