News ANNOUNCING ELITE DANGEROUS: HORIZONS

[KellyR]

Yeh, all these fans need milking. Better milk more money out of them. As far as I'm concerned Elite was rushed out unfinished, and I'm not supporting this train wreck further.

Great. Hopefully this means we won't have to listen to griping and complaining from you. Once less whiner is always good.

I'm loving this "train wreck". Most fun I've had in years.

And don't worry, FD. You can't please everyone. You guys are doing a great job. Keep up the great work and keep the updates coming.

 

[KellyR]

The graphics in No Mans Sky are stylistic. I'd rather have stylistic graphics in a game that's complete at the time of launch, than super-amazing graphics in a game I never play because it was rushed out too soon and is devoid of content.

Devoid of content? Hmmm. Let's see. There's NPC pirate interdictions. There's player pirate interdictions. There's player and NPC wings. There's a working background simulation for the markets (which is better now than it was at release, btw). There's missions to smuggle, assassinate, haul lawful cargo, salvage stolen cargo. There's bounty hunting. There's mining (which they have improved upon with scoop bots). There's military auxiliary which you can join via missions. There's a whole slew of ships you can buy and a whole slew of modules you can fit onto those ships. Yep. Devoid of content.:S

 

[darshie76]

What I don't understand is how this can be seen as precedent.

Games like World of Warcraft do similar for ages. In addition to the monthly subscription itself, you have to pay "full price" to upgrade your account with every expansion. There's no discount for existing players, while new players can buy into the current expansion, including all previous content, at the same price.

I've played - and payed - WoW for about 8 years. I don't remember any kind of outrage similar to what's happening here right now.

Let's go by logic: WOW at launch was completed; the expansions pays for the extra work done to add extra regions, quests, models and such; while the subscription pay for servers, technicians and to make CEO happy.

Let's look at what do we have here: an expansion that is basically an extension of the main game; at KS timeframe, this was going as main selling point, like first person. Then they were taken out, and said that they will be offered as extra in the future, because there was no time to release it bla bla bla quality bla bla bla marketing bla bla bla.

And then, when people would expect a 10-15 dollars price tag, you show up with a tag that is basically the same of a full priced game, when we all know that the planets will be randomly populated, exactly like the systems that we all explore now: put a base here and there, random number of crash sites, few mining sites here and there and here you have it delivered to you in good "Frontier" fashion; exactly like they implemented the other "features".

I play STO since closed beta, became a founder and didn't have to pay a penny for ships, expansions and such. Same goes for Lotro; where the only expansion that I purchased was mines of moria, just because I wanted the collector's edition...the rest was priced honestly, considering that as lifetimer you get free coins to buy the expansions itself.
Although regular players had to pay for the expansion, which offers a ton of content, hand crafted to keep you busy forever; while here we are talking of an add-on, which add something that was a given at launch.

I reiterate the concept: here we are starting something quite disruptive, with such price models; and what worries me is that the majority don't mind.

 

[Fire70]

OMG OMG Planetary Landings OMG OMG I don't care how much money!!! GIVE IT TOO MEEEEEE111111

 

[KellyR]

Let's go by logic: WOW at launch was completed; the expansions pays for the extra work done to add extra regions, quests, models and such; while the subscription pay for servers, technicians and to make CEO happy.

Let's look at what do we have here: an expansion that is basically an extension of the main game; at KS timeframe, this was going as main selling point, like first person. Then they were taken out, and said that they will be offered as extra in the future, because there was no time to release it bla bla bla quality bla bla bla marketing bla bla bla.

And then, when people would expect a 10-15 dollars price tag, you show up with a tag that is basically the same of a full priced game, when we all know that the planets will be randomly populated, exactly like the systems that we all explore now: put a base here and there, random number of crash sites, few mining sites here and there and here you have it delivered to you in good "Frontier" fashion; exactly like they implemented the other "features".

I play STO since closed beta, became a founder and didn't have to pay a penny for ships, expansions and such. Same goes for Lotro; where the only expansion that I purchased was mines of moria, just because I wanted the collector's edition...the rest was priced honestly, considering that as lifetimer you get free coins to buy the expansions itself.
Although regular players had to pay for the expansion, which offers a ton of content, hand crafted to keep you busy forever; while here we are talking of an add-on, which add something that was a given at launch.

