Allow the VR '2D screen' to be disabled?

[Damger]

Just throwing my 2 cents in. Odyssey will be on hold for me until a reasonable VR solution is at hand. A pancake screen in my headset is not a reasonable solution. ED is the best VR title developed so far and I would hate to see it go the way other VR titles have gone when the devs abandon VR.

Also I don't use console controllers or keyboard/mouse controls. I'm a Hotas, Voice Attack and/or motion controller person.

And my desires as listed are not open for discussion. I'm picky and will stay that way. Thx for listening.

 

[VR Dextrovix]

Just throwing my 2 cents in. Odyssey will be on hold for me until a reasonable VR solution is at hand. A pancake screen in my headset is not a reasonable solution. ED is the best VR title developed so far and I would hate to see it go the way other VR titles have gone when the devs abandon VR.

I agree about the projected screen, but without it Odyssey content would have been excluded for anyone wanting to continue to play in VR. I realise for those that haven't purchased Odyssey, fair enough, but as I'll get it anyway because I was an Alpha backer, I'd feel more aggrieved knowing my money has contributed to features I can't even use, unless I chose to not play in VR!

I actually don't think ED is the best VR title myself- for me it was my first I'll give it that, and maybe the best space one, but I do feel VR support has not been developed since release, whereas if it had we'd have a virtual keyboard in the Galaxy Map for example, and integration with touch controls to name a couple of quality of life improvements.

As we've had none, I do not believe Frontier intend to expand on VR support now, I simply don't believe they have any VR dev kits, considering none of their other titles have VR support either. Lowest common denominator is what they're developing for. I believe the devs HAVE abandoned VR.

I like what this thread is advocating, but I do not believe they're giving too much of a sh*t about VR users. And I too agree, I would not buy Odyssey if I hadn't effectively purchased it already in 2013!

 

[VR Golgot]

As we've had none, I do not believe Frontier intend to expand on VR support now, I simply don't believe they have any VR dev kits, considering none of their other titles have VR support either. Lowest common denominator is what they're developing for. I believe the devs HAVE abandoned VR.

That's a bit too cynical for my blood. They've probably got the latest gen of PCVR Rifts & Vives knocking about somewhere, given they updated to support them

I'd agree that VR support leans towards the peripheral. I wouldn't downplay the maintenance and updates they added - (making sure the SRV had at least some nausea accomodation, fixing up hyperjumps, rolling out more curved screen UI etc) - but it's definitely a '2D first' game overall.

Which is why VR legs being a 'port' if they come shouldn't come as a major surprise really. (But it's also why them focusing '2D first' for launch doesn't mean EDVR is dead. This is the first time VR has made major claims on their dev resources.)

Honestly, any push for a decent VR port will rely as much on internal dev passion as management intent and consent. And I suspect neither well is empty. There's still a business case lurking there, once they get classic EDO out the door. And fond VR sentiments are never that far away...

Luke Betterton: Elite is obviously a very nice VR game. You sit in the cockpit, and you're in front of the stars. It lends itself perfectly to VR. I'm really glad that we did add VR support because it's pretty awesome, it is quite an experience. Being able to run around on foot, though, is very much a different experience. We're still looking at the way that we would tackle that if we need to. Or if we decide that we think we can get a good way of doing it. And sure, like, that's something that we'll tackle, but for the moment, we have to focus on the actual main experience and getting that working the way that we really want it to feel. So on day one, there won't be any VR support. But we're not saying never, it's just we need to focus our efforts elsewhere right now. (source)

 

[AvonNZ]

Off Topic, but happy St Pats
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Check it out at -

Source: https://youtu.be/iZ9IY4AwHkQ


Subscribe to see more videos from The Vurch, Qapla'

 

[Heater]

Hello lovely devs!

This suggestion is based on some major assumptions, but it would be great if it were possible.

Initial Assumptions:

• That the native VR support used for ships & SRVs in EDO functions in Legs mode.
• That the 2D screen mode for Legs can be set to toggle on or off.

Suggestion:

Allow players to set the 2D projected screen to 'off' by altering an option file. (In the same way that players can alter their HUD colours by editing the existing XML file, for example.)


Advantages of this approach:

• It could allow very basic VR access to EDO Legs, prior to full official support.
• Only the most dedicated EDVR players would learn of it and want to try it.
• It's a very clear 'opt in' process, where you can't do it by mistake
• It wouldn't be an officially launched or marketed function.
• It would hopefully require a low level of dev work & support at this stage.

Caveats:

I'm sure there are a ton of other considerations which might conflict with this idea (technical stability, impacts on non-VR players) and so make it a non-starter.

