DLC20 Discussion (maybe, but why not?)

NachoB

NachoB
Mjmannella said:
Probably a combination of things:
  • The outcome's probably not going to meet our expectations, even if we calibrate them according to recent output
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Mjmannella said:
  • The current area of interest (South America) is still heavily lacking, and is unlikely to get revisited so soon
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This two are my main issues.

All of the animals i would be very excited about are not easy to make clones and most of them are birds, all of which i know i won't even be getting: coati, mara, tamandua, howler monkey, short beaked echidna, burrowing owl, roadrunner, pelican, secretary, ibis, spoonbill, grey crowned crane, cool ducks like mandarín, pheasants, musk ox, gerenuk, muntjac, etc. Sure i still have some "clones" up in my list like the blackbuck, greater kudu, perentie, nile crocodile, honey badger, etc. but none (except the blackbuck) are a priority.

So yeah if Américas is a show of what to expect the next packs to be like then I'm deffinetly prefering a new game with better animations/behaviours and new features than more new packs with bottom of the barrel or extreme clones picks.

If for once they would give us a pack FULL of highly requested animals (including unique bird types ) that have been sitting there in the wishlist for years and no oddballs that no one asked for the i'll be more excited about the next DLC.

The more time it goes by since Américas reléase and the more frustrated i feel at how they butchered the potential of an Américas pack, which was probably one of the most requested themes for years.
 

Marvinb

Marvinb
Mjmannella said:
Probably a combination of things:
  • The outcome's probably not going to meet our expectations, even if we calibrate them according to recent output
  • Lots of folks just want a new game at this point
  • The current area of interest (South America) is still heavily lacking, and is unlikely to get revisited so soon
  • Communication from Frontier has been a predictable pattern of, "another animal pack is coming!" -> radio silence -> bare minimum of information
  • The formula's gotten pretty stale at this point, especially hindered by the sudden disappearance of new Exhibit Animals
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Definitely agree that south america is still really lacking, but i dont think its that unlikely to get more SA animals in the future, or even the next pack. Even tho its not gonna be a dedicated revisit, which is honestly still my most wanted pack at this point
 

Mjmannella

Mjmannella
NachoB said:
the animals i would be very excited about are not easy to make clones and most of them are birds, all of which i know i won't even be getting: coati, mara, tamandua, howler monkey, short beaked echidna, burrowing owl, roadrunner, pelican, secretary, ibis, spoonbill, grey crowned crane, cool ducks like mandarín, pheasants, musk ox, gerenuk, muntjac, etc
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It's really weird since Frontier went out of their way to give deep diving to bush dogs but somehow coatis are a bridge too far. The priorities on the table are so strange, or just carnivoran bias I guess...
 

Spiderhawk

Spiderhawk
Il fuse some subjects that have been brought up in the last 2 pages.

I’m under the impression we are going to get an old world dlc that randomizes animals from Europe Africa and Asia or that are found on 2 or more of the continents.

I have been mentioning exhibit packs for a while as if they can be released in between other full dlcs.
There are so many reptiles I want to add to my reptile zoo, to the point that I don’t think 1 is enough.
Snake dlc. California mountain Kingsnake. Emerald tree boa. Black mamba. King cobra. Mangshan pit viper. Grass snake. Corn snake. Reticulated python.
These seem to be either the most requested snakes or in my opinion a good variety for completing a snake house.
Lizard dlc. Argentina black white tegu. European legless lizard. Jackson chameleon. Leopard gecko. Thorny devil. Frilled neck lizard. Draco lizard. Your pick.
Amphibian dlc. Hellbender salamander. I am not very familiar with many amphibians so I will leave the rest to yall
Insects: orchid mantis. No opinion on other insects
WTE. Koi pond set of 5. Turtle pond set of 5. A new bat maybe a new world bat. I’d perfer a humingbird and parakeet WTE but frontier doesn’t try.
 

Iben

Iben
Mjmannella said:
It's really weird since Frontier went out of their way to give deep diving to bush dogs but somehow coatis are a bridge too far.
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Which pretty much confirms to me that it has nothing to do with the amount of technical work.

Giving the bush dog deep diving is just as much work as if not more work than adjusting some of the walking animations of the raccoon so that the tail is kept in the air. It's also further confirmation to me that we should stop obsessing so much about how much work an animal requires and ruling them out already based on that because clearly we're incapable of estimating how much work their budget allows for.

I do think that the exclusion of it makes sense if they're kept for the sequel, it's all in all a cute funny looking animal and Frontier will probably also need some new animals that aren't birds or fish to convince players to make the jump to the next game.
 

NachoB

NachoB
Mjmannella said:
Then there’s the flipside: why is Frontier still making PZ1 DLC with marketable animals when a sequel is in the works? Wouldn't it make more sense to reserve those new animals for PZ2?
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And why is the coati and not the coyote or the Palla's cat or the alpaca? All cute, all marketable and arguably better know. And even if thatis the case why make a pack with a theme that You know everyone will be waiting for that specific animal to show up and not include it. Why not any other theme. They're ignored US asking for new SA DLC before. Is Beter to ignore US again than make a half baked one. Idk that theory of the coati is not there because is being saved for the sequel just doesn't convince me.