I reiterate the concept: here we are starting something quite disruptive, with such price models; and what worries me is that the majority don't mind.

The majority don't mind because they believe in paying for what they get. This is a HUGE undertaking by FD. The current game is 4.15 gigabytes. And it's not just planetary landings. It's a whole years worth of expansions. The planetary landings are just the headlines. If it's not worth it to you, then don't buy the expansion. No one is forcing you to. It's worth it to the majority because they love the game and understand that FD has to make money. Since there are no subscriptions, the money has to come from somewhere. Basically there are subscriptions, but they are cloaked in expansions. How much is World of Warcraft? If you purchase a 6 month subscription (the cheapest) it's $155.88 a year. And this is in addition to the $19.99 you have to pay to download the game. Let's compare that to ED. $60.00 a year (this includes the download). That sounds like a bargain. You're going to pay for the game on an ongoing basis if you want to keep current no matter what game you play.

So the WoW users are paying more than 3 times (for the 1st year) what us Elite Dangerous players are. And almost 3 times for all succeeding years. And you're complaining about content? Man. Talk about entitlement.

 

[darshie76]

Devoid of content? Hmmm. Let's see. There's NPC pirate interdictions. There's player pirate interdictions. There's player and NPC wings. There's a working background simulation for the markets (which is better now than it was at release, btw). There's missions to smuggle, assassinate, haul lawful cargo, salvage stolen cargo. There's bounty hunting. There's mining (which they have improved upon with scoop bots). There's military auxiliary which you can join via missions. There's a whole slew of ships you can buy and a whole slew of modules you can fit onto those ships. Yep. Devoid of content.:S

You can get a game called "federation of the free trader", and the WinUAE emulator and play it; and see that mostly, you get interdictions, pirates, a living universe....too bad that this was a 1986 game, which can't be possibly be considered "actual" for modern standards.

Yes, there is random pirate interdiction...the implementation is what it is; exactly like a 1990 JRPG, where you get random encounters. There is a reason why even JRPG does not offer that formula anymore.

Wings: yes; I believe I did probably 0 wing since when I play this game; got nobody to play with; no random players, nor NPC. IF I need to call my friends and tell them to buy the game, to play with wings; then I would rather go out for a beer, sorry. I play with people that I do not see in real life; or NPC, because that's the point of play in open in a MMO.

Market background simulation: wow; I can barely contain myself at the depth at which it is implemented: move X from A to B, the price go down on one side, and up on the other side; while demand and offer switch around. I believe C64 games offered such kind of complexity; but this is the best that we can design in 2015. IT is good, yes, but it is ancient mechanics; we would expect something more than scripted events happening at random time to create the feeling of being in a living universe.

I don't even go on the missions; probably any mmo from the 00 has better missions and more variety; there are few types of missions; shuffling names around and places. You may want to check any recent MMO for some ideas about how a chain of quests that are actually interesting to play, has to be. Again, we are playing a variation of a mechanic that was in use 3 decade ago.

Minig is just getting interesting now, because since the minerals disappear, you can break the rocks and gather fast with the probes; although another hasty implementation, that show that no effort was put to actually make an activity more interesting. Is is more enjoyable to mine planets in MAss Effect 2 than in ED. Better now than at launch for sure, since now you won't waste time mining somehting without even know what is in that rock, but could be better.

And the top is the 400B systems; where 99.9% are either empty or nothing happens; sometimes I wonder if anyone in the design department has ever read or watch any sci-fi saga out there. You can just pick and choose so many things and create a great game experience; instead they went for the "sanitized" approach; bland experience, where the most exciting thing that happen is when you try to run away from a ship that is 10x better than yours.

Don't know about you but people nowadays expect to be entertained; especially when you allow players to go anywhere they want. IF this game was released in 2000, I would say nothing, but nowadays; there are games that has so much content to enjoy, that you can pick and choose where to spend your money.

 

[eumaies]

If you wait til Horizons comes out, you will get the base game plus Horizons for the one price. But you won't be able to purchase the Cobra Mk IV in-game unless you purchase season 1. But who needs a Cobra Mk IV, right?

Not sure if this is sarcasm, but that's entirely my point. How could I not wait five months to get the game all at once? Why would anyone buy the base game between now and December? Just seems like they've spiked their purchases for a half-year period.

