Engineers rework...

[verminstar]

And completely unrelated to academic course numbering systems.

The only thing I don't like about the new engineers is the management of the resources. Scanning bases results in a lot of data acquisition. Under the previous system it was possible to dump data when the store was full. As far as I can see, the only options available to purge the memory stores is to spend some of it at an appropriate engineer or find a dealer to swap it for more useless stuff.

Unless I'm missing something (not unknown).

Just one question...what is the actual need that exists that requires ye to dump data/mats in the first place? Storage limits have since been upgraded as ye even say yerself, so where is the need fer such a mechanic to exist? Simply wanting it isnt a need, its a desire ^

 

[znôrt]

The only thing I don't like about the new engineers is the management of the resources.

well, actually that's the only aspect the 'overhaul' streamlined: mats and resources are now easier to come by and progression is predictable. that's objectively an improvement.

sadly, resources weren't at all the main problem with engineers, at least not for me. 50%+ buffs to dps and 300%+ buffs to shields were, besides most ships losing a big part of their character, plus the infantile magic spells thing. this part has objectively gotten worse.

1999...its the room Neo first met the Oracle...

i knew it! so that lousy orwell just blatantly plagiarized the wachowskis!

 

[Walter2]

Just one question...what is the actual need that exists that requires ye to dump data/mats in the first place? Storage limits have since been upgraded as ye even say yerself, so where is the need fer such a mechanic to exist? Simply wanting it isnt a need, its a desire ^

But the storage is still finite. It gets full. Once the store if full, data point scan missions can't be completed.

 

[verminstar]

i knew it! so that lousy orwell just blatantly plagiarized the wachowskis!

And those oblivious to the real truthy always said time travel was just a conspiracy nut theory and sci fi favorite in the 90s and naughties...well that showed them! We were right all along...that being said, this is elite which means its always gonna be TJ fault regardless ^

 

[Jex =TE=]

Must admit, the ability to create identical modules appeals to the "OCD" part of me and making XFX independent of upgrades was both an epiphany and a no-brainer that should have been in the game since day 1.

Still not keen on the grind or the lack of diverse gameplay related to engineering though.
There was an opportunity to create so much more, instead of just bunging in mat' traders as a band-aid, which was wasted. [sad]

This.

Afaic Engineers is ED's biggest fail because of the problems it causes and the boring "gameplay" it created when that time could have been used to gives us a much deeper Powerplay game - introduced CQC into the main game giving us system tournaments to compete in or even something completely different.

Still to this day, there is nothing you need Enginners for. If the Enginners had been cockpit interior designers which you had to grind for different coloured tiles to decorate inside your ship they would have exactly the same effect in that both would be useless (but still could be fun - but then anything you code into a game can be fun but most games do things that are relevant to the game).

Now ask yourself if PP or CQC "need" improvement. Or Exploration "needs" improvment or Mining "needs" imrpovement. They do and desperately so but instead we got irrelevant Engineers.

 

[Stigbob]

This.

Afaic Engineers is ED's biggest fail because of the problems it causes and the boring "gameplay" it created when that time could have been used to gives us a much deeper Powerplay game - introduced CQC into the main game giving us system tournaments to compete in or even something completely different.

Still to this day, there is nothing you need Enginners for. If the Enginners had been cockpit interior designers which you had to grind for different coloured tiles to decorate inside your ship they would have exactly the same effect in that both would be useless (but still could be fun - but then anything you code into a game can be fun but most games do things that are relevant to the game).

Now ask yourself if PP or CQC "need" improvement. Or Exploration "needs" improvment or Mining "needs" imrpovement. They do and desperately so but instead we got irrelevant Engineers.

You wouldn't know I seem to remember you saying you refused to buy Horizons.

 

[verminstar]

But the storage is still finite. It gets full. Once the store if full, data point scan missions can't be completed.

