A Software and UX Engineer perspective of ED Gameplay.

[CMDR SJ]

​

Firstly I want to do a small introduction as I'm new(ish) to the forums. When not playing Elite Dangerous, CSGO or Cyberpunk I find myself spending 8-10 hours a day at my “job” in software development, design and user-experience.
I’ve spent the past 15 years in the field starting from asset and concept art designs for games and game related communities, to switching to commercial software development and UX.

This post does not try to solve any of the problems, but instead takes an approach of opening the communities minds to possibilities.

I hope more than anything this post can be inspiring to the community or at a best case scenario Fdev themselves.

This post for the sake of keeping it to a forum / readable length will generalize at times, so I will group, condense and simplify certain things together.
This post will also not push for or advocate for any features or changes, again it’s more about a fresh perspective and thinking in solutions.

I’ll keep this thread to two initial topics for now, just to see how this is received.

Ship Interiors:​

Might as well start big right?

Problem statement: Fdev made a comment on a recent live stream mentioning that one of the reasons they are not prioritizing ship interiors is they feel they add no meaningful gameplay and the grind of walking through them constantly would get boring fast.

Possible Solution: In truth they are partially right, It will largely get tedious at a certain point for a certain / possible majority of players. Especially if they’re feeling the pressure to do something.

Do not forget current Elite is at its core a game about grinding. So rinsing and repeating a lot of quick and repetitive gameplay where you want to do it as fast as possible. (sorry for the generalizing for explorers and space truckers)

However there are ways to implement ship interiors in a more balanced way.

1. You can assign a setting in your ship panel on what disembark actually means, similar to the setting for what should happen when jumping into a system (de-throttle).
   
   There you can assign to: “Walk around your ship”, “Immediately exit your ship” or “Immediately enter a rested zone”. The last option is for when docking at a station, you will ‘teleport’ to the cafe area of the station so you do not need to walk through the hangar (if not at a station you will simply walk down the stairs).
   
   
2. Disembark automatically gets you into the cockpit, but you can choose to use the stairs or use the doors behind you.
   
   Going behind you will lead you through the ship whereas the stairs will give you that armstrong moment.

The intention here is to offer the flexibility to players to choose how they play, if someone is grinding they can choose for quicker options whereas someone who wants immersion can choose others.

Mission board / Contacts​

On a similar note to the previous topic, one thing I noticed is a certain lack of options for odyssey players while staying in their ship in a station.

If we keep to the same argument about meaningful/tedious gameplay, why must I always leave my ship to see a contact inside the station? Why can i not contact them through the contacts board of a station? Why is there a difference between the mission board on ships and a mission board in person?

Problem statement: How can we ensure a balance between station interiors, mission board and contact access?

We want to make sure a commander feels compelled to do some things that make sense in person. Otherwise station interiors would have no purpose other than immersion.

How can I offer balanced gameplay that suits those doing quick missions / runs to those looking for immersive / expansive gameplay.

Possible Solution: Some things such as handing in bio samples, buying suits and weapons etc makes sense to keep those largely as in person experiences.

Additionally:

1. Illegal missions can only be done in person.
2. Trying to get a better reward from missions can only be done in person.
3. Signing up to conflict zones and taxis make sense when in person.
4. Suit engineering makes sense in person.

However while in a ship i should have the options too:

1. See the same mission board in person and in ship.
2. Handing in none-illegal missions should be done in a ship.
3. Contacting persons on the station through the contacts panel while in the ship should be possible.

Again the reason being is that it allows players to choose the routes they want to take, if i’m choosing for settlement support missions it makes little sense to leave my ship to see the mission board. Likewise if i'm handing in a quest why see the quest giver in person if i don’t need too?

But what we do have, is reasons to still do those things if you want the extra rewards / bargaining power or you want to do multiple things while in the station.

The result tries to be balanced between the various play styles while not trying to remove any of the incentives.

I’m curious about the thoughts you all have!

o7 CMDRS

 

[Commander Kheane]

I say it's obvious they need to hire you as they clearly lack a UX engineer—the lack of a completed missions tab is evidence of that. And better indication of time left for missions would be stellar. Such a small but MASSIVE QoL change something like that would be, seriously...

