2.2's Instant Ship and Module Transport - Yay or Nay?

[Verax]

Mr Verex

Pull your head in your coming across like a total DH, i get the sense that your overcompensating for something, however more to the point several of the players your attacking are very experienced and knowledgeable with regard to how the game balance functions as well as being polite, generally helpful and moderate in there views I'm not referring to myself I'm a crude venomous . Several very real problems have been outlined in this thread that you choose to ignore or just gloss over then run around patting yourself on the back for winning some non existing argument.

We all want ship transfer we just wont it implemented in a way that maintains the balance that is so carefully crafted into the game. There are several undeniably negative effect to the implementation of this feature, just because your limitations prevent you from comprehending them does not solve the problems nor mitigate our concerns.

Anyone can use insults like "your coming across like selfish brat" but that wont help to move the conversation forward so I'll take that back, I think your a bit of a forum noob so I'll suggest you try a little harder to explain your objections to what others say without dismissing them out of hand, you may find you get a better hearing and more reasonable responses.

Personally i could not give a flying f.... what you think i,m more concerned what the devs make of this 174page 2600post thread which is 75% negative about there feel good feature.

Drop your fixation with me. You cannot come up with anything productive or compelling to say and you haven't for at least the last 10 comments I've read from you. You don't like that I have reasonably undermined every argument you've attempted to make or endorse and it's apparently getting under your skin. If you're so confident that you're right, then you have no reason to fixate on me and my arguments. I should be easy to dismiss out of hand if you really believe that you're correct. It's not like you're doing what I'm doing and systematically dismantling opposing arguments. You can't even try, apparently. Lol.

 

[Weps]

You know what will be awesome?

When we get multicrew...

You know why?

Because it'll surely be instant teleport into the host commander's ship, even if it's on the other side of the galaxy. Then, when the session is over, everyone will be teleported back to their own ships. It won't make sense otherwise.

Will it be OK then, to suspend realism for gameplay reasons?

Probably one of the reasons they decided to do this. When you will disembark from your friend's ship, you will probably have the option to instantly summon one of your other ships regardless of what they are.

My first option would be "free Sidewinder" instead of this, but even with instant ship availability upon disembarking, it would still be different than this, mainly because in most cases your friend / acquaintance will not have prepped a stripped out AspX just for the purpose of getting you specifically somewhere. In most cases, the ship in which you both would have had some epic adventure in, would have been built differently.

 

[Gimi]

Personally, if it was me, I'd have planned it the other way round. You SEND the ship on from the station it was parked in. So it travels while you do. In that sense you could even insta-ship without it damaging the immersion. It would take as long as it takes you to get there!

This, in my opinion, is a good idea.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Lol, ohwow. Such contradiction.

we do not know how it is going to be done yet.. you may be right and FD may make a pigs ear of it however there are ways of doing it without.

i would say with mulitcrew IF FD implemented ships crew - this seemed a long shot a week ago but now it looks like it may be on the way as we have pilots already.... - maybe tho when you multicrew you do not "play" you, but you simply control the captains npc crew member, that way it does not matter where your character is in the game because you are not at that time playing them.

I personally like that idea, so there is no concern if you get destroyed, or no magic transport needed. The only downside is you do not get paid for your time... BUT if the npc you are replacing is gaining XP so when you log off the captians crew member may have gone from harmless to mostly harmless thanks to you helping out well that could be enough, and then next time you play YOU go the captain and let your friends level up your npcs for you.

 

[Verax]

Look at all those time sinks. Better turn Elite into a complete arcade game with ultra fast or instant travel, completely automatic docking everytime, automatic or instant space to ground travel, Bubble to the core should only take 10 minutes tops.

Why are people complaining that they have work to do and don't have time to "grind" in Elite? Such is life, you don't always have the time to do what you want when you want. Deal with it!
If that's the case then you should look at other games that better fit your schedule. Not everyone likes or has the time to get involved with Eve Online for example, but I don't see them devaluing their own game so that some people can achieve anything they want in a short amount of time. Eve has managed to stay alive with a relative stable player base for 10 years, why does Elite have to get dumbed down?

The transfer should be made in a way that is both internally consistent and balanced. Transfers are needed, but not instant, maybe add some mechanic or mission that is attached to the transfer something that engages the player while the transfer is happening. The time it should take to transfer the ships should be something FDEV pays very close attention to and should do a lot of testing for.

Maybe the transfer is not possible to every location with a station for various reason, or big ships take longer to prepare for the transport or something, I don't know. All I know, instant is going to suck big time for everyone.

This is a game, not a life.

Frontier is not looking to push people away from their game, whether current or potential customers.

Instant transfers don't affect anyone who chooses not to use them, and feeling the effect is still optional as the abilities to suspend disbelief and self-impose any desired restrictions are not even close to impossible. Opponents of this feature only want to limit what others can do. This has become increasingly evident throughout this debate.

 

[kofeyh]

B) it serves many people's benefit.

I don't think anyone misses that point. But the answer, throwing a bunch of mechanics under the bus because it's expedient and saves people time because who has time to put up with half of the mechanics Frontier have purposefully added? Let's just whitewash jump range, over night.

