It looks like you have never been on a Sunday drive in the country (mulit -crew), Driver (CMDR) - Backseat Driver (Other CMDR)...
2.3 The Commanders
- Thread starter frostypaw
- Start date
It looks like you have never been on a Sunday drive in the country (mulit -crew), Driver (CMDR) - Backseat Driver (Other CMDR)...
No offence, but what do you mean, exactly? That the backseat driver is bored? that the car can't be faster with a backseat? Is it appropriate? The car/elite dangerous comparisons are getting harder and harder to understand...
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It all seems to come down to that, yes.
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Being a "REAL LIVE PILOT RET." there is only so much room in a cockpit ... "NO ROOM FOR TWO EGO'S"
haha, that's part of the fun I guess, ego's facing...
"all shields to front!" "No, strafe right, avoid!" "I'm going in!!!!!" "HERE, SHIELDS TO THE BACK, TAKE THAT you ungrateful brat!"
Craith
Volunteer Moderator
WARNING... long post inc!
I am really looking forward to 2.3, although there are some fears too:
I hope the roles are not set in stone, I'd prefer to be able to dynamically adjust the workload for every other crewmember. And yes, this is somewhat selfish, but I'd love to be able to play with my kids, and tailor each role to their capabilities. The younger might be able to launch chaff or limpets on command (but he's happy with anything just being part, so no stress here), while the older one is able to control shield vectors, turrets or prospector limpets, even if flying his own ship in combat is to hard for him (I only mine or trade with them on board, but pirates happen).
One of the big NOs for me would be a magic Crewfactor, that increases the power of my ship, just because another player is on board. I sincerely hope that is not the case, and the improved strength comes from being more flexible.
List of stuff that came to mind, unsorted:
Three more sophisticated ideas, that could be part of multicrew or enrich it:
Weapon and Shield Frequency Modulation:
Module Overcharge:
Manual Hyperspace
TLDR: please no magic multiplier, add believable upgrades and utility
I am really looking forward to 2.3, although there are some fears too:
I hope the roles are not set in stone, I'd prefer to be able to dynamically adjust the workload for every other crewmember. And yes, this is somewhat selfish, but I'd love to be able to play with my kids, and tailor each role to their capabilities. The younger might be able to launch chaff or limpets on command (but he's happy with anything just being part, so no stress here), while the older one is able to control shield vectors, turrets or prospector limpets, even if flying his own ship in combat is to hard for him (I only mine or trade with them on board, but pirates happen).
One of the big NOs for me would be a magic Crewfactor, that increases the power of my ship, just because another player is on board. I sincerely hope that is not the case, and the improved strength comes from being more flexible.
List of stuff that came to mind, unsorted:
- setting shield vectors, where the shield is stronger in one direction, and weaker in another, and the ability to aim that vector, different shields might have different pros and cons, one might be easier to aim, another might allow more variation between the shield sectors.
- adjusting shield frequency on the fly, allowing varying resistance against different damage types (or even energy weapon frequencies, if implemented)
- directly manning one turret, like in the SRV,
- camera guided missiles and torpedos
- remote control of limpets, allowing prospecting independent of the pilot.
- delegating subsystem targeting
- assigning different targets to different weapons - make the small turrets fire at the small fighter harassing you, while the big guns stay on the main target.
- multiple targets, one per player, like it is in wings at the moment, easily allowing gunners and pilots to switch targets
- giving cover in the fighter(s)
- using sensors to scan targets, even not in front of the ship, and getting improved information (heat level, including weapon frequencies, if implemented)
- micromanaging weapons (seperate cooling for all weapons, including priorities, synchronize firing, manual reload, change frequency if implemented)
- repairs / reboot of components (might require AFM, or might be in addition)
- Synthesis
- Course plotting, selection of navigation targets
- scanning of signal sources (even if not in front of ship), with improved information
- detailed module control, slightly improve performance above or below "safe" standard values (see Module Overcharge)
- heat management (heat sinks, open/close heat radiators, reduce module output to reduce heat gain)
- directional heat discharge: allows staying nearly invisible to sensors by radiating heat only into certain directions - worse heat dispersion, but harder to detect from the other directions
- PIP management
- more types of scanners, parallel scanning, while one is scanning for minerals, explorer might analyse the atmosphere (for example). Make scan duration dependent how on target the scanner is.
