Um... er... No?
(in response to OP)
(in response to OP)
Explorers : would you consider giving up on the infinite honk for...?
- Thread starter Godsailsaqueen
- Start date
For what it's worth, I understand every case of different tastes and what not, but I don't really get the semantics part of this kind of answer. It is infinite in one system. And what's the point of debating what's infinite or not, system or galaxy wise - my question precisely pointed at infinite honking in a single system, which seemed already very generous to me.
What's the point here - does the ADS make more sense because it does not scan an entire sector? is 12 a good number because it is far below 1200? do we justify its actual situation in the fact that It could reveal much more.
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As for the rest, I must say 33 pages actually convinced me that the ADS is not a mechanic to change. I wanted to know, now I know. So far so good.
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Still disagree with it... if anything your point makes it even more disagreeable.
Adding steps is fine, providing it is done appropriately and adds measured benefit. Whole sale changing of a mechanic flies in the face of nominal common sense, especially when it turns a relatively simple process into a much longer and annoying grind.
I think leaving the ADS is fine the way it is, I don't see the point on ruining everyone else's fun who like the ADS just because its too easy and not satisfying for some of you guys. Basically I think the only way to get around your complaints or wishes for exploration would to have a separate set of "Challenge/Hard Mode" scanners(System and Surface Scanners) that you can buy and have whatever mechanic you guys would desire(if you could come up to a consensus) to reinvigorate some interest back into exploring according to your expectations. But we would still have the option of ADS and stock Discovery scanners we currently have, that way the people that desire more of the challenge get what they want and easy mode gets easy mode.
I always read the absence of "no ETA, no Guarantee" as being the equivalent of a "Sandy Promise" that said feature will be in the game
.......why'd ya have to go and ruin it for me, Sandro?
But the new process doesn't have to be a grind.
Sandro is talking about implementing new discovery and exploration tools, and then also introducing new things to find and explore. The current overly simplistic mechanic won't allow for gameplay expansion of that type, so it makes sense to introduce new mechanics doesn't it?
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What about a new scanner that has a number of different modes? At it's most basic level, it does the equivalent of the advanced discovery scanner. However the more advanced function offer ever more increasing levels of detail for exploration of a particular star system. That way people who enjoy the current mechanic can continue playing as they currently do, whilst those who want something deeper, have more options...
That is another option having a blend of both, I'd personally be the type to use something Casual and a bit more advanced but I know not everyone in this game would enjoy that(I have people that refer to me a masochist in the past for Exploring out in the Rift and what not). I mean having a blended scanner wouldn't be a horrible idea either so that if you are tired of the intricacies you can flip on "Easy mode". I just want to make sure you guys respect the Casual explorer too.
Hopefully once people see what Frontier comes up with (including added eye candy), they will expand their view of what's fun and become less surgically attached to the current grindy yet shallow scan mechanic.
Yes, yes it does, and thankfully it kinda sounds like Sandro understands this too.
Please delete...
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Indeed; I'm all for a replacement of mechanics (but not just a plain rip out a thing because purists have some axe to grind) so that they build on what has come before. Also maybe a little less beige? Yeah. But I digress.
That's the key right there. In the current situation the only reward for a more elaborate system revealing mechanic is finding out what type of planet is hidden behind that mechanic. Any new exploration mechanic hinges on greatly improving that reward. The carrot needs to be tasty enough. After that, the mechanic must not be repetitive. Which means it needs to interact with whatever one is able to discover. Resulting in a variation of ways in which that mechanic can play out.
If the carrot becomes stale after a short while, or the mechanism become repetitive after a short while, the new process will be a grind, and a lengthy one at that, which in turn means the ADS would be the preferred option. FD needs to get both aspects right. And both are very difficult to get right.
Hope for the best, expect nothing, fear the worst
(I was going to include Zulu Romeo's post but the iPad wouldn't allow me to scroll to the end to type!)
Zulu Romeo, this would flesh things out a bit and in some ways similar to my ideas (scroll back in this thread).
Having more variety to the scanning and higher rewards, both financially and in game play, for more detailed investigation would be ideal. My idea was to have orbital scanning, with the different grades giving better resolutions, scan width and optimum scanning height. The resulting data (a) being able to be sold at stations for a premium, especially in mining systems, and (b) showing POIs and surface structures.
Another, very simple idea for making the "twirly thing" scans more interesting would be to print and scroll the body's information in the top-right info panel as the scan is happening. It would make it look as if you are actually doing something and give the player something to look at and read during the boring wait.
Zulu Romeo, this would flesh things out a bit and in some ways similar to my ideas (scroll back in this thread).
Having more variety to the scanning and higher rewards, both financially and in game play, for more detailed investigation would be ideal. My idea was to have orbital scanning, with the different grades giving better resolutions, scan width and optimum scanning height. The resulting data (a) being able to be sold at stations for a premium, especially in mining systems, and (b) showing POIs and surface structures.
Another, very simple idea for making the "twirly thing" scans more interesting would be to print and scroll the body's information in the top-right info panel as the scan is happening. It would make it look as if you are actually doing something and give the player something to look at and read during the boring wait.
The ADS has wider utility outside of exploration, the affects of "nerfing" it would also not benefit exploration AT ALL IMO.
I am not against the principle of "adding" things that the ADS can not detect nor expanding on or changing the surface scan mechanics.
As for the current "simplistic" mechanics not allowing for it? That is just tunnel vision in play, try thinking outside the Parallax Exploration Crusade box and you should see the truth in what I am saying.
That would be functionally useful too. Being able to review your detailed scan without switching to the system map would be great.
Voice Attack must be sick of me saying "open system map".
I wouldn't call it "NERFing", more finessing. The current discovery scanner mechanic was thrown in during beta as a quick placeholder.
I would like to see it subtly changed so that instead of based on absolute distance it's based upon the "visibility" of the body, with the three types being able to resolve less and less "visible" objects. The ADS would still be able to "see" all planets and moons within a couple of hundred thousand light seconds but beyond that only larger or luminous objects, so at Hutton distances it would be at its limit to see planet Eden... which may need a boost of some kind to do so (maybe having to get away from the main star to scan to avoid stellar interference?).
Game play is always about a work/reward balance. Reward without work/skill is boring and becomes "grindy". Too much work without reward is also "grindy". Work without feedback, e.g. Point, click wait for twirly thing without anything interesting happening, is frustrating and boring.
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If all you do is ADS then exploration would be boring but it is only the first step in the process... this step has wider implications outside of pure exploration so should be left (mostly) as is (some rebalancing of the BDS and IDS may be not unwarranted). Those heavily focused on messing with the DS mechanics seem to be ignoring the wider implications of such a change.
The surface scans, which are exploration centric, do currently depend on visibility and range - this is the area which should be built on and refined.
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