FD's huge mistake in taking consequences out of the game in favour of a do what you want when you want mentality

I think one of the biggest problems with Elite Dangerous is that Frontier Developments has made a huge mistake by taking any meaningful consequences out of the game in favour of being do whatever they want, whenever they want during the game, but the problem is, this kind of attitude takes more away from the game than it adds.

For instance, piracy is a huge part of the game and it helps to create danger within the universe and makes it more exciting for everyone else. With the current game mechanics this is however a farfetched dream, because the current game mechanics only give you a small bounty for your criminal activities when really the consequences if done correctly would add more depth to the game by making it feel like you are a pirate, a smuggler or even an assassin. By having a piracy ranking that goes up as you commit more and more crime the harder it becomes to harder to dock at action stations. For instance, if you are committing crime in Federal space it won’t be long before you are prevented from docking at any space station in any system belonging to the federation because you are a criminal scum bag. In actual fact, in high Security Systems you will be lucky if you managed to get to the station to even begin to think about requesting docking.

This would mean making more advantage of pirate bases that are dotted throughout the galaxy, and some of these may also be hidden deep in remote asteroid belts where they can take safe refuge from bounty hunters and police forces. It may even be the case that the murderers who have been banned from docking at any faction station apart from maybe a few independent systems can only dock and these are hidden pirate bases. That the bonus is that it would make great use of the new asteroid stations and actually give them a viable purpose in game.

These bases can also have unique missions and career paths that enable the pirate to rank up and gain access to top secret bases and engineers that can create unique equipment that only pirates can use in order to achieve the criminal activities. Of course, there is a downside to having pirate bases, for example, not having access to the best ships, the best equipment even A rated upgrades seeing as everything has to be brought off the black market and as such is very expensive and rare as well, seeing as the high ranking pirates have no access to high tech stations in any of the major factions area row of influence.

Being a pirate would also mean not having access to any of the best trade routes seeing as you can’t dock at any of the major faction’s stations. You may have access to some independent systems but that would be about it but they will most definitely not have access to the most profitable trade routes at all.

This alone will create so much game play for the players it will be amazing, but the problem is frontier developments has completely closed off any kind of meaningful game play by having the philosophy of any player being able to do what they want when they want. Instead what we get for piracy is some limpets and that’s about it, there is no interaction with the NPC’s and as a reward for a criminal activity all we get is a 9000 credit bounty planted on our heads to make us feel like pirates.

This then has a massive impact on those who wish to play as bounty hunters, because with properly developed pirates you can properly developed bounty hunters and as a rank they get access to their own engineers who can create unique items that enable them to hunt and track pirates. For instance tracker limpets which can latch on to pirate ships so the bounty hunters come for help find where the pirate’s base of operations are.

So please frontier developments change the philosophy of the way that you are making this game because right now you are making it very shallow very dull and there anything but the elite universe which is described in your rich lore that you have created.

And it is not piracy or bounty hunting which is a problem, it is all career paths that to the problem. Mining, trading, military careers, exploring, the whole lot is devoid of any meaningful depth. I mean can you imagine, proper developed faction paths, where you can rank up with the federation with a properly developed career paths, which could expand in to privateering, navy, spy's and double agents, the only way to partially rank up with two factions. But this can't happen with FD's current philosophy of lack of consequences in favour of a shallow do what you want when you want mentality.

EDIT: Can a mod change the title to "FD's huge mistake in taking consequences out of the game in favour of a do what you want when you want mentality" please.

A good post with some good points raised. But let's not forget Elite Dangerous is an evolving project and that the FDevs are actually listening to the community's constructive criticisms in order to improve the gameplay. I'm sure they've got a decent 'to do list' pile sat in front of them as we speak with some of the changes you've suggested in among there somewhere ;)
 
I think one of the biggest problems with Elite Dangerous is that Frontier Developments has made a huge mistake by taking any meaningful consequences out of the game in favour of being do whatever they want, whenever they want during the game, but the problem is, this kind of attitude takes more away from the game than it adds.