- Maybe allow manual hyperspace flight, where the whole has to work together to make it, but with the improved range if successful
- multicrew vehicles for planetbound exploration, combined with parallel operation ... put those bigger hangars to good use!
Three more sophisticated ideas, that could be part of multicrew or enrich it:
Weapon and Shield Frequency Modulation:
This is working on a few assumptions: Basic lasers in Elite are orange, because its the most efficient way to create a high energy laser, basic shields are blue, because it is the most effective energy frequency to combat the basic lasers. Changing the frequency of the laser would allow it to damage shields better than before, but would make it less efficient (less damage on average, but better against 'blue' shields).
An "engineer" on board of a ship could be able to modulate the laser frequency, which would require a reboot. This would also change the color of the laser.
Detailed scans of a ships subsystem would reveal the current modulation of a target's ship weapons. As an answer to this information-warfare an opposing crew member might modulate the shields of the vessel (without rebooting the shield generator, but slowly changing frequency of the shields).
Some engineering enhanced weapons, Bi-Weave and Prismatic shields are already operating at other frequencies, because these are the most effective for their modus operandi, but they could also deviate from the frequence, with worse efficiency (power, damage, heat ...)
In addition, it would allow players to modify the look of their lasers/shields, if they are willing to handicap themself against some targets. With Engineers, a con of this idea would be that it removes the ability to see special effects of enemy weapons from their color.
An "engineer" on board of a ship could be able to modulate the laser frequency, which would require a reboot. This would also change the color of the laser.
Detailed scans of a ships subsystem would reveal the current modulation of a target's ship weapons. As an answer to this information-warfare an opposing crew member might modulate the shields of the vessel (without rebooting the shield generator, but slowly changing frequency of the shields).
Some engineering enhanced weapons, Bi-Weave and Prismatic shields are already operating at other frequencies, because these are the most effective for their modus operandi, but they could also deviate from the frequence, with worse efficiency (power, damage, heat ...)
In addition, it would allow players to modify the look of their lasers/shields, if they are willing to handicap themself against some targets. With Engineers, a con of this idea would be that it removes the ability to see special effects of enemy weapons from their color.
Module Overcharge:
Allows for modules to perform above their standard values, for a limited time and for a cost and potential module and intregrity damage. You could also reduce your module power to reduce your radar signature, similar to cold running, but more on a sliding scale than a binary on/off, to reduce fuel consumption, or as a balance for other "overcharges".
Ingame Reasoning: The performance of the modules is standardized within safety limits and allow for a low-wear operation of the equipment. By closely monitoring their output values, it should be possible to slightly improve their performance. The consequences should increase faster than the gain, so slight tuning is relatively painless, but gaining boni should require permanent supervision and fast reactions.
Thrusters could be overcharged, similar to what the Planetary Approach Suite does, to allow higher performance, but with increased heat generation, power and fuel consumption. It would also come at the cost of other thrusters, so if you want more speed, you lose maneuverability, if you want more yaw, you lose pitch and speed, and so on. Should consume ENG-Energy. Requires good communication with the pilot.
Boost could also be modified, faster with higher ENG-Drain, or slower with lesser ENG-Drain, maybe even able to be maintained until the capacitator is empty, with fast rising heat. Crew member could allow the Pilot to "perma"-boost until the gauges get into the read, then put them on extended cooldown and repairs.
Weapons could fire (all but beams) and reload (if applicable) faster, deal more power per shot (pulse, burst, plasmas) or time (beams). This would increase ammo consumption, more WEP-Energy, heat generation, damage the modules and use more power from the generator.
Scanner could make a ping like an active sonar, improving its range for a moment, but also showing you on everyone's radar for an even greater range. should use quite a lot of SYS-Energy. In addition, overcharging it might increase its range all the time, at the cost of more heat, more power consumption, significantly higher radar signature and damage to the module over time.