 

[Ishkur]

Great. Hopefully this means we won't have to listen to griping and complaining from you. Once less whiner is always good.

I'm loving this "train wreck". Most fun I've had in years.

And don't worry, FD. You can't please everyone. You guys are doing a great job. Keep up the great work and keep the updates coming.

Well, excuse me for having the down right audacity to expect them to finish the game that they rushed out unfinished before they started with the paid expansions. I'll leave you to your Stockholm syndrome.

 

[Fire70]

Words.

So the WoW users are paying more than 3 times (for the 1st year) what us Elite Dangerous players are. And almost 3 times for all succeeding years. And you're complaining about content? Man. Talk about entitlement.

It is not a WoW game so comparing it to one is pretty pointless. Why not compare it to a Free to Play (World of Tanks). If you want to you don't have to put any $$ into it at all. See pointless argument.

Bottom line is FD decided to go down the path they did and normally expansions are not more expensive that the original game.

 

[darshie76]

The majority don't mind because they believe in paying for what they get. This is a HUGE undertaking by FD. The current game is 4.15 gigabytes. And it's not just planetary landings. It's a whole years worth of expansions. The planetary landings are just the headlines. If it's not worth it to you, then don't buy the expansion. No one is forcing you to. It's worth it to the majority because they love the game and understand that FD has to make money. Since there are no subscriptions, the money has to come from somewhere. Basically there are subscriptions, but they are cloaked in download content. How much is World of Warcraft? If you purchase a 6 month subscription (the cheapest) it's $155.88 a year. And this is in addition to the $19.99 you have to pay to download the game. Let's compare that to ED. $60.00 a year (this includes the download). That sounds like a bargain. You're going to pay for the game on an ongoing basis if you want to keep current no matter what game you play.

So the WoW users are paying more than 3 times (for the 1st year) what us Elite Dangerous players are. And almost 3 times for all succeeding years. And you're complaining about content? Man. Talk about entitlement.

And I am OK with that; I am not blaming anyone for being happy with what they paid for.

If you ask a guy that has no money, if he is happy about his used 40 year old car; he may say that he is happy; but mostly because that's what he can afford; not because that's what he desire.

This game (and most of the games), follow a similar logic: this is what you have...can't get a refund so gotta either love it and hope that it will improve, or simply file it as loss; throw away the game code and forget about it.

I do not complain about the number of updates; but look at what they released: find me a single feature that can be considered on par or innovative, compared to what we have nowadays, and try to find a single feature that you may define as completed and engaging, for modern standards.
Let's face it: ED is a 1:1 port of Elite for the 201X years, with sprinkles of awesome here and there; which are nothing more than the teasing that you get, when you see a giant city to explore and then you hit an invisible wall.
The expansions are priced in an absurd way, for something that is almost a given...do you remember the original KS campaign? I believe the pages are still there on google history.

The " nobody is forcing you" does not apply here: I am forced to buy it, because the game is incomplete, unfinished, lacklust of features....I am getting with this expansion, the second part of the release game; which was divided in 3 parts for time and budget reasons. I am buying a car without engine and wheels; and then you tell me "nobody force you to buy it"; right; I will keep my car without engine and wheels, parked on the bricks in my garage; playing in it like if I am driving it for real (including the broooom broooom sounds!). Nice approach; do you support this model, if it would be applied to anything in your day to day life? I find it hard to believe.

Subscription model is working for certain products: WOW still does it; they will never go F2P, because they have a fan base; they will give Blizzard money for as long they are able to play; in the same way that people that love Star Citizen will continue to buy ships for real money, to "support" the development of that game. And this is what the fans of this game do; "supporting" the game with overpriced expansions, because it is a way to get a better experience.

I am fine with the expansion, and I am fine if it is priced honestly; or if you aks full price, better be awesome, adding something not present in the original game (fps and planetary landing was included, so does not count). Then I am all for it; because good ideas and good products has to be supported.
Instead here we have a similar model to the EA sports games: updates, few feature here and there; which sound awesome but that in reality took not that much to achieve, and out at full price, adding a +1 to the year; good to go.

I just mentioned WOW to mention the most well known game that use subscription model; with ED a subscription model would never work, and they didn't even bother thinking about it; because this is no MMO after all

 

[KellyR]

It is not a WoW game so comparing it to one is pretty pointless. Why not compare it to a Free to Play (World of Tanks). If you want to you don't have to put any $$ into it at all. See pointless argument.

