Community Event / Creation Buckyball Racing Club presents: The A* Challenge

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Well this has certainly been an exciting couple of days... Lavecon, 2.3.10, Thargoid bases and star maps, sub-6:30 Haulers (damn fine job Allitnil!), the PS4 launch and Premonition being released.
With all that going on, it'd be completely mental to try and do an A* run, wouldn't it...

Good job that adjective is regularly applied to me, I suppose. :D

Class: Unlimited
Ship: Rhonda, Anaconda
Time: 02:12:13
Pilot status: Bloody exhausted

Q9AiQec.jpg
 
Well this has certainly been an exciting couple of days... Lavecon, 2.3.10, Thargoid bases and star maps, sub-6:30 Haulers (damn fine job Allitnil!), the PS4 launch and Premonition being released.
With all that going on, it'd be completely mental to try and do an A* run, wouldn't it...

Good job that adjective is regularly applied to me, I suppose. :D

Class: Unlimited
Ship: Rhonda, Anaconda
Time: 02:12:13
Pilot status: Bloody exhausted

http://i.imgur.com/Q9AiQec.jpg

I can't actually post my initial response on seeing that time. The forum would censor it. Suffice to say it began with "Holy..."

Wow.

And, of course, I cannot rep you right now. There ought to be a once-a-month, "This person really deserves rep!" button that overrides that restriction :p

Seriously, that's amazing. Well done!

In light of the many comments, the next leaderboard update (around the end of this week or beginning of next) will see the creation of a new class (and leaderboard) for non-engineered ships using neutron star boosts.

Can't rep you right now, either, but will later. I do think this is the right call, and not just because of my personal involvement with it.
 
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In light of the many comments, the next leaderboard update (around the end of this week or beginning of next) will see the creation of a new class (and leaderboard) for non-engineered ships using neutron star boosts.

Thanks for doing this, Drak.

Good job that adjective is regularly applied to me, I suppose. :D

(insert mind-boggling time here)

Unlike Rankaze, I can write my initial response without fear of censoring.

What.

Just... what.

Some events can only be described with profanity, and some events are beyond such petty things as words. That is an incredible run, Alot. Well done!
 
I do hope that more people will make neutron runs using stock ships. Removing the RNG of Engineers is better for pure competition IMHO and I for one like that loadout and route plotting becomes more of an element compared to non-neutron runs. Right now there isn't much need to really optimise a route but that could become necessary if there was good competition. Maybe I'm unusual in really liking that aspect, but I think it does add an extra element to the challenge over and above it being an endurance event.

Yes, I think Unlimited is great for absolute pursuit of speed, and also great in that it makes runs in ships that are usually impractical (like my planned Imperial Eagle and FdL runs) more manageable (which is great for people like me who love fighting ships), the non-engineered ships will always be a truer test of skill.

If I can get over my problems with neutron stars (and I still mean to try!) I may attempt a neutron star run in the Imperial Courier sometime. Not exactly the optimal ship, but could be fun.

The route I used for this run had little in the way of real optimisation (*). I had initially looked at getting to the neutron stars as soon as possible in the run but I soon came to realise that the general star density at +/- 1000 LY from the galactic plane between the Orion Spur and Saggitarius-Carina Arm is just not friendly to a 30 LY ship. It's not just the neutron stars themselves but that when you need to refuel it can be hard to find a suitable star where you can normal jump to the next neutron!

This is the thing I ran into in my efforts that caused me to believe it was not viable. It... plotting a route became kind of nightmarish.

Therefore I decided to head out using normal jumps to the edge of the Saggitarius-Carina Arm at about 4,500 LY toward Sag A*. That took 188 jumps and 2 hours 18 minutes of my run time so putting me well behind a normal run. But from then on it was full speed ahead and I was hitting 6k per hour once within 10K of the destination. When choosing the next neutron star it was purely based on distance and even if it was a horrible little wispy thing I didn't go back and try another one. The only real attempt at optimisation was the final couple of K where I was using spansh.co.uk to suggest options although the routing was still totally manual.

And this idea didn't occur to me at all! But then, I didn't realize there would be more density in the neutron star fields further along the way (short of the core, anyway)... I haven't done any real exploration there, so I'm not that familiar with them. Clearly, this was a well-chosen approach, however.