I like your thoughts on the missions, again a very nice QoL improvement to be able to browse everything from the ship. On foot stuff could be moved to the OPERATIONS tab for that. Non illegal/non-handoff missions should be able to be turned in from the ship, if they REALLY insist on adding a time sink so their very dear engagement metrics don't dip, add the requirement that if you want to turn stuff in from the ship you need to use your analyser tool to scan things as proof of a completed job or something. After all who exactly confirms the kill if the target fled 100kly to the dark side of a moon? And though that sounds tedious for scav clearing missions, you should already be scanning every downed scav for that sweet bounty money, you're leaving an extra 300-500k behind if not. This is from one single scav clearing mission I did last night.

 

[babelfisch]

I’m curious about the thoughts you all have!

o7 CMDRS

My thought is that you pretty much repeated what people have been saying since Alpha. Sorry, your thread didn't add anything new, apparently you don't need to be a software developer in order to come up with good suggestions. It's still good feedback though, the fact that we already had the same thread a dozen times just shows that you are right.

 

[Bottom Hat]

Are you currently employed?

 

[Royston Hill]

Are you currently employed?

He said "I find myself spending 8-10 hours a day at my “job” in software development, design and user-experience." Read.

 

[Factabulous]

Pretty sure there might be a few actual graphic artists, UX ppl and s/w devs already working on the project. Or do we think it really is just Dave in his shed on the weekends

 

[PRORABBIT67]

 

[CMDR SJ]

Pretty sure there might be a few actual graphic artists, UX ppl and s/w devs already working on the project. Or do we think it really is just Dave in his shed on the weekends

You bring up an interesting point, Fdev certainly does have UI designers and by the quality of the design work i would say pretty good ones.

However what was noticed pretty quickly by the community is the lack of accessibility, ease of life or direction in the UI. (Map, Outfitting etc)

This can easily be a sign of how much pressure was on the team to simply deliver the MVP to it's customers.

I cannot say with any certainty the type of team structure they employ, how the sprints and planning is done.

However what odyssey has objectively shown is that the work is rather fragmented: by this i mean different parts of the game feel like they're developed independently from each other, without coming together as a whole.
As if different design or UX patterns were employed to the various parts of the game, Then those practises or thought patterns were not shared or standardized.
Again this can be common problem in a development environment under stress, every team works on their own parts and it can be really hard to break out of that and see the bigger picture.

Keep in mind, modulization of work and 'module ownership' are common practises, but usually there are individuals overseeing how those small independent parts come together in the whole picture. It seems this is the part that went a bit fuzzy.

Retrospectively, i am curious how they're internalizing the feedback, and by the sounds of it some community suggestions are or have made it in already.

 

[Bottom Hat]

He said "I find myself spending 8-10 hours a day at my “job” in software development, design and user-experience." Read.

Oooh you rotten swine you! I was going to offer the young whippersnapper a job, and I would have even gone as far to offer everyone else in the thread a cup of tea and a biscuit.

But now you have gone and done it - blown it for everyone you have - nobody is getting anything, and the OP is certainly not getting a job from me unless he apologizes for your rudeness, and you do the same.

There certainly is a lot of angst going around the place at the moment. Can I politely ask you, is it mating season for your species? Or has your basement lightbulb just blown? You can probably find a new one upstairs in the kitchen cupboard.

As my good fellow Koma mentioned, I didn't ask for any stuphs, so perhaps that is the reason you are very hormonal? Are you looking to challenge the old silverback for dominance, as it feels a little that way.

If it is indeed a case of vying for superiority in the stuphs hazzing business, I must warn you that you shall come up rather short young sonny Jim lad. If you do still want to challenge little old me though, we must comply with forum tradition as explained above by @PRORABBIT67 - it will be a battle of handbags at dawn, to the death, or more likely until someone grazes an elbow.

So, my dear young thing, do you accept this challenge, or do you have a forum exterior made of stone? Granted, I don't know what that means, but I have to be family friendly and such.

Reply on a postcard please, or just add another angry post at me, for I feel a little like your parent.


I nearly forgot, get off my lawn...

