Any word on fixing grenade spam and near impossible to kill NPC's in FPS missions, regardless of level?

The thing that irritates me is the NPCs infinite battery life. I tried out lasting some guards when I ran out of ammo but they never move away to charge their suit, blocking my exit route.
In that situation? Shields up and run through... at close range most enemies don't track fast enough. You might lose shields and up to 30% health (if there's a half dozen enemies) but you'll come out ok.

Getting pinned with no exit is a no- win situation to fight your way out.
 
Oh. OK. It was the "laser accuracy" that confused me. Again, that can be changed - it was dialled up back in alpha.
 
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I think some people are being a bit harsh. If you have G1 or even G2 gear and trying to complete a scavenger/power mission in a timely manner (i.e. no over 1hr) it can be difficult. I've mostly got a good selection of G3 gear, some pre-modded, and it makes life a lot simpler. Most people are resorting to only using the sniper's gun to kill npcs quickly and being able to hide more easily at range until the rest drop their shields again. Using closer ranged low grade weapons will not usually drop an npc quickly enough before the swarm arrives. Then the npcs stay close together for quite some time, making it hard trying to pick them off. You really need to finish off the targeted npc off ASAP and then run for cover - hence why the sniper rifle is useful.

The thing about npc grenades is they are far too accurate. They will land right next to you even though npcs have no line of sight. Other issues I encountered were probably bugs (which I've not encounter since the last patch update) such as every single settlement Restore power mission I landed at pre-patch had had scavengers present, which would then times spawn a ship that would drop another batch on top of the ones already present. Sometimes that would happen only secs after I landed, leaving me with a large number to deal with, and in some settlements that are small with only low buildings that can be a problem.
 
The grenade chucking was added to counter us hiding on roofs, but their ability to target you perfectly in 3D from one shot, even at 200m+, is a bit off, even if they can’t shoot straight.

If someone shoots me in the back of the head I’ve got a 2D scanner to determine the direction and I’ve then got to figure out what height it came from. NPCs can presumably tell from the burning sensation the trajectory of the plasma shot. 😆
OK, but as pointed out elsewhere in-thread, they throw to the last place you were seen. In scavenger encounters, this really hasn't been a problem for me so far as it's simple enough to just keep moving and not allow yourself to be pinned down. In conflict zones, it can be more of an issue as you're often engaging another NPC when the grenades come in, which sometimes results in shields going down. There is a visual indication that a grenade is coming in, along with a sound. Either of those and I will disengage and move.
 
Always be on the move, use lasers to bring down a shield, use kinetics to take down the target itself.
The Zenith laser pistol as a sidearm combined with an AR-50 kinetic squad assault weapon as primary seems to be the preferred meta.
Using the schofield plasma pistol is for challenge or showboating only; the Zenith is far better for when you just want to get the shields down quickly.

The one thing about the NPC grenade spam is that I'd like a handy augmented reality projection in the visor's UI that'd give me the same power+precision to lob grenades exactly how I'd like.

I think Gears of War had a thing like that? -FDev can be inspired by and/or steal that one.
 
Funnily enough the biggest threat from grenades I encounter is trying to hit "V" for melee default but instead hitting "C" which brings my shield down, panicking then hitting "X" for throw grenade... into the wall... and then I'm brave-sir-robin-ing.
Don't be afraid to remap the keys - I also found the default bindings led to me dropping shields when I meant to crouch, because I'm used to C being crouch from the Unreal Tournament days. I moved grenade to G (which I'm used to from countless other games) and shields to X (which I don't think I've ever hit by accident, but if you do ever press that choose something further away).

Same general advice applies for removing silent running from the controller bindings since most players won't ever want to press it (and even players that do use it will only be in special circumstances).
 
I'm not sure it's seen. When I hit someone in the back, they don't see me. Their super accurate targeting makes finding a good sniper hide impossible and could do with being tweaked a little.
Fair enough - we get hit indicators though and grenades leave a "light trail" that helps with target acquisition. We can handwave that with "NPCs get hit indicators too." I actually think that's consistent; NPC ships use highest threat and can target the last ship that hit them.
Grenades don't bother me 'in the real world', I just back out of range, if I don't one-shot them before they can activate shields.
Which is exactly why I think that very little in terms of NPC behaviour actually needs to be changed. More information about threat levels and a clear, consistent correlation between the reported and actual threat levels is all that really needs to happen.
 
I’ll act how I like, if the moderators have a problem with me they will let me know.

Pretty much all I’ve seen from you is complaints about the combat system and you shifting the goal posts on what’s wrong with it whenever anyone has made a suggestion to you.

You come to this thread, not to discuss the OP’s point, but to warn them of the “facetious faux-intellects” and when people try to offer help, you just make out it a sign of their perceived superiority, bringing nothing useful to the conversation.

