Big Elite Streamers Giving Up On Streaming Elite?
- Thread starter Decandently
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Yeah I'm definitely not a supporter of the DRAMA merchants, the whole thing has become hysterical. But as you say in the final analysis, if things truly go south, it's not at anybody elses door than fdev.
Me too. Just now caught horribly on hop by a squad of scavs. Only getting out using ship's shields for cover, then interdicted with same shields on low strength. Nice little (Vulture) trade on some silver though .. and materials / bounties galore but I don't like to talk about that .. for fear of being labelled a shill (which is apparently what happens if you don't subscribe to the doom narrative)
I did an assassination mission last night, planet was quite lovely, with the settlement surrounded by mountains and ravines.
It went wrong.
I dismissed my ship on the other side of the settlement before it blew up, I had stupidly not used my srv so no easy way to get a good distance away. Had a 20min hike up the mountains to get away from the guards, lovely view back to the settlement, found a relatively low flat area, recalled my ship. Hadn't noticed the Chieftain patrolling over the area, started battering my poor phantom. Took me another 10min hike and 2 aborted attempts before the Chieftain wasn't around and I could get out.
Nothing really happened for 20mins but it was great. And it looked amazing, and this is still on my heroic gtx970. Other planets looked terrible it has to be said, this one was lovely.
The funding rug has probably already been pulled out, even before the release of Odyssey alpha. FDev have other games, and they are worth more money to them. That's the most likely reason why they've given absolutely no details at all about what happens after the console release - and every time the question is asked directly of them - they respond with typical stony silence. Good old honest, open Frontier, eh? It's also a big underlying reason why the community is so frustrated & angry, whether they realise it or not. There's no direction, and they don't seem to know what they're doing or where they're going.
Additionally, the crap release of Odyssey is hardly an isolated incident in the history of E: D. Those who have been around for a while & had their blinkers forcibly removed by previous FDev stunts & lies could see this release coming a mile off. It wasn't a surprise. We just hoped that somehow, someone at FDev would stop the train before it smashed into the shopping mall instead of arriving safely at the station. But FDev's hubris ('validated' by the "everything is fine" white knights) made sure that would never happen, so we are where we are.
That same hubris, ably demonstrated by them over the last few weeks since the release, means that they're not going to pull a No Man's Sky with this. It isn't going to be fixed and suddenly become a great game after a shaky launch. Hence people are leaving in droves, disillusioned and disappointed. Why anyone would blame utubers for this is beyond me.
Odyssey is huge, and like every other content patch before it, it was built entirely separately from the base game. Doubt anyone even bothered to play it while they were developing Odyssey. So now they can't integrate it, and the player base has a hard split. Nothing in Odyssey reflects back into the base game, and vice versa. Even when they fix the bugs and performance, that basic issue will remain - just as it has for Powerplay, Multicrew, mining, trading, etc etc.
If this was a one-off, then "supporting the game through a tricky time" would have some merit. But the real & sad fact is, it's just the latest in a very very long line of FDev failures, and it's the biggest one yet & brought everything home to roost. Now the blinkers are off more people - and they're seeing the game for what it ultimately is. Especially when there are so many other games out there that are wiping the floor with E: D on almost every level.
Shallow, repetitive, badly designed, and unfortunately a bit crap.
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Shallow, repetitive, badly designed, and unfortunately a bit crap.
That's despite two examples of how survival is not shallow - or even guaranteed - when things go wrong, how you don't always get interdicted, always forget there's a Chieftain patrol, always get a good trade scam on the side or how repetitive planets, vary. My best moments (including a team mate getting blown up by lab equipment) have been entirely emergent.
![[VR] James Constantine](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/275/275309.jpg?1622437385){kind=avatar}
If you need to rewrite 90% of your work because of a small change, then that's because you've got a bad case of feature creep and your project has not been properly specced out. If it had, then this should not be an issue. It also applies to changes or additional features, not bugs in existing functionality. If it does, that means it was poorly developed to begin with and most likely not thought through until they realized it was broken.
This is not to point any blame at FDev's development team at all. Bugs are inevitable in any software project and it may not have been up to them that the game was shipped before these were addressed, however if it was shipped too soon, as it clearly was, then this is FDev's (as a company) responsibility.
But seriously, you can't complain about content creators and then claim that the blame game is bad, after having attempted to blame them. It's laughably hypocritical.
As for motivation, what motivation do you think they would have if they receive no negative feedback?
Because the rank unlock missions are crap and reward crap. Become king by delivering 5 fish! YAY!
And if you did, I wonder which route people would take?
Plus ED needs less 'or'- I'd rather have one well thought out path than three or four weak ones.
Deleted member 182079
D
Good post - and almost word for word mirrors my view at this point - and I say this as someone who not so long ago defended Elite incl. Odyssey from the naysayers, doubters and whingers. But they ended up being right, and I ended up being wrong after all, and that does still sting a little (thanks FDev), not because I always want to be right but because I want my favourite game ever to flourish. I wasn't done with it but it seems inevitable if there's no fundamental change in how Frontier maintain & develop this game.The funding rug has probably already been pulled out, even before the release of Odyssey alpha. FDev have other games, and they are worth more money to them. That's the most likely reason why they've given absolutely no details at all about what happens after the console release - and every time the question is asked directly of them - they respond with typical stony silence. Good old honest, open Frontier, eh? It's also a big underlying reason why the community is so frustrated & angry, whether they realise it or not. There's no direction, and they don't seem to know what they're doing or where they're going.