And the experience for the VR player would clearly be very rough, even if it were to prove even partially functional. (It would only work for those with their 'VR legs', would doubtless have real issues with UI, and would be unlikely to facilitate full EDO gameplay by any means).


Reasons to do it:

If this system allowed those of us with our 'VR legs' to take in the scale of our ships from the outside, or appreciate a station NPC 'in the round', or even do some basic exploration using classic controls, this would be a massive boon for the veteran EDVR community. The current pause in access to EDVR content is an unusual circumstance. This unusual approach could perhaps act as a temporary bridge to fuller, official support.

---

(PS, if you're considering some no-HUD options for EDO gameplay, that could also be helpful )

Hell yes.... I am in!

 

[Cmdr Snuffler]

I am all in favour of this suggestion! 2D screen in a headset is not optimal. Having a toggle/disable function would be best of both worlds.

 

[VR Golgot]

To celebrate the thread becoming a Top 10 Upvoted Suggestion (of the 30,000 on record )...

Thought I'd try and guesstimate what might be possible with EDO + the VR render alone.

Any knowledgeable dev or VR heads, please do chip in if you see errors, or other positives / negatives to add

• Third Person: Vanity Cam
  • Could be the most comfortable experience.
  • Camera view should be able to track with the character.
  • (NB the vanity cam is getting adapted to work on foot).
  • Not designed for gameplay, but could work for exploring environments.

• First Person: Headlook Solutions
  • Opentrack could allow us to use native headlook support (IE TrackIR etc).
    • This could be useful if VR headlook doesn't track the character, or if it is tied to the aiming reticule alone [?]
    • If EDO has extensive TrackIR settings for FPS gameplay, this could definitely help.
    • See these examples from another game: menu options 1 / menu options 2 / gameplay).

• First Person: Quality of Life
  • If the core game includes no-HUD options for first person gameplay, that could be helpful.
    • (Classic on-screen UI tends to appear very close to the face in VR, making it uncomfortable for eye accommodation etc.)

I'll add any further ideas from the thread as we go

 

[IamMe]

Huge +1 from me!

Would love to have this option and i believe it could benefit FDev to use us as some kind of unofficial testers, i would gladly give continuous feedback and suggestions.

If trackir or any other headtracking device is functional for EDO than it shouldn't be too much hassle to implement/strap VR view to avatar.
VR view will just move headcamera same as it does now in ships while aiming, interaction and movement can be used as standard with mouse and keyboard.
Even as finished product i would rather use m&k in seated position instead of controllers with that teleport/jumpy movement......just strap VR view/camera to avatar!

Cheers!

 

[VR Golgot]

If trackir or any other headtracking device is functional for EDO than it shouldn't be too much hassle to implement/strap VR view to avatar.

Hey yep, have just added some stuff on TracikIR to the OP. Def an intriguing option. Have been digging into its use for other 2D-to-VR attempts.

Can only hope that with native VR in EDO something half-decent could be cobbled together. Would have to get some sanctioned access to it first though

 

[Cmdr Andrew Johnson]

Hello lovely devs!

This suggestion is based on some major assumptions, but it would be great if it were possible.

Initial Assumptions:

• That the native VR support used for ships & SRVs in EDO functions in Legs mode.
• That the 2D screen mode for Legs can be set to toggle on or off.

Suggestion:

Allow players to set the 2D projected screen to 'off' by altering an option file. (In the same way that players can alter their HUD colours by editing the existing XML file, for example.)


Advantages of this approach:

• It could allow very basic VR access to EDO Legs, prior to full official support.
• Only the most dedicated EDVR players would learn of it and want to try it.
• It's a very clear 'opt in' process, where you can't do it by mistake
• It wouldn't be an officially launched or marketed function.
• It would hopefully require a low level of dev work & support at this stage.

Caveats:

I'm sure there are a ton of other considerations which might conflict with this idea (technical stability, impacts on non-VR players) and so make it a non-starter.

And the experience for the VR player would clearly be very rough, even if it were to prove even partially functional. (It would only work for those with their 'VR legs', would doubtless have real issues with UI, and would be unlikely to facilitate full EDO gameplay by any means).


Reasons to do it:

If this system allowed those of us with our 'VR legs' to take in the scale of our ships from the outside, or appreciate a station NPC 'in the round', or even do some basic exploration using classic controls, this would be a massive boon for the veteran EDVR community. The current pause in access to EDVR content is an unusual circumstance. This unusual approach could perhaps act as a temporary bridge to fuller, official support.