Bottom line is FD decided to go down the path they did and normally expansions are not more expensive that the original game.

Now it is. But when it first came out at release it was $59.99. The Expansion is the same price: $59.99. They've reduced the price on the base game now to $44.99. Not sure why they dropped the price, Probably to give new customers the same $15.00 discount that current members get on Horizons. As for it being pointless comparing this to WoW, I disagree. Do people who play WoW complain as much as the ones here do? I'm serious. Compared to that, I think this is a bargain. I would have dropped WoW like a hot rock with that pricing model.

 

[CaptainKremmen]

I do not complain about the number of updates; but look at what they released: find me a single feature that can be considered on par or innovative, compared to what we have nowadays

Absolutely incredible audio soundscape, with layered complexity. This stuff is operating at a near-subliminal level - sound effect details down to unique audio cues for different regions of space you happen to be facing as you manoeuvre. No other game I can think of comes remotely close to touching ED's audio engineering.

The " nobody is forcing you" does not apply here: I am forced to buy it

Really? You're forced to buy it?

No, nobody is forcing you to buy it. Unless you're forcing yourself to buy it.

I am getting with this expansion, the second part of the release game; which was divided in 3 parts for time and budget reasons.

No, you've already got the release game. You're not getting the "second part" of the released game. You're getting a paid expansion... assuming you successfully force yourself to buy it.

I am buying a car without engine and wheels; and then you tell me "nobody force you to buy it"; right;

Whoops, car analogy. Rip cord pulled.

 

[KellyR]

And I am OK with that; I am not blaming anyone for being happy with what they paid for.

If you ask a guy that has no money, if he is happy about his used 40 year old car; he may say that he is happy; but mostly because that's what he can afford; not because that's what he desire.

This game (and most of the games), follow a similar logic: this is what you have...can't get a refund so gotta either love it and hope that it will improve, or simply file it as loss; throw away the game code and forget about it.

I do not complain about the number of updates; but look at what they released: find me a single feature that can be considered on par or innovative, compared to what we have nowadays, and try to find a single feature that you may define as completed and engaging, for modern standards.
Let's face it: ED is a 1:1 port of Elite for the 201X years, with sprinkles of awesome here and there; which are nothing more than the teasing that you get, when you see a giant city to explore and then you hit an invisible wall.
The expansions are priced in an absurd way, for something that is almost a given...do you remember the original KS campaign? I believe the pages are still there on google history.

The " nobody is forcing you" does not apply here: I am forced to buy it, because the game is incomplete, unfinished, lacklust of features....I am getting with this expansion, the second part of the release game; which was divided in 3 parts for time and budget reasons. I am buying a car without engine and wheels; and then you tell me "nobody force you to buy it"; right; I will keep my car without engine and wheels, parked on the bricks in my garage; playing in it like if I am driving it for real (including the broooom broooom sounds!). Nice approach; do you support this model, if it would be applied to anything in your day to day life? I find it hard to believe.

Subscription model is working for certain products: WOW still does it; they will never go F2P, because they have a fan base; they will give Blizzard money for as long they are able to play; in the same way that people that love Star Citizen will continue to buy ships for real money, to "support" the development of that game. And this is what the fans of this game do; "supporting" the game with overpriced expansions, because it is a way to get a better experience.

I am fine with the expansion, and I am fine if it is priced honestly; or if you aks full price, better be awesome, adding something not present in the original game (fps and planetary landing was included, so does not count). Then I am all for it; because good ideas and good products has to be supported.
Instead here we have a similar model to the EA sports games: updates, few feature here and there; which sound awesome but that in reality took not that much to achieve, and out at full price, adding a +1 to the year; good to go.

I just mentioned WOW to mention the most well known game that use subscription model; with ED a subscription model would never work, and they didn't even bother thinking about it; because this is no MMO after all

Well, I'm part of the fan base here and I love it.

Just like the fan base at WoW who will pay $155.88 a year, I will pay $60 a year; that's only $5.00 a month as opposed to the $13 at WoW. If you aren't willing to do that, then I suggest you find a game you love and are willing to support. And I wish you luck. Maybe No Man's Sky will live up to your standards, although that is also procedurally generated as well, but they also generate life forms. Maybe FD will do that someday. I hope so, but until then I will still play Elite Dangerous and be happy for every expansion I get and happily pay for it. Whether it's WoW, Elite Dangerous, Star Citizen, No Man's Sky or any other game, you will have to pay something on a recurring basis to keep current. If you don't you won't keep current.