 

[Screemonster]

the lack of a completed missions tab is evidence of that

god

going to the galmap and being like "where do I go now" and having a mission shortcuts button but no indication of which missions are completed and just need to be handed in and which still need to be done

same with the transactions tab, at least in horizons I could see the ones that no longer had a timer and know they were done

 

[Royston Hill]

so perhaps that is the reason you are very hormonal?

Next you'll be asking if it's my time of the month.

 

[PRORABBIT67]

 

[Bottom Hat]

Next you'll be asking if it's my time of the month.

Hahahaha! My word Lord Snacklepuss, I wouldn't dream of such a way to speak to someone!


Ps I've only been kidding btw mate, I mean no offence

 

[Royston Hill]

[redacted] SnacklePUSS [redacted]

You're getting closer to the "time of the month" thing.

 

[Bottom Hat]

You're getting closer to the "time of the month" thing.

Hahahaha, okay mum's the word old chap, say no more...

 

[Commander Kheane]

As an American, I'm struggling to understand the media references in the thread... I must drink more of this Tetley to unlock the mysteries.

 

[Drelthar]

My thoughts on station interiors is, the real problem is not that there would be nothing else to do except mission contacts and you should need motivation, it's that, that attitude towards station interiors is sad and not very creative.

Why aren't there missions -inside- stations. Why aren't there firefights -inside- stations.

When a station is burning, why is it locked out, instead of a huge opportunity for on foot station interior gameplay?

You're gonna tell me the game designers at frontier don't have ideas for that? They're pro game designers, this kind of cool stuff is their life.

Why hasn't it even been considered, instead replaced by... A glorified first person menu?

It's very very sad.

 

[Commander Kheane]

My thoughts on station interiors is, the real problem is not that there would be nothing else to do except mission contacts and you should need motivation, it's that, that attitude towards station interiors is sad and not very creative.

Why aren't there missions -inside- stations. Why aren't there firefights -inside- stations.

When a station is burning, why is it locked out, instead of a huge opportunity for on foot station interior gameplay?

You're gonna tell me the game designers at frontier don't have ideas for that? They're pro game designers, this kind of cool stuff is their life.

Why hasn't it even been considered, instead replaced by... A glorified first person menu?

It's very very sad.

I hugely suspect they outsourced bits of Odyssey and put the "finished" bits together. Outsourcing is by no means devious. The individual bits of work that went in to Odyessey look great. The thing is, I'm sure that there were a LOT of bits FDev left out when putting it all together because of time issues or something and that's why we have this mess.

I would love to have station liberation missions. Give me that Mass Effect feel. I'd love to see a station under attack, go in "hot" and land where I can inside and fight my way inside. As much as I love being the bad guy, this mode seriously needs more opportunities to be the hero as well.

Edit: I mean hell, one thing they could quickly add is a new type of timed mission where civilian hostages are trapped in a locked building and you have to go in (with a regulator) clear the pirates and restore power before the hostages freeze/bake to death. Gather player data from that mission and use it to build larger scale station liberation missions.

 

[Murfelton]

Ship interior implementation is the problem, not the UI.

FDev has to have a skip interior option, as otherwise, the only way to skip walking through the interior is to not buy the expansion (or not load it up). That would be a pretty disastrous sales pitch.

They would probably get more sales if walking through interiors was mandatory, and you needed to buy the DLC to be given the option to skip.

 

[Drelthar]

Ship interior implementation is the problem, not the UI.

FDev has to have a skip interior option, as otherwise, the only way to skip walking through the interior is to not buy the expansion (or not load it up). That would be a pretty disastrous sales pitch.

They would probably get more sales if walking through interiors was mandatory, and you needed to buy the DLC to be given the option to skip.

I just wish this whole DLC thing would go away so the designers don't need to keep being restricted by having to design in the split between haves and have nots as it compromises the heck out of the expansions.

There's an easy way round this though.

Make sure all ships have an exit very near the cockpit.

Have an animated exit of the ship using the disembark option.

You can do that with Odyssey only.

With interiors expansion, you can also use the other ship entrances, and there's another option to get up, or unstrap or whatever they call it, which gets you out of the seat to do inside your ship things.

Then have a "ingress calculation computer" (or whatever) for docking and force docking with megaships and derelicts, which is like the atmospheric landing suites that give you access to the different planets.