* - case in point, it was only after starting that I realised that I should have used bookmarks for the early part of the route and that I hadn't even got Sag A* bookmarked :eek::eek:

Shizuka can testify to my consternation when I realized after my 9:36:19 run how thoroughly I had not taken advantage of the potential of bookmarks (which is what provoked the 9:35:22 run!). I was beside myself when I realized the potential I had missed.

The run itself went well. My initial thoughts had been that it would be a low 8 hour maybe sub 8 run. Early on I decided that 7:30 was about right. After completing the route and using some trial timings I had an estimate of 6:35 but I was consistently ahead of that. Some time was lost to comfort breaks (really shouldn't drink so much coffee before starting...) and once when I started repairing the FSD at the end of a refuelling stop when it wasn't necessary. All told those added up to only a couple of minutes though. The actual neutron jumping went better than expected with an average time of just 62.8 seconds per jump, much faster than possible in a Conda. Which leads me to wonder whether a stock DBX could actually compete with a stock Conda - for sure the DBX loses loads of time when refuelling but it should be able to make up several seconds per jump. My gut feeling is that the Conda would win but not by much at all.

Interesting. I am planning to do my neutron star experimentation (trying to figure out how to not get so disoriented by them) in an Imperial Eagle, since, you know, I did make that observation about my upcoming run not really being as definitive as I would like. Should be interesting to see what kind of results I get (if I can manage to learn to make the jumps without problems, that is).

I do have a recording of the whole thing. If anyone is mad enough to want to view it please suggest how best to upload it as the raw file is 7.7 GB!

I have no great desire to see the whole thing (watching an entire A* run - I haven't been able to bring myself to even re-watch my own! So much time involved!), but if you would be willing to post a couple of examples of well-executed neutron star jumps (including possibly one of the really wispy ones?) it might be helpful (to me, at least), and I would appreciate it very much.

In other news: In light of Drakhyr's decision on neutron star runs in non-engineered ships, once I have made my runs in Cortana and Excalibur, I am planning to make another attempt at taking Haulin' A* under 9:30. Whether this comes before or after I attempt a neutron star run in Cortana... largely depends on how well my experiments go.

In other other news: Cortana. Sadge. Saturday.
 
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Well this has certainly been an exciting couple of days... Lavecon, 2.3.10, Thargoid bases and star maps, sub-6:30 Haulers (damn fine job Allitnil!), the PS4 launch and Premonition being released.
With all that going on, it'd be completely mental to try and do an A* run, wouldn't it...

Good job that adjective is regularly applied to me, I suppose. :D

Class: Unlimited
Ship: Rhonda, Anaconda
Time: 02:12:13
Pilot status: Bloody exhausted

http://i.imgur.com/Q9AiQec.jpg

Yup, that'll do it ... nice job sir! Glad to see that all the hard work at Lavecon paid off.

Oh, and also ... Holy. £ûçk%ñG. Crap. :p
 
Well this has certainly been an exciting couple of days... Lavecon, 2.3.10, Thargoid bases and star maps, sub-6:30 Haulers (damn fine job Allitnil!), the PS4 launch and Premonition being released.
With all that going on, it'd be completely mental to try and do an A* run, wouldn't it...

Good job that adjective is regularly applied to me, I suppose. :D

Class: Unlimited
Ship: Rhonda, Anaconda
Time: 02:12:13
Pilot status: Bloody exhausted

http://i.imgur.com/Q9AiQec.jpg

I had thought that a 2:15 would be possible and I'm not at all surprised to see you go below that! Congrats!!
 
I have no great desire to see the whole thing (watching an entire A* run - I haven't been able to bring myself to even re-watch my own! So much time involved!), but if you would be willing to post a couple of examples of well-executed neutron star jumps (including possibly one of the really wispy ones?) it might be helpful (to me, at least), and I would appreciate it very much.
I'll see what I can do. I've not done much video editing before but I'm sure I can work out how to. Bigger issue is finding suitable examples without needing to watch it all myself!

In other other news: Cortana. Sadge. Saturday.
Fly fast!
 
On the topic of not having enough rep to give, I found out that you have to rep 10 people before being able to rep someone again. So you can either rep at the random to unload your "clip", or find quality content to spread the rep. I stopped doing the second one because I spent damn too much time reading everything on this forum and was slowly spending less time playing.

Also, just as Drakhyr says he'll be updating the leaderboard, someone comes and tries for first place ? WITHOUT going sub-2H ? Preposterous !
 
