2yrs and counting...

[Rat Catcher]

Fixed it for you.

I guessed it...

So what is a 'veteran' explorer?

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

If you replace something, you have to remove the other thing. If they had simply added the feature, I would still be playing Elite now. And it would have made sense to add the feature without removing the ADS.

1. The ADS would tell you information about the system. Based on that information, you could decide whether to investigate the system further.
2. If you decide to investigate further, you fire up the FSS and get more information on the planets in that system. Based upon that information you could decide whether to investigate planets further.
3. If you do decide to investigate further, you can go to the planets you're interested in and probe them or land on them,

The thing that kills exploration for me right now is that I am forced to play the mini game about every single system I go through. If I could have used the FSS only when I needed to (I find a system that could be interesting) it's frequency would go down a lot, and the grind aspect of it would go down a lot. When I first learned about the FSS I was positive about it. The mini game itself isn't the issue. The frequency is.

It's not better or worse than the old system. It's on par. The old system was lacking in depth. The new system is lacking in depth. You master the FSS in an hour or so and after that it just is busy work.

The duality I have about Frontier in this is, that I do believe there are developers who do care about the exploration mechanics. That's why I am very careful to direct my ire at Frontier, not the developers. I do believe the marketing aspect is the reason exploration gets as little priority as it does. A well thought out exploration system doesn't sell and doesn't make jazzy marketing. Pew pew pew and explosions do.

It would make zero sense to have both. The ADS gives you precise locations of every body in the system, and then to find out more information about those bodies, you have find those bodies which you already know the location of in the FSS. None of it makes sense.

Now if the honk populated the system map with none-targetable black orbs of the major items (no moons). Then I could live with that.

It would give people a hint of what the system map will be like, the FSS is there to fill in the blanks and find the bodies. Maybe have some options within the FSS that allows you to find the locations within the FSS without giving you all the information.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Hi Max

 

[VR jefranklin18]

That is the usual clash of views. If you are after $$$ and tags, than the minigame is comparable or even superior to ADS. What it removed is our ability to see system oddities, extremes, etc. at a glance.

For most seasoned veteran explorers finding another ELW is not the point of the game, but very eccentric orbits, giant rings, high g planets, tiny potatoes, gas giants orbiting other gas giants, etc. are. For this blobs are not a solution, unfortunately.

I cannot recall how ADS enabled the identification of eccentric orbits, etc though? Surely once you resolved, the FSS you can switch to the Orrery to review such things?

 

[Rat Catcher]

I think it was a quite sensible remark. If you have discovered hundreds of ELWs already, you're less likely to have finding ELWs as motivator. Some do go into the finding ELWs in odd places territory, I have done so myself looking for those blighters in Black Hole systems. Didn't find any, but did find loads of very odd systems. And some (Sir von Rightenhoven (apologies for screwing up the spelling on that one, been a long time since I saw him) springs to mind) explorers go bananapeanutbuttersandwich crazy and vow to find every single ELW in the game.

As always, fun in games is subjective. If finding ELWs through the FSS floats anyone's boat and means they're having fun playing ELW, all the best to them and happy hunting. there is no best or only method for exploring. As a seasoned explorer yourself you know that other explorers are loonies. I hear some of them don't even talk to their ships. heck, some of their ships don't even answer back.

Nutjobs.

Yep, all of us...

I don't seek ELW's, but find them, but have never - ever - bemoaned the removal of the ADS as the FSS, for me, enhanced the gameplay from "Honk - Scoop - visit every body in the system, even the snowballs..." but then, I just play to enjoy myself and visit systems I've never seen before and am unlikely to visit again...

I just hope I'm the one to find that mythical system... as I'm just a player...

 

[Ozric]

I cannot recall how ADS enabled the identification of eccentric orbits, etc though? Surely once you resolved, the FSS you can switch to the Orrery to review such things?

It didn't. All it did differently from the FSS was show you which bodies/barycentre and object orbited around.

It's a pointless conversation given FD already said they will not bring back the ADS, but some people don't want to accept it. And that's fine, there's enough rant posts on the forum as it is. Many games have mechanics changed and you learn to adapt and move on. They essentially rebuilt the character skills in LOTRO from the ground up. It was a terrible change that ruined the way I played my Burglar. But it was the company's decision, they gave their reasons for it, I got on with it.

 

[biot]

I guessed it...

So what is a 'veteran' explorer?

I am a seasoned explorer. I cover myself with Cajun Dry Rub before heading out into the black. Well ... in all honesty, I do that all the time even when not playing the game.

I might have a problem.

 

[[VR] optimal_909]

I guessed it...

So what is a 'veteran' explorer?

You know what I mean by that, but discussions on semantics is a trendy thing on these forums.

It didn't. All it did differently from the FSS was show you which bodies/barycentre and object orbited around.

It's a pointless conversation given FD already said they will not bring back the ADS, but some people don't want to accept it. And that's fine, there's enough rant posts on the forum as it is. Many games have mechanics changed and you learn to adapt and move on. They essentially rebuilt the character skills in LOTRO from the ground up. It was a terrible change that ruined the way I played my Burglar. But it was the company's decision, they gave their reasons for it, I got on with it.

The value was there, though I'm unsure if upon detailed scanning.
However, for some reason Stellar Forge created many large icy bodies with eccentric orbit, so therefore upon honking I always checked those. Now I can't do it unless I am going though the pain of minigaming the system.