My cutter was destroyed out at Jaques, as it happens. Because someone else seemed to find the time to take their battle-cutter out to cause a ruckus. There is no safe haven in Elite.

But I believe this is now a forgone conclusion because of how frontier approach these changes; throw a cool idea in, figure out if it's game breaking after the fact. By the time we find out (beta and then live) it'll be too late to really adapt it. Engineers is a perfect case in point where Frontier massively misread what the community wanted and are now in an endless spiral trying to add/ fix mechanics. People mostly hate engineers. Not because it's a stupid idea, but because of the execution of that idea.

I see transport the same way. Idea itself is brilliant. The execution of it, however, may not be. That's really all I have been trying to say.

 

[Gimi]

If they did it the other way round, and had you entered a contract to move your ship from Sol to Lave while you were at Sol, they could insta-ship. The player has to make there way there. The further downside is if your plans change you'd have to go to that station to sort it, adding a little more risk in chosing where you send a ship. It's not a perfect solution but just reversing the point of contract surely makes this a far less messy and game damaging situation. (I'd still put a max range on it too).

Tried to rep this one, but can't, so have a virtual +1 rep

Edit: Seems you posted your idea twice. I thought it was two different people who both had the same epiphany, so I ended up quoting both your posts. Anyway, well deserved, it's such a simple solution, but of course, if you send your ship to Jaques, then die when your almost there, life will be quite harsh when you are forced to go out there to send it back to the bubble.

 

[Elderoy]

That doesn't even make any sense. I and others have already stated that this does not affect anyone who chooses not to utilize the feature. Even if they do, they can still self-impose their own wait time. Ship roles remain intact because this does not make any ships better at things they are not intended for. Jump ranges do not need to impose wait times on people that merely want to move to other areas of populated space. That's not exploration, that's not trade, it's not anything but wanting to be somewhere else for a short range activity. People that feel it's unrealistic to circumvent the artificial timesink of space-travel-time can get over it because it doesn't affect them if they don't want it to, but other people that perhaps only have an hour or two to play games on a given day or evening can still enjoy that time playing Elite, when they otherwise might (and often have, speaking from experience) elect to play other games that don't require a pointless timesink. If you like and care so much about Elite Dangerous, you should care about a broad audience wanting to play it-- otherwise it will not be financially robust enough to ever have its full potential realized. I don't understand why that is such a difficult concept to grasp. No one is forcing you to change how you play, and there is no necessity to either.

Stop bringing up the immersion thing point or the highly laughtable "pretend that you wait" !! We are talking about how this breaks the entire FSD mechanics, the FSD module management and the galaxy only populated by ASPXs and CGs in open populated by combat ships with no FSD (And don't dare saying "go play solo")

EDIT : To be clear, I'm for ship transport, and I don't really care about realism or lore justification in this case as it effectively serve gameplay well.. I just say that it should have other limitations than money.

 

[Boomer Kay]

I don't think anyone misses that point. But the answer, throwing a bunch of mechanics under the bus because it's expedient and saves people time because who has time to put up with half of the mechanics Frontier have purposefully added? Let's just whitewash jump range, over night.

My cutter was destroyed out at Jaques, as it happens. Because someone else seemed to find the time to take their battle-cutter out to cause a ruckus. There is no safe haven in Elite. I think we can perhaps make points without throwing commanders under the bus as well, frankly. I may not agree, but that doesn't mean I won't entertain alternative ideas.

I want transport as well, but I'm not super happy about throwing caution and entire game mechanics under the bus because hey my time is precious, so why bother with half of the in-game ship constraints. If that is genuinely what the loudest people shouting want, then it'll be unstoppable regardless.

Why did you cheat and take a cutter to Jacques?
I took a T6. You should all have been forced to take T6es. It's the only way. The right way. The only right way!

 

[Ziljan]

This, in my opinion, is a good idea.

This would solve the local module availability issue. And would partially solve the immersion issue. However, it would still destroy the meaning of having ships with different jump ranges, since people would just fly their fastest ship everywhere.

All you'd ever see would be Anacondas and Corvettes. Or AspXs and FDLs.

 

[Kigre]

You make a call to get your ship delivered to where you currently are. The time should be half right? Not the same as manually getting it. Cause that means YOU have to travel from A to B and back to A again... with a delivery system the time should be halved. I make a request to where the ship is that i want and they "the ai." delivers it from there to where i am.

Easy.

 

[CaptainKremmen]

Is it really?
There's a basic principle going on. In order to get what you want, where you want it, you need to play the game, even parts of the game that aren't as much fun as other parts.

Now, the people who don't like travel (core gameplay) get insta-transport.
So, for people like me that don't like credit or rank grind, I want insta-ship.

I mean, let's face it, why should I wait years to get a Corvette (yes I mean years).
It's the 'best' ship in the game and I want to have the 'best' fun now.

Seems fair.

If some boring no-fun stick-in-the-mud thinks it's a bad idea, they can grind credits the stupid old-fashioned way, and take ages to get the Corvette.

