As much as I understand the thought process of increasing the radius of animals to fix other issues (we know it's been increased because I noticed in 2 different updates that shelter navigation got progressively worse), I have to ask if it's really the best solution? A majority of the reason listed for this change hasn't even been fixed by it, since you can look around the forum and see that these issues still exist in the game today (a notable example being animals escaping through wall/barriers). Surely a fix must exist that doesn't include making other parts of the game worse
Please make animal hitboxes smaller
- Thread starter Nioell
- Start date
I'm really not sure I understand how larger hitboxes are supposed to have improved performance and stability. I haven't noticed even a slight difference in either since the hitboxes were resized. Like Dinocanid said above, the issues that this resizing decision are supposed to have fixed/reduced are all still present in the game. Even the atuomatic boxing issue still happens, especially with primates. The escaping through walls bug is actually worse now than it was before hitboxes were resized. Anyways, if there has to be a trade-off, I'd personally rather have functional shelters and habitats than an unnoticeable reduction in the issues listed.
I agree, this is so weird. Papyrus and elephant grass for example should not have collision at all, imo. Animals should be able to walk right through those types of plants.
Thinking about Kolikokoli's idea of a "passage mark" or "passage way", what if there was an animal path, just like we have keeper paths and guest paths. And the only behavior the animal engages in when on the path is a "walk forward" behavior. This path could be used on entrances to user made animal shelters like stables, stalls and other types of indoor holding. When an animal is on an animal path it will not try to turn around, lay down, rear up, or any other type of behavior that requires the animals full hit box.
And maybe there would have to be some minimum length for an animal path, like three sections long or something like that. But I think that would be okay. And not sure what the path texture or color should be (maybe a sand or dirt color), but it would still be an obvious path so we can see where we are laying it. It would be up to us to make sure on any shelter we build that the entrance is tall enough, and the interior area is large enough for the animal to turn around to be able to again engage with the path and walk forward out of the shelter.
I guess the basic idea is that an animal's hit box requirement is turned off when the animal is on this path and it's only option is to move straight forward. And maybe the paths would have to be one directional so we might have to have both an entrance and an exit (or two paths side by side, one in and one out). I think most animals would fit on the standard path width.
Anyway, I guess that's the idea. Create a path where any animal's hit box requirements are turned off when on the path, and its only option is to walk forward (hope Frontier sees this post).
I would prefer smaller Hitboxes but this would be great if the Hitboxes never get changed. Currently I need to transport every Bactrian Camel that was outside of the Enclosure to another Part of the Enclosure myself and this would be a great Solution where Camels don't need to wait for a Eternity if I didn't notice that they got some medical Care. This would also finally allow them to use their Boxes that where intended as Sleeping Areas
To preface, I am totally on-side with those who want the hitboxes to be smaller, but I think this initial statement I've quoted is sufficient to express what I'm going to say; unless any of us are game developers of the same calibre as those who work for Frontier, "not understanding" should be enough to take the devs word for it.
I immediately stopped worrying about this issue as soon as Chante posted that, because I am not in any way knowledgeable enough to argue the point. I absolutely hope we can get smaller hitboxes in some way down the line, but I'm willing to accept that the people paid to deal with this sort of thing probably have a good reason as to why things are the way they are.
(also, I apologise Valinor, this is not intended to be directed at you specifically, which is why I cut your post down to this one sentence, it just helped me illustrate what I wanted to say
).
While I wasn't worried about this issue, imo this issue was done/settled with Chante's post.
They can solve a lot of issues by doing this and from my POV, if this helps a lot of people play the game with less crashes/CPU issues etc. - I'll accept this.
Even if I don't like it.
I have no knowledge about programming regarding the Cobra Engine, so I'm personally not going to make any suggestions.
Besides I think every suggestion I could think of, would require an overhaul - which already stated - is not expected to happen. I think we just need to trust if there's a different solution, the programmers will improve on this.
In short: Don't like it but I think we just have to deal with this. (really a shame, because for a lot of animals the shelter doesn't look that great)
I'm not a big fan of this idea. Sounds a bit like an escalator-principle or an automated system, wouldn't this look very "unnatural"? And doesn't this require multiple overhauls? First things that come in mind: Pathing/habitat/animal behaviour (for all animals?)/staff behaviour.
I would like to add my voice to the choir on this one.
I understand that making the hit boxes smaller could cause all the issues frontier have listed but I am disheartened to here that they aren't considering overhauling that game mechanic right now. I think this is possibly the biggest complaint I hear about the game currently and I genuinely thought that frontier would be working on a fix. In the past most of the biggest issues have always been tackled by the teams and I have a lot of respect for that but maybe that has also upped my expectations too.