Since when? Is this a new thing cos all my data storage is full and Im still doing those missions from time to time...never noticed an issue before. Mats are my achilles, not data which is much easier to acquire...when ye know where to look. Obviously if I am mistaken then apologies, but that would mean something changed in the last couple weeks?

Edit...if it is an issue, then its a bonus anyway...just visit a data trader and tradeup/down what ye get too much off fer something ye dont have or need. True they not the easist things to find...thats one point that needs work I admit, the current setup is a bit meh...but still...still not seeing how its a bad thing. Even though if it is an issue, then ye, its an issue that quite possibly do with a little fix.

Little things here and there however do not equate a complete rework ^

 

[znôrt]

But the storage is still finite. It gets full. Once the store if full, data point scan missions can't be completed.

wow, didn't know that. so if the random rewards don't fit in your data slots the scan isn't even valid? that's a bummer ... could be easily fixed though.

 

[znôrt]

its always gonna be TJ fault regardless ^

serves him right for discovering 'blame travel'!

 

[Stigbob]

wow, didn't know that. so if the random rewards don't fit in your data slots the scan isn't even valid? that's a bummer ... could be easily fixed though.

If it's true.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Must admit, the ability to create identical modules appeals to the "OCD" part of me and making XFX independent of upgrades was both an epiphany and a no-brainer that should have been in the game since day 1.

Still not keen on the grind or the lack of diverse gameplay related to engineering though.
There was an opportunity to create so much more, instead of just bunging in mat' traders as a band-aid, which was wasted. [sad]

I think at least some of that will be changing in the Q4 update. Well I certainly hope it is.

 

[znôrt]

Afaic Engineers is ED's biggest fail because of the problems it causes and the boring "gameplay" it created when that time could have been used to gives us a much deeper Powerplay game - introduced CQC into the main game giving us system tournaments to compete in or even something completely different.

frontier wanted a skinner box to keep the general audience hooked and doing stuff. that's just how games broadly work now, something we have to deal with and i can understand that. but i wholeheartedly wished this was only about cosmetics! there was no need to introduce this power creep and the biggest shame is that in the process they completely spoiled ship balance, which had its issues but was a good aspect of the game. besides forcing everyone into it and even paywalling it behind horizons.

so i concur, engineers has been the biggest fail ever, by far, but for very different reasons!

 

[Stigbob]

frontier wanted a skinner box to keep the general audience hooked and doing stuff. that's just how games broadly work now, something we have to deal with and i can understand that. but i wholeheartedly wished this was only about cosmetics! there was no need to introduce this power creep and the biggest shame is that in the process they completely spoiled ship balance, which had its issues but was a good aspect of the game. besides forcing everyone into it and even paywalling it behind horizons.

so i concur, engineers has been the biggest fail ever, by far, but for very different reasons!

I think it's great I really enjoy twiddling with my ships.

 

[Jex =TE=]

frontier wanted a skinner box to keep the general audience hooked and doing stuff. that's just how games broadly work now, something we have to deal with and i can understand that. but i wholeheartedly wished this was only about cosmetics! there was no need to introduce this power creep and the biggest shame is that in the process they completely spoiled ship balance, which had its issues but was a good aspect of the game. besides forcing everyone into it and even paywalling it behind horizons.

so i concur, engineers has been the biggest fail ever, by far, but for very different reasons!

"that's just how bad games broadly work now"

FIFY

Let's make sure we call out bad game design when it's there so publishers stop making stuff on the cheap and work for their money. Look at what EA did to Star Wars - remember when they used to make good Star Wars games (Not EA, just in general) and how EA made something that looked like a game but it played like a massive piece of crap devoid of a soul and designed as a cash machine for EA with gameplay elements added in - they literally designed a cash shop and then added some game play around it and 8 million idiots went and bought it.

We call them mugs where I come from. Happily throwing their money anywhere and then vehemently defending that choice like their opinion has any validity whilst hurting the gaming industry at the same time. Look at Star Citizen LOL - there wil lbe some morons throwing $27000 at CIG you just know it.