Shields could be set to recharge faster (SYS-Drain, generating more heat, straining the generator), recharge while under fire (damaging the shield reactor if the shield is damaged while recharging), go above their max (permanently using SYS-Energy, generating more heat, straining the generator), allow a reinitialisation even if it is not 50% charged yet (with damage to reactor, heat spike, SYS-Drain)
FSD could allow a blind jump, where you jump before all the safety calculations, that normally guarantee your safe journey, are turned off. This would allow jumping while mass locked, but destroying the FSD in the process (requiring a reboot) to limp back to civilisation afterwards. Also, destination might not be safe at all.
Ingame Reasoning: The performance of the modules is standardized within safety limits and allow for a low-wear operation of the equipment. By closely monitoring their output values, it should be possible to slightly improve their performance. The consequences should increase faster than the gain, so slight tuning is relatively painless, but gaining boni should require permanent supervision and fast reactions.
Thrusters could be overcharged, similar to what the Planetary Approach Suite does, to allow higher performance, but with increased heat generation, power and fuel consumption. It would also come at the cost of other thrusters, so if you want more speed, you lose maneuverability, if you want more yaw, you lose pitch and speed, and so on. Should consume ENG-Energy. Requires good communication with the pilot.
Boost could also be modified, faster with higher ENG-Drain, or slower with lesser ENG-Drain, maybe even able to be maintained until the capacitator is empty, with fast rising heat. Crew member could allow the Pilot to "perma"-boost until the gauges get into the read, then put them on extended cooldown and repairs.
Weapons could fire (all but beams) and reload (if applicable) faster, deal more power per shot (pulse, burst, plasmas) or time (beams). This would increase ammo consumption, more WEP-Energy, heat generation, damage the modules and use more power from the generator.
Scanner could make a ping like an active sonar, improving its range for a moment, but also showing you on everyone's radar for an even greater range. should use quite a lot of SYS-Energy. In addition, overcharging it might increase its range all the time, at the cost of more heat, more power consumption, significantly higher radar signature and damage to the module over time.
Shields could be set to recharge faster (SYS-Drain, generating more heat, straining the generator), recharge while under fire (damaging the shield reactor if the shield is damaged while recharging), go above their max (permanently using SYS-Energy, generating more heat, straining the generator), allow a reinitialisation even if it is not 50% charged yet (with damage to reactor, heat spike, SYS-Drain)
FSD could allow a blind jump, where you jump before all the safety calculations, that normally guarantee your safe journey, are turned off. This would allow jumping while mass locked, but destroying the FSD in the process (requiring a reboot) to limp back to civilisation afterwards. Also, destination might not be safe at all.
Manual Hyperspace
It would be great if multicrew would allow the manual flight through hyperspace. It might be just to dangerous to do it normally, requiring attention to shield vectors to react to different hyperspace phenomens, constant piloting through "safe" flight vectors, scanner reading to plot a course through the criss-crossing web of hyperspace anomalies and gravity fields to create said flight vector, and repairs to counteract any mistakes made. It could allow jumps with more range (computer always takes the safest route), while allowing engaging gameplay for the whole crew outside of combat.
Depending on route it could be possible to do this alone (accepting some damage), or require a full crew (no hard limit, if you want to try under-crewed, you should be free to try). Failure might get you stranded in deep space, with a damaged FSD, so you better pack some way for repairs and check your fuel before attempting the jump. Fuel ratting into deep space might or might not be possible (I'd prefer yes).
Might be a bit to early for 2.3. but would enrich the exploration
Depending on route it could be possible to do this alone (accepting some damage), or require a full crew (no hard limit, if you want to try under-crewed, you should be free to try). Failure might get you stranded in deep space, with a damaged FSD, so you better pack some way for repairs and check your fuel before attempting the jump. Fuel ratting into deep space might or might not be possible (I'd prefer yes).
Might be a bit to early for 2.3. but would enrich the exploration
TLDR: please no magic multiplier, add believable upgrades and utility
This right here is my thinking all along. Highlight on the words 'without enough crew the ship was unflyable.'