---

EDIT: A guesstimate of what might be possible:

Spoiler

• Third Person: Vanity Cam
  • Could be the most comfortable experience.
  • Camera view should be able to track with the character.
  • (NB the vanity cam is getting adapted to work on foot).
  • Not designed for gameplay, but could work for exploring environments.

• First Person: Headlook Solutions
  • Opentrack could allow us to use native headlook support(IE TrackIR etc).
    • This could be useful if VR headlook doesn't track the character, or if it is tied to the aiming reticule alone [?]
    • If EDO has extensive TrackIR settings for FPS gameplay, this could definitely help.
    • See these examples from another game: menu options 1 / menu options 2 / gameplay).

• First Person: Quality of Life
  • If the core game includes no-HUD options for first person gameplay, that could be helpful.
    • (Classic on-screen UI tends to appear very close to the face in VR, making it uncomfortable for eye accommodation etc.)

Any knowledgeable dev or VR heads, please do chip in if you see errors, or other positives / negatives to add

I like this idea and would fully support it.

 

[IamMe]

Hey yep, have just added some stuff on TracikIR to the OP. Def an intriguing option. Have been digging into its use for other 2D-to-VR attempts.

Can only hope that with native VR in EDO something half-decent could be cobbled together. Would have to get some sanctioned access to it first though

From devs posts we already know they tried it so it's there but concerns are motion sickness and they want to do it right......meaning they just need to show us a way how to enable it (unofficially).
Dig up some .cfg file or something!

 

[VR Golgot]

From devs posts we already know they tried it so it's there but concerns are motion sickness and they want to do it right......meaning they just need to show us a way how to enable it (unofficially).
Dig up some .cfg file or something!

Hah, I mean it'd be great if there was some prototyping somehow knocking around in the files.

I'm assuming for the game to work normally in the '2D screen' view it'll have to be classic EDO alone on display though. (Otherwise there'd be like heads missing or what have you )

It feels like too much to hope for to see any dev nuancing there, even if a '2D off' toggle were to be opened up to us. (But lord knows some little 'Oh look the camera view now hooks to the character' tweaks would go many miles )

 

[Boomtrooper]

I'm an avid VR player and get the arguments that VR motion sickness on movement etc is not always an issue - I played Alyx Half Life all the way through and that is a masterpiece of first person VR implementation - breathtaking!
HOWEVER! How the hell am I expected to fly down to a planet, pootle off in my SRV and then get up from my chair, wander to an are with enough space to duck, aim, shoot, move etc with an Oculus strapped to my head in game?? I think some of the gripes from people are unrealistically ignoring the fact that switching from a seated, immobile, flying/driving game to a fully mobile FP shooter whilst remaining immersed in VR is going to be nigh on impossible.... I can just see me waving my arms around, clattering stuff off my desk and trying to duck slamming my head into the keyboard....
However, the aspiration is awesome.... my only suggestion would be an Alyx like experience with a pause button on arrival to allow a player to get to an area that allows full movement in VR, but that will knacker up playing with friends and also spoil the immersion.
I think the devs have an unenviable task on their hands!

 

[Arioch]

I'm an avid VR player and get the arguments that VR motion sickness on movement etc is not always an issue - I played Alyx Half Life all the way through and that is a masterpiece of first person VR implementation - breathtaking!
HOWEVER! How the hell am I expected to fly down to a planet, pootle off in my SRV and then get up from my chair, wander to an are with enough space to duck, aim, shoot, move etc with an Oculus strapped to my head in game?? I think some of the gripes from people are unrealistically ignoring the fact that switching from a seated, immobile, flying/driving game to a fully mobile FP shooter whilst remaining immersed in VR is going to be nigh on impossible.... I can just see me waving my arms around, clattering stuff off my desk and trying to duck slamming my head into the keyboard....
However, the aspiration is awesome.... my only suggestion would be an Alyx like experience with a pause button on arrival to allow a player to get to an area that allows full movement in VR, but that will knacker up playing with friends and also spoil the immersion.
I think the devs have an unenviable task on their hands!

It’s an interesting problem to solve - for me it will not be an issue; I would just stand up as I have an open play area in front of my seat. When riding a horse in SkyrimVR, or using the vehicles in No Man’s Sky or Borderlands 2, I quickly use PassThrough view to get seated, press the reset view key, then play on.

 

[VR Golgot]

I think some of the gripes from people are unrealistically ignoring the fact that switching from a seated, immobile, flying/driving game to a fully mobile FP shooter whilst remaining immersed in VR is going to be nigh on impossible....