Reading the whole DDA, I had such high hopes for Elite when it first released. Now i think it misssed that boat for good. It is all downhill from here folks, I am just waiting for win the galaxy button now :)
 
Yes it is evolving to be a bland and uninspired game.

It has always been like that. There was still hope a year ago things would change over time with the season model, but they clearly didn't change at all and, for me, it killed my faith in the game.

Sure Elite looks absolutely gorgeous, it's a space enthusiast dream come true but the game ultimately lacks direction and focus, its personality lackluster, tepid and spreaded thin all over the place trying to appeal to many different and sometimes even opposite playstyles, but fully satisfying none of them. This translates in a gorgeous adventure to look at, but a very mediocre videogame.
 
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Goose4291

Banned
Wanna bet they would make a crappy system like Powerplay?

I just wish they tied PP to the regular reputation system and had the PP factions actual ACTIONS affect relations between the major factions.

- If Senator Patreus use his PRIVATE FLEET to enforce imperial law and CHANGE the ways of a Federation system then there should be WAR between the super powers.

Even worse.

- If the current EMPRESS of the Empire, also a PP faction leader send her private Spanish Inquisition to plant "proof" of corruption in a Federation system then you have a DEFINITE action of hostile takeover by another galactic power.

Those things tend to lead to WAR. And the actions we take as players would FACILITATE those wars because we would make them happen.

And yet, PP sits on the sidelines and is a completely separate entity from the game except that each PP faction loves to murder each other and destabilize systems openly.

It has to sadly, due to the entitled nature of our playerbase.

"I dont want to play powerplay, so it shouldnt affect my game. Frontier, I am time poor and was a superbacker who has played nothing but Elite since 1984..." ad naseum.

We saw it recently again with people wanting special opt outs from the BGS.
 
Brilliant idea and it's also how old Freelancer did it, the mechanics of that is your rating was dependent on your activities so shooting something that was hostile to the pirates gave you a small amount of kudo's for pirates BUT negatives for the team you attacked and it works perfectly.

All FDEV has to do is a system when the main three are the organisations so wracking huge bounties has consequences other than getting 200Cr in a CZ gets you attacked over the Thargoid invasion fleet with an endless supply of popcorn.
 
It has not been Elite DANGEROUS for over year.

Risk, reward and consequences in it's many forms has GONE.
Power play showed some promise, but seems to be dead with little reason to pick faction apart from special WEAPONS (AGAIN).
 
This is what happens when you let people spout "but you said I could play mah way!!1!" when they don't get what they want.

Education is needed so hard. "Play" how you damn want. Outfit your ship how you want, do the activities you want and in the manner you want.

But don't expect the outcomes to be what you are demanding. I might "want" an Eagle with 720T cargo capacity to "play mah way" but that's just damn ludicrous, in the same way you can't expect the universe around you to go "whoa man, let's not pirate that dude, he's playing his way". Man up, deal with the task in front of you instead of moving goalposts.
 
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Heck if they implemented the Freelancer model it would kick every other space thing in the nads and would get some of the old players back to the game.
 
This is what happens when you let people spout "but you said I could play mah way!!1!" when they don't get what they want.

But they can, just as I CAN go out and murder 50 people in cold blood.

It's just that all actions have consequences and the cops would hunt me until im captured or dead.
 
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But they can, just as I CAN go out and murder 50 people in cold blood.

It's just that all actions have consequences and the cops would hunt me until im captured or dead.

Exactly my point.

(Let's see what other accents I can fit on that word).

Some people take "play my way" to mean "get my way".
 
Please note... The OP was not about crime and punishment, but consequences of all players action within game. Piracy is just an easy one to use as an example.

For example, what are consequences of siding with the federation? How will the Alliance react after you turn up on their door steep? Would a federation player get access to the imperial commodities market without a price hike for being a dirty federal scumbag.