This is my prediction right now that ships needing more than one will be made hard to control on your own. They will require the extra people just to fly it without major problems.
FDev are quite cool about making major changes to existing game play. In their minds they are just finally filling a gap that had a place holder in them.
How would 1 ship equal four ships of its type?
![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
without lame magic boosts I have no idea, and that is the big question isnt it?
at best i would imagine it should be 10 or 20% better as players can micro manage better.
imo the better direction would be to make all the ships above the single seater forced multicrew, and then a crew can be npc or player..... just like in hte DDF but i am going round in circles now.
hopefully the dev who made the quote was having a brain fart when he said it. (note this is not me being insulting, I have brain farts all the time
)
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I think you are getting confused with PvP and PwP. Very different things.
Good!
FD has no choice but to do that, otherwise a fully crewed wing will involve 16 connections. Even now ED can barely handle 16 connections, let alone 30 or 50 !
The number of times others have disappered in front of me (still on teamspeak,saying suddenly they can't see us either) and rubber banding,and not able to join an instance full of friends on the list.
Limiting a wing to 4 connections is a must for many reasons.
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I hope FD reconsider the decision not to include NPC crew.
Personally I have zero interest in multiplayer.
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I'd like to see some form of crew interaction and missions arising from the personal background of NPC crewmembers.
Personally I have zero interest in multiplayer.
_
I'd like to see some form of crew interaction and missions arising from the personal background of NPC crewmembers.
Duly +1'd
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Frontier obviously has not attended many CRM classes, have they?
Ralph, 429th TFS
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Not well.
I recall many years ago, in one of the Elite games I played, you were able to "Hire" NPC Crew in the bigger ships. You had to pay them wages and your reputation had an impact on your ability to hire the right people at the right price. I was pretty neat so it would be great if they implemented that in a future release!
The reason we're not getting NPC wingmen, or crew, is that Frontier wants to draw in players for those roles.
NPC's don't buy new content.
NPC's don't buy new content.
How is this different for you from Wings?
Frontier chasing SC features, that's a new one. I like SC just like the next guy but from what i've seen during 2 years it's the other way around.
To be honest. I Think that MCC is one of those things that sounds great in theory. But, in practice, will be a massive disappointment.
It's inherently limited by the technical problem of 4 players flying a ship that may have moderately different times and places in different parts of the ship due to network delays. It's also limited to needing 4 people who want to play at the same time, do the same stuff. Say you put together a crew of 4 - what happens if your weapons guy needs to leave to pick his kids up from Karate classes? Or the Commander gets a call to pick her husband up from the train station? Or if someone needs to go to bed. With Wings, they just leave the wing. With MMC - they'll leave their station empty.
THEN there is the problem that most of the time most of the crew will have little to do. If you're weapons, or navigation - what do you do once your course is layed in and there are no enemies around?
Sounds great as we all think it will be like the "Tie Fighter" scene in Star Wars "I got one!", "Great kid, shoot another!". But I'm not so sure it will be like that most of the time. Frontier will have to build in quite a lot of content to make it worthwhile whilst, at the same time, not alienating single-players by making too much content MCC only, or making it essential to succeed in the game.
It isn't really a great idea.
It's inherently limited by the technical problem of 4 players flying a ship that may have moderately different times and places in different parts of the ship due to network delays. It's also limited to needing 4 people who want to play at the same time, do the same stuff. Say you put together a crew of 4 - what happens if your weapons guy needs to leave to pick his kids up from Karate classes? Or the Commander gets a call to pick her husband up from the train station? Or if someone needs to go to bed. With Wings, they just leave the wing. With MMC - they'll leave their station empty.
THEN there is the problem that most of the time most of the crew will have little to do. If you're weapons, or navigation - what do you do once your course is layed in and there are no enemies around?
Sounds great as we all think it will be like the "Tie Fighter" scene in Star Wars "I got one!", "Great kid, shoot another!". But I'm not so sure it will be like that most of the time. Frontier will have to build in quite a lot of content to make it worthwhile whilst, at the same time, not alienating single-players by making too much content MCC only, or making it essential to succeed in the game.
It isn't really a great idea.