 

[Boomer Kay]

Stop bringing up the immersion thing point or the highly laughtable "pretend that you wait" !! We are talking about how this breaks the entire FSD mechanics, the FSD module management and the galaxy only populated by ASPXs and CGs in open populated by combat ships with no FSD (And don't dare saying "go play solo")

No fsd? Jump out and laugh yourself to death.
Because combat ships with FSDs are at such a huge disadvantage against a T6. gamebreaking.

 

[Shar]

Drop your fixation with me. You cannot come up with anything productive or compelling to say and you haven't for at least the last 10 comments I've read from you. You don't like that I have reasonably undermined every argument you've attempted to make or endorse and it's apparently getting under your skin. If you're so confident that you're right, then you have no reason to fixate on me and my arguments. I should be easy to dismiss out of hand if you really believe that you're correct. It's not like you're doing what I'm doing and systematically dismantling opposing arguments. You can't even try, apparently. Lol.

You did not answer a single point i have made your quite delusional, as for fixation you and this feature have quite a thing going on i would suggest, your probably an in game griefer who cant wait to exploit this feature or someone who simply finds the game far too challenging in it's current form.

But enough from me your posts speak for themselves.

Feel free to respond i have a feeling it's important for you to get the last word in, so i will let you have it out of pity.

 

[lysan]

Why? Why is "My time is precision so make it instant" a valid enough reason to implement one instant game-thingy but not a valid reason to implement another instant game-thingy for the same reason to achieve practival the same?

Skipping supercruise or making system jumps can be just as optional as instant ship deliver, so people whos time is precious and all that can skip it and people who like it can still do it.

The "my time is precious" is a non valid argument, most people got busy lives, its called time management. I can only play in the weekends, so I PLAN my gaming time.
No, it's the same crowd who cry when the AI gets to hard, and FD goes along with it. Trust me, there will be more "demands" down the road, and they will use the same tactics.

It's time for Frontier to make a new mode where some of these features are blocked out, or just make a private group who ignore all this arcady stuff?
Because I don't think they will change on this on, the "give it all to me now" crowd are outnumbering the SIM crowd.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Any cost argument is moot, people will always have the money.

It's the mechanic and potential impact that's important.

But that's the point, there's no impact. Only our imagination is hurt.

 

[Boomer Kay]

This would solve the local module availability issue. And would partially solve the immersion issue. However, it would still destroy the meaning of having ships with different jump ranges, since people would just fly their fastest ship everywhere.

All you'd ever see would be Anacondas and Corvettes. Or AspXs and FDLs.

There is nothing "immersive" about limited availability of modules. It's simply a game mechanic you're used to.
My garage is not sending me to a garage in southern France because they have no light machine for my car. They order one, it gets shipped.

 

[Verax]

I even accept that people plain out cheesed Robigo before by going there in an Asp, stacked missions by selling the mission cargo, jumped back, switched to some python, rebought the mission cargo and delivered it.
If they think that's fun, more power to them. I think it's silly, but I'm not the gameplay police.
And I still got a vette and over 500 million in assets by simply playing the game and without grind. Took 600 hours .. so what?

Going to teleport your conda back from Jacques? Awesome, you missed the exploration data of nearly 1k jumps and had to pay for the transfer. Since I don't sit here watching anyone but myself do the trip back and forth, taking 3 real life weeks and 40 hours to do it, why exactly does that affect me? I'm no the gameplay gestapo either.

And there's players who play as much a day as I play a week, so what took me 3 weeks real time to accomplish, takes them 3 days and they could do the cg trip 10x or more, while I did one run.
Why exactly am I to question that or be overly unhappy about it.
They could transfer an entire fleet of FDLs to Jacques and back in the time it takes me to get there once. SO WHAT GAMEBRAKING IS REALLY DONE HERE?
.

Nailed it!

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You did not answer a single point i have made your quite delusional, as for fixation you and this feature have quite a thing going on i would suggest, your probably an in game griefer who cant wait to exploit this feature or someone who simply finds the game far too challenging in it's current form.

But enough from me your posts speak for themselves.

Feel free to respond i have a feeling it's important for you to get the last word in, so i will let you have it out of pity.

Lmao! Out comes the "greeeeferrr" card. Just sad.

 

[Winterwalker]

Personally, if it was me, I'd have planned it the other way round. You SEND the ship on from the station it was parked in. So it travels while you do. In that sense you could even insta-ship without it damaging the immersion. It would take as long as it takes you to get there!

This, in my opinion, is a good idea.

This occured to me too, agreed. Am not sure could have claimed 20/20 prevision though, hindsight is a wonderful thing!

Personally think it would be awesome to be able to order a ship transfer from a third location also .. send from Sol, recieve at Lave while I'm at Achenar (or halfway) .. Could reputations come it to play? In theory, perhaps they could. I'm quite optimistic actually that the 2.2 news may not be the finished product. There are actually quite a few things that you could do with ship transfer (occasionally going wrong).

 

[Verax]

There is nothing "immersive" about limited availability of modules. It's simply a game mechanic you're used to.
My garage is not sending me to a garage in southern France because they have no light machine for my car. They order one, it gets shipped.

Slam dunk.