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I had thought that a 2:15 would be possible and I'm not at all surprised to see you go below that! Congrats!!
Thanks! If nothing else, this run has given me a massive appreciation for your ability to keep it together doing neutron runs over longer jump counts... It may only have been a little over two hours but I was completely exhausted at the end of it, I think to a similar level as the 8-hour attempts. When every jump is a manual plot there's just no downtime, and that's only exacerbated by over 75% of the jumps being potentially fatal from one mistake.

Having done an initial look at the journal logs it could (should?) have been about a 2:06/2:07, had I not run into an ... interesting ... bug in the galaxy map on two occasions.
Open map, search for system, map scrolls to system ..... no hover-panel. Not hover-panel in the wrong place, just nowhere.
Close map, reopen map, repeat process ... still no hover-panel. Well. Switch to map/realistic, no change. On a route where every jump is planned and the tolerances are pretty low, that is the textbook definition of Really Not Helpful.
The first time it happened I was in the core in the neutron fields, so I just about managed to fudge a few jumps to nearby neutrons and get back on track. The second time I was less fortunate; it was on the way up to A*, and there were no other neutrons nearby. I jumped to an M class star right next to it and used the left panel to select the neutron and jump to it ... and was rewarded with a never-ending hyperspace jump.
One client kill and restart later, I found myself in the neutron system ... 88kLs from the star. Thanks.

Still, I'm only marginally miffed about that for two reasons. Firstly it was my choice to try and do it on the PS4 launch day - and to Frontier's credit, the many jumps that worked properly were extremely reliable!
Secondly, going under 2 hours was never on the cards for this run. Other than some mock trials during the planning run this was my first time trying to do jet cone boosts under time pressure, and in places it showed. I think three or four times I misjudged it and had to turn back for a second pass, and I was much too timid on the approach in many more cases than that. I definitely learned a lot over the run. :D

Yup, that'll do it ... nice job sir! Glad to see that all the hard work at Lavecon paid off.
Cheers! I think being around fellow pilots excited about the game kinda spurred me on to get on with it. :D

Also, just as Drakhyr says he'll be updating the leaderboard, someone comes and tries for first place ? WITHOUT going sub-2H ? Preposterous !
Hey, don't let me stop you :p
I'm not sure yet whether sub-2 is plausible with my route. I think I made very few outright mistakes in the first half of the run, but could have gone a bit faster, and I wasn't far off a 2-hour pace. I'll run the numbers from the journals and see how it looks...

I can't actually post my initial response on seeing that time. The forum would censor it. Suffice to say it began with "Holy..."
Haha, thanks :D
You might be interested in the way I do jet cone boosting - I lovingly call it the "Jesus Take The Wheel" approach:
1. Point into the cone at a speed/angle you don't think will cause you to fly out the other side before getting a boost
2. Open galaxy map and select next system
3. Exit galaxy map, start charging the jump and accelerate out of the cone. (or swear loudly and turn around)

It's a little nerve-wracking to say the least, but it's very fast! :D
 
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Re-reading your post, Allitnil, I just wanted to say the speed with which you make your neutron star jumps amazes me. Forgetting my disorientation issues in the cones for a moment, how do you get into them that quickly without hitting the neutron star? I have a hard time getting a sense of the minimum safe distance when it isn't displayed (and it never is!), so I can't get a fast approach.
 
Alot ... quick question (I should know this) ... was your ship engineered?
Very much so... I don't quite have Allitnil's range but it's close. Rhonda in A* spec currently goes 70.07 on fumes, and I think somewhere around 61.1 when hauling 80T of fuel.

Re-reading your post, Allitnil, I just wanted to say the speed with which you make your neutron star jumps amazes me. Forgetting my disorientation issues in the cones for a moment, how do you get into them that quickly without hitting the neutron star? I have a hard time getting a sense of the minimum safe distance when it isn't displayed (and it never is!), so I can't get a fast approach.
It's definitely a case of "try it and see" in my experience - it's the main reason that I think 2 hours might yet be a possibility. I was really quite cautious early on with entry speeds, simply because I didn't have the experience to know what I could get away with - especially with different types of jet cone.
I did a quick parse through the journals earlier today and found that my best jump time via a neutron star was 50 seconds, a few 51/52s but mostly in the 54-58 range with about 20 jumps over 60 seconds. If I could get that down...
 