Looks to me like you’re projecting. 🤷‍♂️
You think moderators are here to control how you speak? You can't just say whatever you want and hope the moderators don't catch it? There's a set of rules to follow that you are breaking (flaming) in this case.
I'm not shifting the goal posts, combat is not good. It's the facetious faux intellects that come in with eye rolls and selective quoting to appear they have caught me in some sort of backtracking or lie--it's pretty funny to me.
Every time you guys post I see this.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z8pgV74_Hw
 
No problems with opposition in ground combat zones or scavengers near settlements as far as I can tell. They fall to a well-placed volley of bullets like pretty much everyone else.
 
@ op , are you using ingame sound?
There are audio queues and directional indicators as to where nades are.

Personally having zero issues with any of the ground combat.
Use a Thermal to take down shields, use kinetic to nuke flesh
Nade lands at my feet I jump boost away.

Not sure it can be any simpler than that?
 
The NPC's do seem to have infinite grenades.

I -think- this is because the AI doesn't know how to handle rooftops - and so, instead of actually doing the job properly, and letting them use jetpacks, or just stairs effectively, they just gave them infinite grenades and told the AI to throw grenades if it can't immediately work out how to get to the enemy.

It's pretty poor, yes.

However, the other part about it being impossible isn't true, I've completed a whole bunch of missions where I needed to fight the AI.
 
The NPC's do seem to have infinite grenades.

I -think- this is because the AI doesn't know how to handle rooftops - and so, instead of actually doing the job properly, and letting them use jetpacks, or just stairs effectively, they just gave them infinite grenades and told the AI to throw grenades if it can't immediately work out how to get to the enemy.

It's pretty poor, yes.

However, the other part about it being impossible isn't true, I've completed a whole bunch of missions where I needed to fight the AI.


The pathfinding changes required for the AI to use the Jetpacks is probably less trivial than simply rewriting the entire Cobra Engine from whole cloth in Vulkan.

Warframe has perhaps the best Pathfinding solution in modern gaming for AI, and even that relies heavily on machine learning that analyzes how players move over the terrain and attempts to emulate it and took over 2 years make functional. Just the pathfinding, and the levels in Warframe are much more constrained than even EDO.
 
The pathfinding changes required for the AI to use the Jetpacks is probably less trivial than simply rewriting the entire Cobra Engine from whole cloth in Vulkan.

Warframe has perhaps the best Pathfinding solution in modern gaming for AI, and even that relies heavily on machine learning that analyzes how players move over the terrain and attempts to emulate it and took over 2 years make functional. Just the pathfinding, and the levels in Warframe are much more constrained than even EDO.

I know it would be damned hard to do it to that level.

However.

Enemy on roof.
Move to edge of building closest to enemy.

Use jet pack to move upward.

Land on roof.

Go back to normal ground AI.
 
I know it would be damned hard to do it to that level.

However.

Enemy on roof.
Move to edge of building closest to enemy.

Use jet pack to move upward.

Land on roof.

Go back to normal ground AI.
That would fail, because the edge of many buildings has an overhang, which also has a simple solution, which would have the side effect of enemies not walking under covered spaces. It would also fail on non- building rises.

Of course, these all do have solutions, but they continue to increase complexity which requires an ever increasing set of considerations to be pre calculated and therefore, adverse effect on performance which, if i understand the community complaints right, is already "not good".

tl;dr you don't just "detect the edge of the building"
 
Its not hard, its DAAAaaAAAAAAAaaaaAAAAaangerous.

In 2017, when target ships for massacre missions wouldnt spawn, or would spawn at rates far too slow to finish missions? Frontier claimed "they didnt see it on their end" despite 100s of posts and 1000s of comments over time. Forum comments: edit oops I didnt realize >< were operands

--The game is DANGEROUS. Do you want it to be too easy? Maybe you just arent good at the game.
--2 years later, the ship spawning issue was resolved. Oops, I guess that wasn't the 'dangerous' thing after all, but if you read the forums you might have gotten the idea that the only people complaining about it at the time were... not good at playing the game.

But in 2021, where all games have to have an uber-nightmare-hell-permadeath difficulty setting for the Real Gamers, who shame gamers who say "wow this is really too hard" on social media and forums, this isnt daaaaangerous enough, am I right?? We dont get enough stress in the outside world today, so we should make games MORE stressful and challenging, and then mock anyone who says "this is stress." Yes, lets.
 
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That would fail, because the edge of many buildings has an overhang, which also has a simple solution, which would have the side effect of enemies not walking under covered spaces. It would also fail on non- building rises.

Of course, these all do have solutions, but they continue to increase complexity which requires an ever increasing set of considerations to be pre calculated and therefore, adverse effect on performance which, if i understand the community complaints right, is already "not good".

tl;dr you don't just "detect the edge of the building"

Well yeah, it's obviously not as simple as I made out, I'm just suggesting there is probably a way somewhere between deep learning algorithms, and something from the 80s
 
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