Yep, what they've made seems silly. It's just the basis for actual pointful wing missions, but they should have just made that basis, not released it, made the actual wing missions, then converted it over. I personally would have preferred that, even if it came in Q4
Are we avoiding the elephant in the room - wing missions.
Yep, what they've made seems silly. It's just the basis for actual pointful wing missions, but they should have just made that basis, not released it, made the actual wing missions, then converted it over. I personally would have preferred that, even if it came in Q4
My two cents:
- Wing Cargo Missions: Payouts were atrocious. 15mil for haulling 4,500T of cargo? Not worth bothering with when I can pick up cargo missions for 11mil for 180T of cargo.
- Wing Assassination Missions: Are extremely difficult to complete in wings of less than 4 players unless you are flying one of the big 3 ships which has been engineered to very high standards. Again - no scaling to be found here.
- Wing Combat missions: Target count is far too high and the reward is far too low.
- Wing missions appear to be flat out scaled to 4 player wings - nothing is scaled to 3 or 2 player Wings.
Summary: Wing Missions will be unless they are balance against the number of players in a Wing / the Wings combined ability and payouts are massively adjusted.
- Wing Cargo Missions: Payouts were atrocious. 15mil for haulling 4,500T of cargo? Not worth bothering with when I can pick up cargo missions for 11mil for 180T of cargo.
- Wing Assassination Missions: Are extremely difficult to complete in wings of less than 4 players unless you are flying one of the big 3 ships which has been engineered to very high standards. Again - no scaling to be found here.
- Wing Combat missions: Target count is far too high and the reward is far too low.
- Wing missions appear to be flat out scaled to 4 player wings - nothing is scaled to 3 or 2 player Wings.
Summary: Wing Missions will be unless they are balance against the number of players in a Wing / the Wings combined ability and payouts are massively adjusted.
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Umm... isn't that the point, that they are meant for a wing? How would they scale it? You start it with a wing of 2, then you wing in 2 others. Now you have a 2 person wing mission with 4 people doing it. Too easy, too quick.
And if you go down to 1 person, then its no longer a wing mission, just a different kind of solo mission (although i do hope the wing mission mechanics come to solo missions eventually).
Player agency is the thing here.
What might be possible for one player, might be difficult for 4 other players, even in a wing.
FD need to stop being prescriptive about which missions are which and just let the players pick up the missions they want and wing up to do them if they want to.
If my buddy wants to come along for the ride while I do a basic data delivery mission, then I'm happy to split the proceeds, regardless of whether I needed him or not.
If I bite off more than I can chew and try and solo an uber-assassination mission intended for a wing of 4 then I'll soon find out that I need help.
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rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
Disagree with this. It will be crucial for some, but for other the Engineers will be more important. Or effective C&P. Not everyone enjoys missions, just like not everyone enjoys Engineers etc. I think all those aspects are equally important to get right, not just one.
Really enjoyed them when I could find someone to wing with. They were a little buggy but I'm hoping that they're fixing those. It was fun.
However, people don't focus on the 'Fun' factor anymore, they only seem to focus on the mats/credits/cargo reward. It's the same with multi-crew. It's quite a fun experience if you go mining with a couple of players as fighter wing-men in a High-Res or go into a combat zone with a gunner and fighter. Maybe I got lucky by having good chatty crews. However, a lot of people wrote it off because they didn't get enough money from being a wingman or gunner (which considering your not risking your ship, is a bit bonkers). Yes Multi-crew is a flawed if you want to do anything that doesn't involve combat but I think that wing missions will have the same salt levels and people won't give it a try. And then because people don't give it a try, it won't be further developed (just like multi-crew).
However, people don't focus on the 'Fun' factor anymore, they only seem to focus on the mats/credits/cargo reward. It's the same with multi-crew. It's quite a fun experience if you go mining with a couple of players as fighter wing-men in a High-Res or go into a combat zone with a gunner and fighter. Maybe I got lucky by having good chatty crews. However, a lot of people wrote it off because they didn't get enough money from being a wingman or gunner (which considering your not risking your ship, is a bit bonkers). Yes Multi-crew is a flawed if you want to do anything that doesn't involve combat but I think that wing missions will have the same salt levels and people won't give it a try. And then because people don't give it a try, it won't be further developed (just like multi-crew).
Not everyone plays in wings of 4. I play in a wing 90% of my playtime but its a two player Wing. Should I not take Wing missions and be locked out of wing missions content due to this? No I shouldn't. Should we have to look around the galaxy for randoms to join our wing to be able to play wing missions? No we shouldn't. Wings are 2 more players and the missions should both reflect that and scale accordingly.
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Can someone assist me in squeezing my way to the door, please? I've been in this room since gamma and the place is simply too full of bloody elephants.
I do not disgaree and would happily take interesting missions for zero reward, I often multicrew for 0 reward other than the enjoyment I get from being a passenger in my buddies ship in VR. However I fail to see what is fun about delivering 4,500T of cargo in runs, there needs to be an incentive and 15mil credits isn't enough of one.
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It's like the Elephents on Parade from the Jungle Book!
Must be getting quite crowded with all those elephants in the room.
Wing missions finally encourage small group play and spread reward across the wing. Isn't this huge? Do they work? Are they any good or is the balance right?... silence...
So, I agree we needed them but they are unrealistic. There are not enough of my friends in game to complete them. Besides the fact that 2m spread between a group to haul 1400 items. Yet taking away the majority of the solo hauling missions. "Robbed peter to pay Paul" The best solo play now for hauling is passengers. I stopped doing the hauling missions. I play alone mostly, and cannot take on the wing missions.
So, yes the Balance has been broken.
