From my experience: Fix security. In case you have negative security, you will never have a prospering market.
Check out my post at the top of page 26 in this thead what happened to the market when i went into medium security for the first time.
"Development Level >>"? Figuring out what all these numbers do.
- Thread starter Ian Doncaster
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From my experience: Fix security. In case you have negative security, you will never have a prospering market.
Check out my post at the top of page 26 in this thead what happened to the market when i went into medium security for the first time.
Seems like people skimmed over it, but the change in supply was so substantial that it surprised me. If your hypothesis holds true then Security is a very vital component
Man that would personally be really disappointing. I was hoping to make a no security structure system for a bit with my friends but I also want to make a functioning refinery economy. Looks like I have a lot more work to do to achieve the latter and I have to sacrifice the former.
I have 7 Security already, so that's not the problem. I'm beginning to realize that my system with its 19 orbital slots and 13 surface slots might be too small to make into a really useful system, but hey, learning experience.
I'm not convinced that's it yet - I started at 0 security, went to -2, then went to +2 with no effect at all on the market sizes so far. It might have some sort of threshold effect, but it's not as if Low security systems in the previous bubble all had terrible markets.
(And metagaming, it feels like Security already has enough interesting effects)
The buildings you put in also had substantial combined boosts to Development Level, Wealth and Tech Level, as well as a slight Standard of Living boost.
I'm gradually setting up some experiments where I'll carefully try to isolate the various property effects (most of them have a building of some sort which only increases that property)
Is it just me or do populations vary a little even when there's no new facilities?
A little part of me suspects the answer is in the "increase max population" stat... orc whatever that's called.
This could explain if security is a red herring... if current population is dependant on the buckets being filled to various hidden levels... a colony with low security therefore might experience a boost in market stocks if it allows an increase in the population, within the max pop envelope?
Mine haven't yet, but then I haven't constructed that much at all and a lot of my system properties are still zero for now.
Cheap way (especially for surface sites) to bring security down again if you want your interstellar factors back?
It's a "virgin" port that can inherit economy of HUBS (and maybe in a minor way settlements) wich have one. For exemple : ON THE SAME BODY : Build Planetary Civilian port + Planetary refinery hub (maybe you'll have to build two) and you'll get your civilian port selling metals because those refinery hubs will flip the initial colony economy of your civilian port.
They're faster, cheaper ports which provide T1 points and can have their economy shifted without conflicting with a different economy effect for a less desirable outcome.
People seem to be quite "Give me Coriolis/Orbis or give me death"... ignoring outposts/smaller dockable surface ports that aren't settlements. They also give T1 points just like an installation... but yeah... you can dock at them and get stuff. So, in absence of sufficient T2 points for a coriolis/orbis/large surface port... would you rather:
- An installation which might not do anything for population, is not really usable, and potentially give stats that are unnecessary[1]; or
- A Medium-dockable asset that actually provides an economy which has practical uses, even if not the most effective thing you could do, but you need to build something in order to get more T1/T2 points?
As a general opinion, I think people are really trying too hard for the "Fully engineered Anaconda in a week" approach to Colonisation, and they're tripping over themselves when they put big effort into multiple Coriolis/Orbis' without thinking of the underlying infra, and then ending up with colonies that don't function well. I have absolutely no proof there... just suspicions based on observations.
Nah... the Hubs are simply the Horizons non-dockable surface facilities. They've always had a landing pad size defined under the hood (probably by necessity).
[1] I suspect there's a part of this where, if you don't have the right balance of things, stat points might not be that useful besides giving you a payout.
Depends what you are trying to achieve. The stats definitely alter the make-up of the Eco/Sec sliders so you can make your system more difficult to put into a lockdown, or easier to put into investment etc.
E.g. Wealth seems to increase the size of Economy/None - and Security increases Security/None. Standard of Living increases Famine, Investment, Civil Unrest and Civil Liberty.
This system has +9 SOL and +1 Security (also +1 Dev/Tech levels)
For Economy: Famine & Investment are massive due to high SOL, Bust/Boom are almost gone, None has shrunk.
For Security: Security/None has been boosted by +1 SEC as have Civil Unrest / Civil Liberty by +9 SOL , so Lockdown has been pushed out.
Still investigating tech / Dev Level - hoping they do some fun things too. Once they're done I can put out a set of guidelines & ppl can prove give me counter-examples
^ those are both comments about the civilian outposts.
The question was about the "Civilian" and "Outpost" types of hubs. As with all other hubs, they're not dockable, cost T2 points to build (and give one T3 point as reward), and for these two types have no listed system economy influence (so presumably won't affect dockable ports in any direction).
(I don't know what they're "for", really.)
I can't get you a screenie atm, at a new build location, but my +10 security system almost has a complete inverse of the economy slider.... the "None" state is massive, civil unrest tiny... lockdown and civil liberty comparable to the lockdown in your picture.Depends what you are trying to achieve. The stats definitely alter the make-up of the Eco/Sec sliders so you can make your system more difficult to put into a lockdown, or easier to put into investment etc.
E.g. Wealth seems to increase the size of Economy/None - and Security increases Security/None. Standard of Living increases Famine, Investment, Civil Unrest and Civil Liberty.
This system has +9 SOL and +1 Security (also +1 Dev/Tech levels)
For Economy: Famine & Investment are massive due to high SOL, Bust/Boom are almost gone, None has shrunk.
For Security: Security/None has been boosted by +1 SEC as have Civil Unrest / Civil Liberty by +9 SOL , so Lockdown has been pushed out.
Still investigating tech / Dev Level - hoping they do some fun things too. Once they're done I can put out a set of guidelines & ppl can prove give me counter-examples
Can you get a screenshot of the stats of those two? I'm not in a position to do so sorry.
Is that the Security slider you're talking about? Those are all security states.
Would be interested to see - not seen any big effect of Security ranks on the Economy slider.
I have a sneaking suspicion that a really good healthy thriving colony (overall system) will need a minimum score (maybe +9) of the main economic indexes (security, tech, wealth, stnd living, develop). And a good population of course. And then if a specialization is desired (ex: high tech) have a bunch of extra plopped into that index.
Of course I have no ingame stat evidence for this except:
Frontier is trying to make a rough semi reasonable 'simulation'* of a colony. It doesn't make any sense that a large population colony could be reasonably successful if one of the indexes was crazy low, or negative. It needs to have a balanced baseline. (Example: How can High Tech facilities function without industry? And how can a high pop society be 'successful' with massive industry if it has no wealth? - a baseline of wealth is needed for industry to exist.)
My theory is that Frontier would want to make the simulation somewhat believable, not completely off base and ridiculous. And that leads me to the idea that a reasonably successful colony would need a balanced minimum baseline. This all pretends that the colony doesn't have a neighbor 5Ly away it can lean on for services, products, and labor that commute to work every day. Like a real-world town.
* I am using the word 'simulation' very loosely here. But you know what I mean.
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Yes, i was consciously doing a bit of everything to have a balanced system that is at least decent in everything.
BUT: The extreme change came when security changed. I had good values in the rest for quite some time, maybe except "Standard of Living". And the market values were bad the whole time.
EDIT: I also took care to have outlets for each economy type. Have an extraction settlement. An agri. An industrial. Plus the refinery hubs.