It is an issue that actually affects the largest part of the game for me. In my current zoo I have literally had to scrap the last 5 cool habitat ideas I had and "settle" for a poor version of the exhibit. As an example I wanted to add some more space for the Komodo Dragon habitat I was working on so I made a tube that easily fit around the Dragon and then some. I spent ages carefully carving a tunnel on a small mound and it looked SO COOL! I was so proud of it but I had forgot that the animals need to be able to walk through it sideways. Would have been fine with it if it was a crab tbf. Anyways, long story short it is now a huge hill with a massive tunnel underneath because I had to settle for it.
I am not the guy who moans about everything. I love the series and frontier have done a great job with it. I always want them to know that. I just want their great game to be even greater. The mantra "simulation evolved" always sticks with me so I want to add my voice saying "If you want to improve your game this would go a long way" I know it is difficult to focus on something as big as this when you also have to think about releasing DLC that makes it worth it for you to continue developing the game.
I understand that making the hit boxes smaller could cause all the issues frontier have listed but I am disheartened to here that they aren't considering overhauling that game mechanic right now. I think this is possibly the biggest complaint I hear about the game currently and I genuinely thought that frontier would be working on a fix. In the past most of the biggest issues have always been tackled by the teams and I have a lot of respect for that but maybe that has also upped my expectations too.
It is an issue that actually affects the largest part of the game for me. In my current zoo I have literally had to scrap the last 5 cool habitat ideas I had and "settle" for a poor version of the exhibit. As an example I wanted to add some more space for the Komodo Dragon habitat I was working on so I made a tube that easily fit around the Dragon and then some. I spent ages carefully carving a tunnel on a small mound and it looked SO COOL! I was so proud of it but I had forgot that the animals need to be able to walk through it sideways. Would have been fine with it if it was a crab tbf. Anyways, long story short it is now a huge hill with a massive tunnel underneath because I had to settle for it.
I am not the guy who moans about everything. I love the series and frontier have done a great job with it. I always want them to know that. I just want their great game to be even greater. The mantra "simulation evolved" always sticks with me so I want to add my voice saying "If you want to improve your game this would go a long way" I know it is difficult to focus on something as big as this when you also have to think about releasing DLC that makes it worth it for you to continue developing the game.
To preface, I am totally on-side with those who want the hitboxes to be smaller, but I think this initial statement I've quoted is sufficient to express what I'm going to say; unless any of us are game developers of the same calibre as those who work for Frontier, "not understanding" should be enough to take the devs word for it.
I immediately stopped worrying about this issue as soon as Chante posted that, because I am not in any way knowledgeable enough to argue the point. I absolutely hope we can get smaller hitboxes in some way down the line, but I'm willing to accept that the people paid to deal with this sort of thing probably have a good reason as to why things are the way they are.
(also, I apologise Valinor, this is not intended to be directed at you specifically, which is why I cut your post down to this one sentence, it just helped me illustrate what I wanted to say
You are absolutely right of course, and no offense taken.
Guess I'm just frustrated because I was really hoping they were working on a fix for this hitbox problem, and to hear that they're probably not going to do anything about it... well, it's disappointing, tbh.
I do like the idea put forward in this thread to allow animals to pass through smaller entrances by placing down a special building piece. Sounds like a great compromise!
Maybe they're putting off fixing this for now because they're currently working on another DLC. Seems to be the way things happen with game devs these days. 1) Prematurely release bug-ridden game. 2) "Fix" a few major bugs to placate the populace. 3) Release paid DLC like crazy while mostly ignoring new bugs. 4) Abandon game and start working on new game.
Personally, I'm kinda bored of PZ right now. This hitbox issue is just too frustrating to deal with, and I'm not at all motivated to buy any of the DLCs when the base game still has so many issues. I haven't played much the last few weeks, and the fatigue from reading the Steam page, forums and issue tracker and seeing very little in the way of news or bug squashing progress has just reduced my motivation to zero. Gonna take a long break from playing like I did after the game was released. The game is much better than it was, but still not as good as it could be.
Personally, I'm kinda bored of PZ right now. This hitbox issue is just too frustrating to deal with, and I'm not at all motivated to buy any of the DLCs when the base game still has so many issues. I haven't played much the last few weeks, and the fatigue from reading the Steam page, forums and issue tracker and seeing very little in the way of news or bug squashing progress has just reduced my motivation to zero. Gonna take a long break from playing like I did after the game was released. The game is much better than it was, but still not as good as it could be.
If they are stuck and cant rotate at a place, cant they walk back (animation) the same way they came? So that it reaches a place where there is space to rotate. ? Instead of trying to rotate at every place.