Honestly, the only desired thing in this game atm is going onto a planets, and exploring.... "Not Profitable" but relaxing, and sometimes fun.
Would love to mine in belts "not profitable"
Would love to complete missions "not profitable"
Would love to do assassinations' "not feasible" atm Cannot solo them...
I rarely play because this game has some unbalance issues "This is all IMHO"
I bought a beluga to strictly haul solo. But haven't used it one time because pointless to take one mission for 33 items, and 250k.
So, I agree we needed them but they are unrealistic. There are not enough of my friends in game to complete them. Besides the fact that 2m spread between a group to haul 1400 items. Yet taking away the majority of the solo hauling missions. "Robbed peter to pay Paul" The best solo play now for hauling is passengers. I stopped doing the hauling missions. I play alone mostly, and cannot take on the wing missions.
So, yes the Balance has been broken.
Honestly, the only desired thing in this game atm is going onto a planets, and exploring.... "Not Profitable" but relaxing, and sometimes fun.
Would love to mine in belts "not profitable"
Would love to complete missions "not profitable"
Would love to do assassinations' "not feasible" atm Cannot solo them...
I rarely play because this game has some unbalance issues "This is all IMHO"
I bought a beluga to strictly haul solo. But haven't used it one time because pointless to take one mission for 33 items, and 250k.
I did hope for wing-missions to be "different" handcrafted combat missions. I didn't forsee that they will be just "the same" as we have only for more player. They were a big disappointment for me. I am happy for those who like to do "even more hauling" or "even more combat-zone massacre". It's not for me. But on the posetive, it's a start. I hope wing missions will get further developed. I really would like to have more complex wing missions some time in the future.
edit: oh wait, there are still the wing asassination missions? I haven't seen them yet? Are they good? I have to try them!
edit: oh wait, there are still the wing asassination missions? I haven't seen them yet? Are they good? I have to try them!
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The type 7 can haul nearly as much as a Beluga, and is cheaper. The Python is similar, but more expensive than the T7, but can land on medium pads. If you had the rank, the Clipper is a good ship too if you value speed (mainly if smuggling). Heck, at the Belugas price range, you could get a T9 with over 700 tons of cargo depending on loadout.
Why you would ever fly the Beluga for cargo I don't know....
Oh, ans if you want to haul, CGs can be good, if the cargo ones ever spawned nearby.....
currently, the cargo wing missions are a strange construct.
you take a mediocre paying haulage mission,
multiply the cargo by 4-8 but leave the payout as is.
the FDEV theocrafters obviously thought, if a full wing does such a mission, the credits spilled into the system is 4 times of what is written there.
And that is where i think they went the wrong turn.
Haulage Wing missions would be the PRIME example of where payout should be distributed (aka 4 guys working, everyone gets a quarter),
and not magicaly multiplied.
they could even make a system where the payout is base loan + contribution bonus. (and yes, even combat escorts can contribute by killing the headhunters)
someone doing that 4kt cargo run alone would then rightfully get the 2 digit million credit reward if he succeeds.
thats probably beyond comprehension
you take a mediocre paying haulage mission,
multiply the cargo by 4-8 but leave the payout as is.
the FDEV theocrafters obviously thought, if a full wing does such a mission, the credits spilled into the system is 4 times of what is written there.
And that is where i think they went the wrong turn.
Haulage Wing missions would be the PRIME example of where payout should be distributed (aka 4 guys working, everyone gets a quarter),
and not magicaly multiplied.
they could even make a system where the payout is base loan + contribution bonus. (and yes, even combat escorts can contribute by killing the headhunters)
someone doing that 4kt cargo run alone would then rightfully get the 2 digit million credit reward if he succeeds.
thats probably beyond comprehension
Says who?
I'm not interested in the MMO aspect of flying in wings. I kind expect I'm not completely alone in this...
Personally, I would like more meaningful content... (Not sure what that might be though...)
THIS is actually one of the biggest problem these days
"meaningfull" and "in depth" content. so many asking for it, but most can bring any examples.
and if they bring examples, it sounds rather boring and shallow to me -> especially since noone brings examples that work in a sandbox enviroment
Wing missions should never have been made as a bolted on side-feature. Instead, all mission functionality should have been expanded to be shareable with a wing. We don't need magic 4X payout multipliers for "special" wing missions; just split the default payout evenly across all Wing members. Get it working, and then add higher-challenge, higher risk, higher payout missions which are rated as recommended for "Wing of X+", which would functionally just be a tier of missions above and beyond the "Elite" rating. Then let us sort the rest out for ourselves. Sometimes, an elite Anaconda will wing up with a noob sidewinder and basically do the mission for him, and that's fine. Sometimes there will be an Uber-skilled player who manages to complete "Elite Wing 4" missions all by himself and make fat bank, and that's also fine.
People arent dping wing missions because (1) they're severely limited in scope compared to regular missions (2) The payout is not great, and Most importantly (3) they aren't integrated into the normal flow of the game and hence do not lend themselves the kind of drop-in "hey can you help me finish this challenge that I've been struggling with" type of play that is how most people do coop multiplayer.
People arent dping wing missions because (1) they're severely limited in scope compared to regular missions (2) The payout is not great, and Most importantly (3) they aren't integrated into the normal flow of the game and hence do not lend themselves the kind of drop-in "hey can you help me finish this challenge that I've been struggling with" type of play that is how most people do coop multiplayer.
I have done about 5-6 wing cargo missions so far. Same amount of pirates etc as a regular mission.
Exactly this. I hope FDev will pick that up one time.
Now they start to nerf wing missions and you don't see them on the boards that often anymore... Perfect recipe for making wing missions a success.