Very much so... I don't quite have Allitnil's range but it's close. Rhonda in A* spec currently goes 70.07 on fumes, and I think somewhere around 61.1 when hauling 80T of fuel.


It's definitely a case of "try it and see" in my experience - it's the main reason that I think 2 hours might yet be a possibility. I was really quite cautious early on with entry speeds, simply because I didn't have the experience to know what I could get away with - especially with different types of jet cone.
I did a quick parse through the journals earlier today and found that my best jump time via a neutron star was 50 seconds, a few 51/52s but mostly in the 54-58 range with about 20 jumps over 60 seconds. If I could get that down...

That's amazing. Obviously I have a lot of practice ahead of me. I think I might try to take a neutron star route home from Sadge after my run Saturday instead of self-destructing. Since I was planning on a rebuy anyway, that will take the anxiety factor out of making the jumps.

Also, my new medication (combined with new habits I am trying to adopt) seems to have done wonders for helping me not to tie myself in knots in other stressful siruations, so I am hopeful it will help me confront that disorientation more rationally as well.
 
Very much so... I don't quite have Allitnil's range but it's close. Rhonda in A* spec currently goes 70.07 on fumes, and I think somewhere around 61.1 when hauling 80T of fuel.


It's definitely a case of "try it and see" in my experience - it's the main reason that I think 2 hours might yet be a possibility. I was really quite cautious early on with entry speeds, simply because I didn't have the experience to know what I could get away with - especially with different types of jet cone.
I did a quick parse through the journals earlier today and found that my best jump time via a neutron star was 50 seconds, a few 51/52s but mostly in the 54-58 range with about 20 jumps over 60 seconds. If I could get that down...

I am sure that you could get there in under 2 hours

Has anyone tried doing a neutron star run to beagle point yet?
 
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First off, Congrats to Allitnil on his run. Congratulations are in order.

Secondly. I have stuff to show you guys. I've been typing furiously since about 1200/1300ish and while I hesitate to show a 'work in progress' usually, I think about a month of waiting from you guys deserves to at least show I've got something done. Right now, I've simply typed up to the creation of this challenge. It might be too much and unecessary but I figured put it there and it can be removed later, rather than have to put it in after the fact.

That said, there are some dates missing which I can't find. So if anyone has those to hand, excellent.

In the meantime I hope you enjoy
Disclaimer: I don't know how to disable edits in a Google Doc. I'm trusting you guys here

Hey Luke ... here's some comments on your writing (which is excellent by the way!) ...

"it quickly became a popular event for vehicle enthusiasts across the world and became"
- the double "became" reads badly, can I suggest ..
"it quickly gained popularity as an event for vehicle enthusiasts across the world and became"

"an unofficial, unsanctioned spaceship race run"
- "race run" jarred a bit - can I suggest just removing "run"

"complete the 26,000Ly trip in one sitting. Not that this stopped most of them.

The end result was CMDR Alot sitting at the top of the board once again"
- again double "sitting" (sorry, I'm sensitive to this), can I suggest "CMDR Alot claiming the top spot on the board once again"

"21st July 3301: Saw the close of the Buckyball Run A*"
- rather than beginning this section with the close of the A* run (which rather reads like you've skipped over the whole period of the race and jumped straight to the end) it might be better to rephrase this so you cover the period of the race rather than just it's end (the race thread officiallly started on 19th April 3301)

Re: dates form Buckyballs 3, 4 and 5 ...
Buckyball 3 was 30th August 3300 - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...n-3-It-s-not-what-you-got-it-s-how-you-use-it
Buckyball 4 was 21st September 3300 - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...n-4-Eastbound-and-down-loaded-up-and-truckin-!
Buckyball 5 was 11th October 3300 - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-Run-5-If-you-ve-got-the-soul-you-can-make-it!

Lastly, it might be nice to cover a little bit more about the original A* run (the bumper stickers and EZ's eventual retirement spring to mind).

Maybe even include some pictures?

Bumper sticker sightings! :D

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Lastly did you ever read this?

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/135535-Behind-the-Ball

o7
 
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Hey Luke ... here's some comments on your writing (which is excellent by the way!) ...

Nice comments, I agree with those (and I agree with nice writing also Luke!)

One note though Alec, unless there was a time warp and BBR5 is happening in a few months, I think you meant 3300 not 3303 for the year :p
 
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