I also got on with it. Started playing in the bubble, but got bored of it especially without narrative, triple-hotspots and carriers aside... so I'm not playing Elite anymore.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

It doesn't for me. It's very useful when you're looking for ELWs, OR AWs, it's useless to determine system configuration.

Yeah, you might have noted I mentioned system configuration separately and talked about it as part of the compromise suggestion that was made.

 

[Rat Catcher]

You know what I mean by that, but discussions on semantics is a trendy thing on these forums.

Actually, I don't.. Which is precisely why I asked!
Is it your age? How long you have played (or owned) the game? How many systems / bodies have your tag on? How many LY you have traversed?

(although, as you have said you no longer play, I assume the question is pointless as it is not actually relevant any longer?)

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

It's a pointless conversation given FD already said they will not bring back the ADS

I hear this a lot. As if that's some sort of unique features of these threads.

But I'll grant you, it's one of the many pointless conversations on Dangerous Discussions. Except that some people are actually exchanging ideas, which is kind of the point of the discussion. Or just shooting the breeze.

edit: And Satisfactory forum shenanigans happen on reddit, which I'm allergic to. So I keep coming back to the joyful community of Elite once in a while

Always the same faces, always the same age-old "arguments". So boring, so honking....

Right, Frillop just posted it's always the same. I had that on my ADS thread bingo card.

I claim the win.

Yeah, you might have noted system configuration separately and talked about it as part of the compromise suggestion that was made.

I noted.

 

[Ozric]

The value was there, though I'm unsure if upon detailed scanning.
However, for some reason Stellar Forge created many large icy bodies with eccentric orbit, so therefore upon honking I always checked those. Now I can't do it unless I am going though the pain of minigaming the system.

Not on initial scan. You had to fly to the body and scan it with the DSS in order to see things like the orbital details, which 99% of the time would take a lot longer than mapping an entire system with the FSS.

Source: https://youtu.be/7bUXHhMjX0c?t=2673

I hear this a lot. As if that's some sort of unique features of these threads.

But I'll grant you, it's one of the many pointless conversations on Dangerous Discussions. Except that some people are actually exchanging ideas, which is kind of the point of the discussion. Or just shooting the breeze.

It's not unique, but it is the overriding feature of the threads. It would be like a thread asking for engineering to be put back to the old way of doing it with full RNG.
Nothing wrong with them, as long as they stay friendly. But still pretty pointless.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

It's not unique, but it is the overriding feature of the threads. It would be like a thread asking for engineering to be put back to the old way of doing it with full RNG.
Nothing wrong with them, as long as they stay friendly. But still pretty pointless.

My point was, so what if it's pointless?

The best things in life are pointless.

 

[Ozric]

My point was, so what if it's pointless?

The best things in life are pointless.

I don't know if all the best things are, some of them have points. I mean bouncy balls are good fun and all that, but I really love being in nature, and bird watching, and there's a lot of pointy things there. Otters have pointy teeth and claws too

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I don't know if all the best things are, some of them have points. I mean bouncy balls are good fun and all that, but I really love being in nature, and bird watching, and there's a lot of pointy things there. Otters have pointy teeth and claws too

I just love broken pencils

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

It didn't. All it did differently from the FSS was show you which bodies/barycentre and object orbited around.

It's a pointless conversation given FD already said they will not bring back the ADS, but some people don't want to accept it. And that's fine, there's enough rant posts on the forum as it is. Many games have mechanics changed and you learn to adapt and move on. They essentially rebuilt the character skills in LOTRO from the ground up. It was a terrible change that ruined the way I played my Burglar. But it was the company's decision, they gave their reasons for it, I got on with it.

Well if the situation won't get improved the only recourse there is to say it sucks. Do you also say that about all the powerplay suggestions, or other topics that need barely one more iteration to make everyone happy but frontier refuses to do? Just have a look, its not as dumb as a few people make it sound. Instead of focusing on an assumption (however likely) of frontiers decision, focus on the game mechanics.

 

[DragonIV]

There was no need to change it in the first place, but they did

If anything goes on this game's epitaph, it'll be that.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

The other problem with the fss was also the manner in which it was presented.. they made explorers wait at the end of line, finally hinting after so many years there was going to be new content.. and they come up with that.

All we got was an out of ship cookie clicker.

This would have been fine as a small out of cycle snack, or a qol change, but as the one and only exploration update?

There's no way possible that something like that was going to meet even the mildest expectations. The fact that it was so bad and nothing but a gameplay avoidance shortcut, turning spaceflight into busy work, wasn't the most impressive show. The only thing it really is 100% successful for is the cartographer explorers, people who are just populating databases on 3rd party tools etc. I'm guessing they're probably one of the smallest niches in exploration.

 

[Chrystoph]

Sure,then get rid of all the tech we have and bring in steam powered ships,substitute energy weapons with crossbows and arrows,and play the Space Indian Faction.

Isn't that more or less what the current system is? Swing your tripod mounted telescope around until you find the blue blob, just like Galileo did in the 1600s...

 

[Chrystoph]

I think you are confusing their willingness to deal with credit rebalance and reverting a major feature which was asked for by a lot of people.

It wasn't asked for by anyone, it was Endorsed when it was rammed down the community's throat.