Have to say that this is really disappointing - the massive hitboxes don't just make it super-difficult to make realistic shelters, they also massively reduce the navigable area and, therefore, increase the areas required by animals (which are mostly a bit over the top anyway).. For example, the hitboxes for Komodo Dragons mean that the navigable area of an empty enclosure 10x60 (600m^2) ends up being ~540m^2 i.e., 10% of the area is lost to the hitbox before any trees, rocks etc. are added!
Given that it looks like hitboxes won't be reduced, perhaps space requirements need to be revisited, or the way space is calculated needs to be altered - the (already large) space required by animals has grown since launch because of hitbox sizes increasing.
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So true and from what I've seen around here and different boards lately, most of the problems that were supposedly fixed by the huge hitboxes are still there or even worse than they were before.
It also causes a problem where animals get stuck in places they can reach as babies but then can't get out of if they grow up there -.-
Maybe the best way to solve this would be to apply the smaller hitboxes the animals have as juveniles to the adults as well, or at least give us the option to do so in the game settings just like with the collision stuff. That way it wouldn't be too much work coding wise, I think, since the system for those hitboxes is already in place and working, and everyone could decide for themselves whether or not they wanna take the risk with smaller hitboxes.
I'm happy to keep it as it is at the moment.
If proposed changes only lead to poorer performance, please keep it as it is, and focus on other matters that are easier to fix.
Didn't pay attention to this, so I'll take your word on this one.
Something worth trying to see if people can work around the hitbox issue. Not really seeing the option myself atm.
Which problems are you referring to? The common escaping is something I agree with, lately that has been an issue again for quite a few people.
Though, some people really need to check any conflicting items/foilage. With the lack of screenshots it's difficult to conclude this but when people do, moving a tree/enrichment item could be the solution as well.
Overall performance has been improved and judging from the earlier comment the hitboxes change has contributed to this.
Don't like it but if it leads to worse performance when they change it back, keep it this way. If there's another way of fixing this, i'm sure they will make improvements.
The animals phasing through habitat walls and escaping through objects, getting stuck in tight places like I said and still getting boxed etc. Performance and loading times also hasn't changed one bit for me and I keep checking back to one and the same zoo without changing anything in it after every update to see if there finally is a difference but there never was. The only thing that changed was that a ton of animals got stuck in their shelters or part of their habitats they could easily reach before but suddenly couldn't anymore.
So from my end this whole thing has sadly done more harm then good and I just wish there was an option for us to decide ourselves if we wanna go back to smaller hitboxes or not. I mean they found a way to do that for the terrain/barrier thing so why not for this one, too? It's not like it would hurt any other players out there if I turned an option for smaller hitboxes on in my game, it wouldn't have any effect whatsoever on theirs but my parks would finally work again.
I agree with the phasing/escaping - has been mentioned by multiple people. I fixed most of my problems by moving/rotating stuff or replacing the glass panels with concrete windows ones. Escaping even improved with some updates, my hippos and zebras don't escape their habitat anymore. (without changing it)
Performance/loading times have improved for me. I had the infinite loading bug so I paid more attention to loading times.
With some updates I feel there's a slight improvement. (still a long way to go imo)
I think it's just a matter of outweighing the positives/negatives and I don't think that option would be wise: most people would switch back and complain about those issues again. In short: What are real issues/bugs or issues caused by the smaller hitbox?
If you turned smaller hitboxes on and make a blueprint and share this blueprint, that potentially "hurt" other players. (only an IF when you do this).
Performance/loading times have improved for me. I had the infinite loading bug so I paid more attention to loading times.
With some updates I feel there's a slight improvement. (still a long way to go imo)
Judging from their comment, they didn't found a good solution for this problem except changing the hitboxes.
I think it's just a matter of outweighing the positives/negatives and I don't think that option would be wise: most people would switch back and complain about those issues again. In short: What are real issues/bugs or issues caused by the smaller hitbox?
If you turned smaller hitboxes on and make a blueprint and share this blueprint, that potentially "hurt" other players. (only an IF when you do this).
Just wanted to give you guys a heads up on this matter.
I was checking Mealie's content thanks to his recent thread and in one of his inspiring videos he does find a way to circumvent the issue (at least partially). The bad part is that it only works for animals that are able to climb, so it still needs a proper work around by Frontier, obviously. But oh well it's something.
Btw, needless to say this guy's content is very recommendable.
I was checking Mealie's content thanks to his recent thread and in one of his inspiring videos he does find a way to circumvent the issue (at least partially). The bad part is that it only works for animals that are able to climb, so it still needs a proper work around by Frontier, obviously. But oh well it's something.
Btw, needless to say this guy's content is very recommendable.
Oooh, this is cool! Thanks for posting.