 

[Fire70]

Now it is. But when it first came out at release it was $59.99. The Expansion is the same price: $59.99. They've reduced the price on the base game now to $44.99. Not sure why they dropped the price, Probably to give new customers the same $15.00 discount that current members get on Horizons. As for it being pointless comparing this to WoW, I disagree. Do people who play WoW complain as much as the ones here do? I'm serious. Compared to that, I think this is a bargain. I would have dropped WoW like a hot rock with that pricing model.

Why comparing it to another game with a different revenue stream is pointless because it is not comparing apples to apples. Again I have played WOT (World of Tanks) for years and I have spent very little on that game but others have spent 1,000's of dollars.

We all get the same enjoyment out of it.... Free to Play works because enough players choose to play what they can...

You need to compare this game to others who use the same revenue stream. It is similar to say Total War. They release games and expansions while still improving the original, no different to FD BUT their expansions are not as expensive as the original game. Why, because they are not new games but bolt on so in theory much of the costs in developing that game have already been paid for by the original game.

There isn't many game where the expansions are so expensive, especially when you are just bolting stuff on to the original game..

FD are just price gouging on fanbois which is a bit sad...

 

[KellyR]

Why comparing it to another game with a different revenue stream is pointless because it is not comparing apples to apples. Again I have played WOT (World of Tanks) for years and I have spent very little on that game but others have spent 1,000's of dollars.

We all get the same enjoyment out of it.... Free to Play works because enough players choose to play what they can...

You need to compare this game to others who use the same revenue stream. It is similar to say Total War. They release games and expansions while still improving the original, no different to FD BUT their expansions are not as expensive as the original game. Why, because they are not new games but bolt on so in theory much of the costs in developing that game have already been paid for by the original game.

There isn't many game where the expansions are so expensive, especially when you are just bolting stuff on to the original game..

FD are just price gouging on fanbois which is a bit sad...

You are correct that there aren't many games where the expansions are so expensive. And there aren't many games that are as complex as this one is programming wise. And there aren't many games that are as big as this one. Star Trek Online isn't even as big as this one, but it's not too far off. A couple of gigabytes smaller.

And this isn't just bolting stuff onto the game. Well, I guess it is. It's bolting a new engine designed for vertical propulsion onto a machine that already has an engine meant to propel it forward/backward. You think that wouldn't be a major expense? I guarantee you it would be a huge expense. You not only have to bolt the new engine in, you first have to design the new engine and then redesign the machine so it has space for 2 engines. And all this translates to money, money, money.

 

[darshie76]

Absolutely incredible audio soundscape, with layered complexity. This stuff is operating at a near-subliminal level - sound effect details down to unique audio cues for different regions of space you happen to be facing as you manoeuvre. No other game I can think of comes remotely close to touching ED's audio engineering.

Really? You're forced to buy it?

No, nobody is forcing you to buy it. Unless you're forcing yourself to buy it.


No, you've already got the release game. You're not getting the "second part" of the released game. You're getting a paid expansion... assuming you successfully force yourself to buy it.

I believe we are talking different languages then; You are in the group of those that believe that this is all right; which is fine...is your money, your life; nothing wrong with that. Live the dream, thinking that this is the best thing after sliced bread is your right as human being.

Since you use sarcasm, I give you kudos for mentioning the sound; nowadays it is really hard to find a game that use orchestra and tunes; I believe Elder Scrolls had something similar; a decade or 2 ago. What I admit is really good is the use of sound effects; it puts you in the mood; the engine noise is something that nobody would be able to pull out; a masterpiece. And the lovely female voice for the ship controls; just makes Cortana and all the other previous examples in other games, disappear.
Seriously speaking, they sell also the OST, which is what you get if you like just the music. I believe they sold a game with it

I didn't get any release game; I have got a barely working beta; which since was published, is called "release" version. If we have to play semantics; I can't really keep up, because people that are good with words; are able to find the perfect way to get out from any conversation, no matter how bad are the odds; and end up on top of that. I abandoned that kind of entertainment once i became of age

When I decided to buy into this crazy idea called ED; I was told that there will be expansions, like any MMO, I was told that I would go on planets and get off the ship; maybe a car analogy is too abused, if I will find more time to invest in the debate, I will come up with better analogies; although not even DB in person could change the mind of many fans of this game. Even if he would say that the game has issues; there would be people saying "you are wrong, you don't know anything"; it happened, and it will continue to happen because such is the entity called "human".