It's consequences, it's all about consequences.

Trading should come with consequences, safe routes give small profits, whilst trade routes through dangerous pirate infested areas means big profits. Short one jump trade routes would no longer exist, because these would be saturated by local trades... so small profits once again.

Becoming a pirate doesn't stop you from becoming a bounty hunter, after learning the error of your ways.... it just means you have to work hard to re establish the galaxies trust in you.

Edit: will ammend original post to include this.
 
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Please note... this is not a out crime and punishment, but consequences.

The consequence of siding with the federation has no bearing on C&P, its about feeling the choices we make.


Becoming a pirate doesn't stop you from becoming a bounty hunter, after learning the error of your ways.... it just means you have to work hard to re establish the galaxies trust in you.

Edit: will ammend original post to include this.

Yes, i agree.

- Can only apply to ONE major factions military
- Does not HAVE to side with a military faction
- Siding with ONE military faction makes THAT rank rise faster
- The OTHER faction would take twice as long
- NOT siding with a military faction makes BOTH factions take twice as long
- Fighting against a major faction in a combat zone should drop you a rank (damn traitor)
- Siding with one minor faction should lower your standing in the other (corporate enemies, criminal gangs)
 
It has to sadly, due to the entitled nature of our playerbase.

"I dont want to play powerplay, so it shouldn't affect my game. Frontier, I am time poor and was a superbacker who has played nothing but Elite since 1984..." ad naseum.

We saw it recently again with people wanting special opt outs from the BGS.

I personally think that PP shouldn't even be in the game, the main point of interest is the interactions between the three main factions (Fed, Imp and Alli) and personally I think PP hinders this in many ways. I am for quality over quantity, we have player factions like the Hutton Truckers, so why add another level in PP when it is clearly not needed. Choosing to rank in a faction should be where the PP is at, with developed career paths to choose from and the factions playing off against each other.

PP is far too shallow and should have made far better use of the mission board and choose your missions for the chosen faction.....

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What the OP talks about is what we wanted the game to be from day 1, but during the development there was a vocal minority who shouted very loud and Frontier listened to them instead of making the game how they said they'd make the game (go and look up the DDF - Design Discussion Forum archives). The Elite Dangerous we currently have is a pale shadow to the Elite Dangerous it should have been, but don't blame Frontier, blame the group who shouted the loudest and (in my opinion) ruined the game.

There is hope, we asked over and over for ship naming, and it's finally coming. Now we need to ask over and over for better crime and punishment.

FD didn't have to listen to the vocal minority, nobody put a gun to there heads and made sure they did it.

Also I have never read the DDF, but this is how I would have wanted the game anyway :)
 
I don't think I've ever really agreed with what you've had to say SkipRat..

..except for this one time. I've been preaching for a system like this that would benefit both play styles (the good and the bad) without punishing either to the point of being unplayable for months now.

+1 good sir.
 
Everything you say is 100% correct.

The problem is that Frontier only allows 1 cmdr per account. Does that mean I have to buy the game twice if I want to be a pirate and a merchant?

Nope, if you've chose the path of the pirate you could simply take the narrow road and work your way back to being a lawful citizen, or the wide road that is reset your CMDR. :D
 
So the initial post in this thread talks about how there are no consequences for criminal behavior because the bounty you get is minor.

I had the misfortune of inadvertently acquiring a bounty in a system that's fairly important to my character's regular shipping business, and I have to say, the idea that there are no consequences is a load of horse. For one thing, as long as you have bounties in a given system, you apparently are a kill-on-sight target for its security forces AND its stations. You basically just can't go there at all. I do kind of agree that if you're a notorious criminal, your reputation should spread to neighboring systems somehow, and eventually throughout the major faction's space, but even with a bounty in one system, that can be a super inconvenient consequence of a few misplaced shots.
 
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