However, the aspiration is awesome.... my only suggestion would be an Alyx like experience with a pause button on arrival to allow a player to get to an area that allows full movement in VR, but that will knacker up playing with friends and also spoil the immersion.

These 'what would full VR support look like?' questions are kind of outside the remit of this thread. (The thread is asking: What could super minimal / 'unofficial' VR Legs look like, via mainly existing dev? )

But as a quick note, NMS VR demonstrates that multiple vehicles + character play is definitely not 'impossible' . (The answer mainly seems to be: provide options. I play standing with motion controllers, because NMS is primarily a character game, and because vehicles can be controlled that way. Many play entirely seated, via classic controls or motion controllers, because that can be done too).

With reference to the thread, I'd give a hat tip to the GTA V mod by Luke Ross. It makes the entire world of GTA, with constant transitions to between vehicles and character play, entirely functional through its focus on classic controls & use of some headlook aiming solutions. (If being very reliant on the player having their 'VR legs' )

 

[Gortron]

+1 from me if it’s something that can be done

 

[Eliza]

I'm not so into technical details, what can or can't be accomplished by altering a XMLfile. But the suggestion alone is quite charming!
From my perspective, it's better to get a "Pre-Alpha-Hotbuild" VR implementation (without any waranty), than a "pancake"-2D-perspective.

I second this one!

 

[crashboy98]

Hello lovely devs!

This suggestion is based on some major assumptions, but it would be great if it were possible.

Initial Assumptions:

• That the native VR support used for ships & SRVs in EDO functions in Legs mode.
• That the 2D screen mode for Legs can be set to toggle on or off.

Suggestion:

Allow players to set the 2D projected screen to 'off' by altering an option file. (In the same way that players can alter their HUD colours by editing the existing XML file, for example.)


Advantages of this approach:

• It could allow very basic VR access to EDO Legs, prior to full official support.
• Only the most dedicated EDVR players would learn of it and want to try it.
• It's a very clear 'opt in' process, where you can't do it by mistake
• It wouldn't be an officially launched or marketed function.
• It would hopefully require a low level of dev work & support at this stage.

Caveats:

I'm sure there are a ton of other considerations which might conflict with this idea (technical stability, impacts on non-VR players) and so make it a non-starter.

And the experience for the VR player would clearly be very rough, even if it were to prove even partially functional. (It would only work for those with their 'VR legs', would doubtless have real issues with UI, and would be unlikely to facilitate full EDO gameplay by any means).


Reasons to do it:

If this system allowed those of us with our 'VR legs' to take in the scale of our ships from the outside, or appreciate a station NPC 'in the round', or even do some basic exploration using classic controls, this would be a massive boon for the veteran EDVR community. The current pause in access to EDVR content is an unusual circumstance. This unusual approach could perhaps act as a temporary bridge to fuller, official support.

---

EDIT: A guesstimate of what might be possible:

Spoiler

• Third Person: Vanity Cam
  • Could be the most comfortable experience.
  • Camera view should be able to track with the character.
  • (NB the vanity cam is getting adapted to work on foot).
  • Not designed for gameplay, but could work for exploring environments.

• First Person: Headlook Solutions
  • Opentrack could allow us to use native headlook support(IE TrackIR etc).
    • This could be useful if VR headlook doesn't track the character, or if it is tied to the aiming reticule alone [?]
    • If EDO has extensive TrackIR settings for FPS gameplay, this could definitely help.
    • See these examples from another game: menu options 1 / menu options 2 / gameplay).

• First Person: Quality of Life
  • If the core game includes no-HUD options for first person gameplay, that could be helpful.
    • (Classic on-screen UI tends to appear very close to the face in VR, making it uncomfortable for eye accommodation etc.)

Any knowledgeable dev or VR heads, please do chip in if you see errors, or other positives / negatives to add

This is a good interim step towards full VR support.

 

[Zeke Drexel]

I’ll take almost anything to keep some semblance of VR play in Odyssey - but I still don’t fully understand why they can’t keep the full VR immersion going with legs in Odyssey.

We almost have it now with the SRV, except our player would just be “walking” and not “driving” ... I would still happily use the keyboard for movement whilst in VR (assuming this is how we will walk - I think using the HOTAS would be weird for walking, but could work too I guess) but substitute VR tracking instead of mouse look.

Maybe an oversimplification but it seems already possible at a basic level with game mods such as VORPX or simple first-person VR apps like Sansar and some FPS games.

 

[Przemo-c]

This is a must. I'm all for comfortable defaults but not even having such option as to enable full VR view is bonkers.