Again, I won't pay because I already paid for the pass in Beta; but for sure I won't buy anything else, unless it is worth the sticker price; and I really feel bad for the many users that were dragged in this experience; thinking to get an innovative game that will be on par with the experience of the original Elite; and found themselves involved in this.

 

[CaptainKremmen]

<snip>

Again, I won't pay because I already paid for the pass in Beta

<snip>

????

So how are you "forced to buy" Horizons and subsequent expansions?


[edit]On second thoughts, just don't worry. You've clearly stated you're upset at being forced to buy it when you already get everything at no additional cost... and I know for a fact I will never have a thought process that can reconcile those two things. So let's just draw a line there and call it a day. I've reached the Frontier Forum Complaints Comprehension Event Horizon - and fear I will go full Sam Neill soon.

 

[darshie76]

Well, I'm part of the fan base here and I love it.

Just like the fan base at WoW who will pay $155.88 a year, I will pay $60 a year; that's only $5.00 a month as opposed to the $13 at WoW. If you aren't willing to do that, then I suggest you find a game you love and are willing to support. And I wish you luck. Maybe No Man's Sky will live up to your standards, although that is also procedurally generated as well, but they also generate life forms. Maybe FD will do that someday. I hope so, but until then I will still play Elite Dangerous and be happy for every expansion I get and happily pay for it. Whether it's WoW, Elite Dangerous, Star Citizen, No Man's Sky or any other game, you will have to pay something on a recurring basis to keep current. If you don't you won't keep current.

And that's legit; you support what you believe in; but this does not automagically make your choice, the "best" or "most convenient". Logic and feelings rarely go hand in hand; which is why we are on 2 different rails. Thanks to you, and all the ones that think in the same way; there will be others that will have hard time, and either forced to spend on overpriced goods, or leave forever a game that they were fond and hopeful to play. Which is OK; this is how democracy works...can't have only happy people on this planet.

I played WOW for 6 months; then got no time to spare for it; and left; Since then, I got into games that allow me to pay upfront, and avoid monthly fees. Expansions are not the problem, nobody expect free updates, except, once again, when the update is tied to the original concept of the game.

It seems that the most hard core fans does not get that point; it reminds me when offline mode was removed; and even there; people were saying that it was not true that it was offered on the page; even when the picture of the page, with arrows pointing at the sentence, was show Here, Frontier played a good hand; removing it from the requirements, it does not force them to deliver with the KS campaign, these features; so legally they are fine. But the world does not live on legal terms; there is one thing called respect, which is falling down on the scale of importance.

My concept of "support" is to buy a good product, when it deliver; because I don't get paid before working; I get paid after. A product that deserve gets money, but when it deliver what it promised; not before.

Not sure about NMS nor SC; since for now I just heard talking but nothing has been delivered yet; maybe I am a very practical person that does not live on hype or dreams or passion; I pay for the work of programmers and artists to enjoy some of my free time, and live an entertaining experience....then it can be NMS, SC, ED, joe and the gates of heaven or super mario spacecraft; it doesn't really matter.

- - - Updated - - -

????

So how are you "forced to buy" Horizons and subsequent expansions?

Check what I wrote few posts ago....just because I get it for cheap, does not mean that it is right that others pay the full price.

The context of "forced to buy" was purely for that specific sentence, was not my specific case. IT was to make the point that the game was supposed to have such feature, and it was pulled out, to then reappear after a year as overpriced "expansion".

Are we a community or something like "each one fend for themselves" ?

 

[KellyR]

I believe we are talking different languages then; You are in the group of those that believe that this is all right; which is fine...is your money, your life; nothing wrong with that. Live the dream, thinking that this is the best thing after sliced bread is your right as human being.