If I was unscrupulous and lacked morals I'm pretty sure it would be easy to make money off people as they'll literally buy anything, even if it's detrimental to them in the long run.

 

[Walter2]

wow, didn't know that. so if the random rewards don't fit in your data slots the scan isn't even valid? that's a bummer ... could be easily fixed though.

Perhaps I'm wrong (it's happened before). It's possible that the mission completes even though the storage is full and the data is stored in a buffer. If this happened under the old system you could just get rid of a few files to make room. I've assumed that the new system operates under the same rules and - when it's happened - have searched out a dealer to resolve the situation. But I can't buy or sell materials or data, only swap items for more items whether I need them or not. How do these brokers make a living?

 

[Deleted member 140600]

Don't forget that enginners is actually a good way (if it is not the best) to try every style of that game.


I do never go mining for exemple without the need of the engineers nor do exploration too.

 

[Jex =TE=]

Don't forget that enginners is actually a good way (if it is not the best) to try every style of that game.


I do never go mining for exemple without the need of the engineers nor do exploration too.

Because they're both boring and lifeless. However, the new changes sound good so I'm interested now in trying them out because they sound like something worth doing now whereas for the last 4 years, they've had no gameplay associated with them.

Generally if there's good gameplay, you go play it right? The fact that right now it's awful puts people off.

 

[znôrt]

Let's make sure we call out bad game design when it's there so publishers stop making stuff on the cheap and work for their money.
...
If I was unscrupulous and lacked morals I'm pretty sure it would be easy to make money off people as they'll literally buy anything, even if it's detrimental to them in the long run.

yeah you have a point there, but ... most people seem to love engineers. see?

majority doesn't need to conform to my (or your) tastes, or even be right. it's where the money is.

i'm not even in a position to say my opinion on game trends is better or more qualified. it's just how i see it. i'm used to be in minority and i can usually chugg along with the masses just fine. they want loot boxes and specials? let them have them! want to spend several thousand $ on a game? good for them! it was just a big disappointment to me seeing how engineers negatively impacted combat, ship balance and character and open gameplay. if they at least could have done it more subtly, with sidegrades or even small bonusses ... imo they just trashed the whole thing.

 

[Stigbob]

Perhaps I'm wrong (it's happened before). It's possible that the mission completes even though the storage is full and the data is stored in a buffer. If this happened under the old system you could just get rid of a few files to make room. I've assumed that the new system operates under the same rules and - when it's happened - have searched out a dealer to resolve the situation. But I can't buy or sell materials or data, only swap items for more items whether I need them or not. How do these brokers make a living?

I'd say you are definitely wrong, there are plenty of people looking for lame excuses to complain about things that don't actually happen though so you've made some people happy at least.

The brokers are there purely for convenience.

 

[Jex =TE=]

yeah you have a point there, but ... most people seem to love engineers. see?

majority doesn't need to conform to my (or your) tastes, or even be right. it's where the money is.

i'm not even in a position to say my opinion on game trends is better or more qualified. it's just how i see it. i'm used to be in minority and i can usually chugg along with the masses just fine. they want look boxes and specials? let them have them! want to spend several thousand $ on a game? good for them! it was just a big disappointment to me seeing how engineers negatively impacted combat, ship balance and character and open gameplay. if they at least could have done it more subtly, with sidegrades or even small bonusses ... imo they just trashed the whole thing.

If I served up a two drinks, one containing urine and one containing non alcholic beer, you're going to choose the urine every time but that doesn't make it good, right?

But I dunno if "most" people love the Engineers but it doesn't really matter. Because had we had better stuff added, then more people would like that. We know for a fact that Engineer's uses the worst game design mechanics possible as well. So I can't really take anyone seriously that likes it when discussing it as not only is it mindless repitition, but it also pretty much broke the game.