Additionally, the crap release of Odyssey is hardly an isolated incident in the history of E: D. Those who have been around for a while & had their blinkers forcibly removed by previous FDev stunts & lies could see this release coming a mile off. It wasn't a surprise. We just hoped that somehow, someone at FDev would stop the train before it smashed into the shopping mall instead of arriving safely at the station. But FDev's hubris ('validated' by the "everything is fine" white knights) made sure that would never happen, so we are where we are.
That same hubris, ably demonstrated by them over the last few weeks since the release, means that they're not going to pull a No Man's Sky with this. It isn't going to be fixed and suddenly become a great game after a shaky launch. Hence people are leaving in droves, disillusioned and disappointed. Why anyone would blame utubers for this is beyond me.
Odyssey is huge, and like every other content patch before it, it was built entirely separately from the base game. Doubt anyone even bothered to play it while they were developing Odyssey. So now they can't integrate it, and the player base has a hard split. Nothing in Odyssey reflects back into the base game, and vice versa. Even when they fix the bugs and performance, that basic issue will remain - just as it has for Powerplay, Multicrew, mining, trading, etc etc.
If this was a one-off, then "supporting the game through a tricky time" would have some merit. But the real & sad fact is, it's just the latest in a very very long line of FDev failures, and it's the biggest one yet & brought everything home to roost. Now the blinkers are off more people - and they're seeing the game for what it ultimately is. Especially when there are so many other games out there that are wiping the floor with E: D on almost every level.
Shallow, repetitive, badly designed, and unfortunately a bit crap.
Though I wouldn't call it crap as such, it's just very neglected and missing some much needed TLC - which I just don't think Frontier is willing/able to provide at this stage, because as you say, Warhammer, F1, the zoo games etc. It's no longer their flagship IP and it shows now.
The bugs I can cope with, I've been doing this for the past 7 years - it's the regression issues (lack of care, lack of attention to detail) and the lack of vision, risk appetite to break stuff and try something new and fresh ideas - that is what I'm really struggling with.
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Out of those two years, why was nothing done to rectify the imbalances of the space game though? I just bang my head on the wall thinking who made that choice, when thats the part people play the most and is the cheapest to change, and we had a beta to test these changes in.
"Survival" when you can't actually die kinda makes the stakes a bit meaningless, no? As for interdiction, in 7 years I don't think I've ever had an interdiction that I couldn't get away from easily without firing a shot. It's more of an annoyance than a game feature.
Deleted member 182079
D
And megaship looting.
That alone gives me migrane and stomach acid.
When low hanging fruit hangs so low you could just pick it up from the floor instead.
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In point to point flight, you take off in total safety, jump in near safety, SC with minimal risk and land in total safety.
What happened to NAVs? Why were they vestigial when they are a dangerous spot ripe for piracy?
Why are station NFZ / drop zones so near to the station? No NPC can do anything and run away. Why is it not like 84 Elite where you had to run for cover?
Combine these two and you have the cause of overuse of interdiction.
There is no doubt emergent things pop up,but you really, really really have to stack the deck to get it to happen, because poor low level design choices force you to do things counter to normal actions. I have to stack four pirate lords, carry trade cargo, drop to a nav, be scanned at the nav, wait, hope the lords drop in to get the emergent stuff happen. If I play normally, that will never ever happen.
While I'm no huge fan of the idea of dropping 20km away of every station, there are tons of missed opportunities.
Blockaded station during war, thargoids attacks on them, pirate raids or police lockdown. You could smuggle, fight, or just try to do your business. Prices would fluctuate for more potential profit, but also more threat.
Lots of things to do, really.
I had an idea ages ago of variable drop distances based on BGS state, but these days with engineered drives its not so much of an issue. Big slow ships need defences to last those minutes unprotected, or choose a faster ship and use speed to evade.
Players can choose to protect or pirate, or kill.
This then gives space for NPCs and Powerplay NPCs to do something, Thargoids too.
All of that was thrown out and now ED is a cardboard cutout game.
I'm not trying to be "I told you so" about it. Nothing about it gives me any pleasure to point out. I really really really hoped to be wrong.
It needs someone (Braben?) to look holistically at the entire game - on foot, on planet, in space, in stations, game loops, BGS, engineers, the whole shebang - and decide where and how they all fit together into a cohesive whole. They don't at the moment, but they could if someone was able to do that & push development in that direction.
I was cautiously optimistic about Beyond when it was announced, for exactly that reason. But it didn't really pan out that way. Same with the various other "rebalancing" passes they've done - each one was discrete and completely separate. That's the wrong way to do it entirely... but it's how the game has been designed.
Yep. It's easier to defend something and care about it, if you get the impression that the developers show pride in their work & are excited by it. It's little things like the coffee machine in the Cobra cockpit, or the BBC keyboard, or the galaxy slowly revealing itself when you fly away from a parent star as your eyes adapt. They make all the difference. Sadly, the dark adaption thing was ripped out in Beyond's lighting model "upgrade", and they didn't bother to keep it.
Similarly, silly little bugs that should be squashed just because - instead of waiting until there's a huge outcry, or 100s of them and it's death by a thousand bugs.
A comment I keep seeing everywhere (not on here) is: "Why should I care about Elite when they don't?". It's a tough one to answer credibly to be honest.
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We are talking about ED:O aren't we?Ah, so you opt to ignore the PEGI 7 bit - never mind
ED is 7, apparently. EDO is 16 (because visible violence).
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