Since you use sarcasm, I give you kudos for mentioning the sound; nowadays it is really hard to find a game that use orchestra and tunes; I believe Elder Scrolls had something similar; a decade or 2 ago. What I admit is really good is the use of sound effects; it puts you in the mood; the engine noise is something that nobody would be able to pull out; a masterpiece. And the lovely female voice for the ship controls; just makes Cortana and all the other previous examples in other games, disappear.
Seriously speaking, they sell also the OST, which is what you get if you like just the music. I believe they sold a game with it

I didn't get any release game; I have got a barely working beta; which since was published, is called "release" version. If we have to play semantics; I can't really keep up, because people that are good with words; are able to find the perfect way to get out from any conversation, no matter how bad are the odds; and end up on top of that. I abandoned that kind of entertainment once i became of age

When I decided to buy into this crazy idea called ED; I was told that there will be expansions, like any MMO, I was told that I would go on planets and get off the ship; maybe a car analogy is too abused, if I will find more time to invest in the debate, I will come up with better analogies; although not even DB in person could change the mind of many fans of this game. Even if he would say that the game has issues; there would be people saying "you are wrong, you don't know anything"; it happened, and it will continue to happen because such is the entity called "human".

Again, I won't pay because I already paid for the pass in Beta; but for sure I won't buy anything else, unless it is worth the sticker price; and I really feel bad for the many users that were dragged in this experience; thinking to get an innovative game that will be on par with the experience of the original Elite; and found themselves involved in this.

I'll be the first to admit this game isn't perfect. There are some flaws. But nothing is ever going to be perfect. You say you didn't get a release game. There, sir, you are wrong. Maybe you should have said "To me this wasn't a release game; it was a barely playable beta". You're entitled to your opinion, but you aren't entitled to slander others. It was, in my opinion, a release game. I'm sorry it wasn't to your satisfaction. But it was to my satisfaction and a lot of others. Sure there were bugs. They pushed out an update the day after release. I was rather surprised by that, although in retrospect, I don't think I should have been. They care about this game. They want it to be as good as it can be. But with the complexity of the game, this takes time. More time than anyone (including me) realizes.

And they have to have money to make it as good as it can be. Hence their pricing model. You'll probably disagree, so let's just agree to disagree.

 

[darshie76]

I'll be the first to admit this game isn't perfect. There are some flaws. But nothing is ever going to be perfect. You say you didn't get a release game. There, sir, you are wrong. Maybe you should have said "To me this wasn't a release game; it was a barely playable beta". You're entitled to your opinion, but you aren't entitled to slander others. It was, in my opinion, a release game. I'm sorry it wasn't to your satisfaction. But it was to my satisfaction and a lot of others. Sure there were bugs. They pushed out an update the day after release. I was rather surprised by that, although in retrospect, I don't think I should have been. They care about this game. They want it to be as good as it can be. But with the complexity of the game, this takes time. More time than anyone (including me) realizes.

And they have to have money to make it as good as it can be. Hence their pricing model. You'll probably disagree, so let's just agree to disagree.

In fact this is my opinion; I am well aware of how a software is made(without going into further details), and my points are all legit, if shared with people that work in the field. I do not hate on something for sport; because that does no good to anyone. Bought many bad games, threw them away; can't just give up on this game, not after waiting for so long...if there is a chance to make this game as epic as it was the original, I will put all that I have into it to make it happen; but at the same time I won't blindly accept anything that I do not consider fair.

I did not put any negative connotation to the fact that this is not a release game; any MMO released in the past decades, followed the same pattern; because you have to release something; can't continue to keep delaying, unless you want to be another Daikatana or Duke Nukem Forever. It is a fact that the current implementation of the game, although slightly better, it is still something considered super basic; if you release a free to play mmo with such basic mechanics; no problem, because it is free.
Check Elder Scrolls Online; that game was a wreck; they had to take it out of the subscription model, because of how bad it was implemented; and still they were asking money for it. I won't be surprised if it will drop to 19 dollars or so, because that's the value of that game, for what it offers. And yes, I played it, I was in the beta program. Best beta ever; saved a ton of money without paying a penny.

Unless you are a fan of ES and Bethesda software; in which case it is worth 300 dollars and is better than anything.

I respect your opinion; I simply do not agree with it. Is not like who is right or who is wrong; it is a matter to compare opinions; then each participant simply takes whatever they think is applicable to their ideas.

I just hope that this game will be good enough by the time we get the 3rd expansion....a bad game won't stay up, even if it has "star wars" or "Matrix" or "Conan" in the title