There are other selling points to a sequel than a couple of animals: improve pathing and exhibit system, improved animal AI and behaviours, improved lightining, flying birds, aquatic animals and aquariums, base game /old animal remasters, etc. Heck they can even use old base game animals that need a remake to sell us DLCs (snow leopard, okapi, Komodo dragon, orangután, spotted hyena, red panda, african wild dog, etc. all great picks for DLC headliners in the future if they are re done)
 

Iben

Iben
Mjmannella said:
Then there’s the flipside: why is Frontier still making PZ1 DLC with marketable animals when a sequel is in the works? Wouldn't it make more sense to reserve those new animals for PZ2?
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I think that's a question that has been answered with the most obvious answer quite a few times already no?

PC2 isn't selling DLCs right now and JWE3 isn't released yet, they have to have some form of income. PZ has to provide them with the regular DLC income right now, as the other games aren't providing it. It's not the ideal situation, but they're far from being in an ideal situation as a company.

NachoB said:
There are other selling points to a sequel than a couple of animals
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It's not an "either X or Y" situation though; it's an "X and Y" situation. For every person who cares about those things you mentioned, you're also going to have people who don't. Especially when it comes to stuff like improved pathing, remasters of old animals, birds and fish.

They're going to want to get as many people in as possible, so obviously Frontier is going to have to have some new animals for the sequel to draw them in. And not all of those animals are going to be fish or birds, because contrary to what the forums like to think, there are tons of people out there who really don't care that much about fish or birds.

At the end of the day we'll never know for sure until we see it; they could be saving a coati for the next DLC for all we know; but at least with the technical knowledge we do have amassed over these past years (including through modding) the argument that "they're too much work" is simply becoming increasingly less convincing to a point where it's almost flat-out disproven by stuff like deepdiving being added to the bush dog.
 

Mjmannella

Mjmannella
Iben said:
I think that's a question that has been answered with the most obvious answer quite a few times already no?

PC2 isn't selling DLCs right now and JWE3 isn't released yet, they have to have some form of income. PZ has to provide them with the regular DLC income right now, as the other games aren't providing it. It's not the ideal situation, but they're far from being in an ideal situation as a company.
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Wouldn't rushing out PZ2 have been a better netter of sales? DLC packs usually don't outsell brand-new games. So if Frontier needs money that badly, not working to a bigger money-maker seems rather odd.
 
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Iben

Iben
Mjmannella said:
Wouldn't rushing out PZ2 have been a better netter of sales? DLC packs usually down outsell brand-new games. So if Frontier needs money that badly, not working to a bigger money-maker seems rather odd.
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That would have been the case a few years ago maybe, but PC2 is one of the many cases where we see that rushing out a game earlier isn't a sure fire way to money anymore. The gaming industry has been hit by many rushed sequels in these past few years and it shows in the sales every single time. Frontier isn't going to burn their hands on that again, especially given that they said themselves that they wanted to make sure it wouldn't happen with JWE3.

Frankly I find it hard to see Americas and the upcoming DLC as anything but a way to bridge the time between PC2's DLC cycle and/or JWE3's release. In terms of sales, those are the safest options right now.
 
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Topaz Star

Topaz Star
Mjmannella said:
Wouldn't rushing out PZ2 have been a better netter of sales? DLC packs usually down outsell brand-new games. So if Frontier needs money that badly, not working to a bigger money-maker seems rather odd.
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That's a shortterm resolution. Rushing PZ2 and potentially getting the same negative response as PC2 is going to hurt them badly. Im not sure they could recover from that in the future. A steady and positively received PZ2 basegame would lay the foundation for a new batch of DLC sales, they can't mess that up.
 

AndyZoos

A
Iben said:
That would have been the case a few years ago maybe, but PC2 is one of the many cases where we see that rushing out a game earlier isn't a sure fire way to money anymore. The gaming industry has been hit by many rushed sequels in these past few years and it shows in the sales every single time. Frontier isn't going to burn their hands on that again, especially given that they said themselves that they wanted to make sure it wouldn't happen with JWE3.

Frankly I find it hard to see Americas and the upcoming DLC as anything but a way to bridge the time between PC2's DLC cycle and/or JWE3's release. In terms of sales, those are the safest options right now.
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This is pretty spot-on. And I'm sure stockholders want to see some sort of new product each quarter. So right now the PZ DLC is carrying that torch. When all is said and done we'll be lucky to see another PC2 DLC by June...

Assuming Frontier is capable of learning as a company, they won't rush another tent pole release like that again. They've put in a significant amount of work for free into Planet Coaster 2, and seemingly at an accelerated rate, over the course of nearly two full quarters now. Just to get people interested in the base game. And, despite what some people will say about DLC rosters or whatever, I honestly think one Frontier's strengths is learning from their bigger and more impactful errors. They've shown that time and time again. Maybe I'm being too optimistic but my hope here is that PC2 stumbled so PZ2 can eventually sprint. LOL

While I'd tend to agree that, yeah, halting DLC work for now would be the smarter move if a sequel is in the works: (a) we don't know that a sequel is 100% coming in FY27, and (b) they have to do something while PC2 gets up and running. Thus, coyote. :ROFLMAO:
 
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