Nope, mining as it is is perfectly valid way of making money. FDev said so by giving all of us that option. For your information I don't do mining, tried it, it is boring...
ANNOUNCEMENT Game Balancing
I certainly hope so...
Not really. I would like to try other activities but in current situation it is not worth the time and effort. I'll wait for FDev to show us what they have in mind by balancing other activities and how will this pan out in the longer run...
Absolutely. But shouting out loud "nerf everything because we said so" is exactly attempt to enforce ones play style on others...
Well if you believe that then you should hurry and construct a very solid argument to the devs as to why it shouldn’t be changed...
...because they are nerfing it, this week!!
You’re wasting your time arguing with individual players, most of us have been fed up with it for years.
No.
These are individuals opinions and they’re equally as valid as your own.
I could say that you’re attempting to enforce your opinion of ‘don’t nerf things’ on me, I’d be wrong.
OK, I am serious here. Why is that a problem?? Have a Corvette or Cutter. Ship is just a means of transport your virtual butt from A to B. The same can be said about any ship in the game. If you lack imagination there is no difference what ship you fly...
Well ED is a grind fest. It is not money issue only, ranks and engineering are a massive factor here. I see no reason to get FC but it is me. New players complain because currently is takes ages to get anywhere in ED. They loose interest because you need to spend ages grinding before getting to the point where you can enjoy the game. HAZ RES zone are not fun in the Sidewinder... Get fully engineered Python in there and voila, stuff blows up like crazy...
I do and believe you me I do enjoy what I do. But again that's me, my imagination helps a bit. For those w/o imagination well, ED will never go above certain threshold. It will be playable but there will be more issues than playing...
You're confusing playstyle with lack of structure in game. Having easier time doing things is not a "playstyle".
Elite was much more strict, demanding and cohesive when it started, but due to various changes, buffs in various areas, it became ubalanced.
Fdev are trying to fix that and bring parts of the game in line with the rest.
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I am fully aware of that. I am waiting for the results. We shall see what else gets broken. PWA wasn't on purpose...
I am not arguing. I am simply participating in the discussion. I just don't see how certain thing became so annoying to some even if those things do not affect them...
Player interaction? Player interaction means that I will be shot down by some player who is years ahead of me, probably has a better internet connection than I have and thus has lower ping times so that I won't even see him coming, has engineered his ship to the point that he can basically take me out with a single shot or two and has so much experience that I will never stand a chance. Or it means that I'm asking questions and get stupid answers because poeple are making fun of me. Or, if you want to call it player interaction, it means reading and writing forum posts because I'm not getting anywhere in the game because it's so badly made, rather playing the game.
There have been exceptions. Last time it meant that I had to take the risk of getting into open play (which I don't want to do at all because it's too dangerous) because we couldn't get into the same place otherwise. Apparently, it usually doesn't work to get multiple players into the same instance, especially when they want to use a private group, and definitely, the interface for doing things with other players other than being shot down by them is so badly made and miserable that nobody has figured out how to use it.
And I really hate wearing headphones. Why is there no hands-free microphone for computers and for consoles? That technology works fine in the phone on my desk and it works even in cars. You can't even get a table microphone with a button you can press to speak. And who is recording what, and who has access to the recordings?
I probably did not express myself well enough here for others to understand that I look forward to those changes as well. What I don't like to see is another failed attempt to fix things by completely breaking stuff for all. Even in the current state game is a bit of a chore, if FDev will start nerfing thing to fix things this will only become more and more visible. I still firmly believe that by doing so they will achieve completely opposite results to what they want - I presume the target here is more players as this would make sense for a game...
Having finally caught up on all 39 pages, I'm finally ready to throw my two cents in. I've had ED for a couple years now, although I took an extended break from it. Just got back in about a ninth ago and I'm enjoying being back. That said, I'm excited for Odyssey!
Now the fun part, my break was due to frustration wit PvE combat. Not the best combat pilot obviously but my hard earned Fed Dropship got destroyed while bounty hunting a couple of times and eventually I couldn't afford the rebuy. The bounties and assassinations were definitely not worthwhile. Even massacre missions didn't pay great unless you were doing the wing missions, then you were likely to break the 1m barrier. I don't wing up because most of my friends don't play and the few who do are stillPC and I'm on Xbox. Now that I'm back, used that the missions are paying a bit better but the bounties suck. I'm in a system under pirate attack and the best bounty I saw was 200k on an Alliance Chieftain with a dangerous pilot... I think. KWS isn't even adjusting their bounties when scanned, it stays the same. Definitely could used some buffs in the payout. Also for a system under pirate attack I'm barely being bothered when I return from mining. Maybe 1/4 trips I'm being interdicted, not that I'm complaining. Just noting the oddity.
Now since I came back I wanted to do other things, I've done quite a bit of trading, mining, and a bit of exploration. Just getting into the BGS too. This mining rebalance may be necessary, I mined very little previously and since I've returned I've made over 800m in trade (95% mining). I've bought back and outfitted (and reoutfitted twice) my dropship, an ASPX for exploration, a python for combat turned mining rig, and a FDL to replace my python as a combat vessel. I can afford the Anaconda, just don't want it yet. I'm a collector, I plan to own all the ships I like. Anyway all this is to say I completely understand the grind for credits to do as you please, but I can also very clearly see the need for rebalance when it comes to mining. My current grind is for that sweet FC and the rebalance may slow me down but I'll plug along. Now on the subject of the PWA, I can't say. I've only been using it since after it 'broke' but I've made 99% of my creds core mining. It's definitely buggy, I sometimes go a good minute with no reaction. Also the colors drive me crazy, half the time I can't tell if the asteroid has a core or not (based on color alone). I've had asteroids be super bright at first glance then a second look and they're dull and uninteresting. Or they'll glow for all of .5 seconds the go back to normal. I have more issue with hotspots feeling like I just jumped into a random spot on the ring. I mean I literally flew 700km in a pristine VO hotspot and found 5 core asteroids, only 2 of which were VO. I find more bromellite when I mine honestly. That may in part be caused by the PWA but seriously? If hotspots were an oasis, mine are mirages that lead to a little mud hole.
Moving on, exploration! This why I'm really here! I just recently left the bubble, heading westerly about. Ofc that's when CG drops on the other side of the galaxy! T_T I decided my first deep space exploration was going to be the heart neb. I got about 500ly+ I to my journey, bounced on a 1.74g planet and realized I couldn't repair my hull. I whip on back, fully mapping every unmapped system along the way. First mapping bonuses (I had a lot, people barely do more than 'honk' the system and duece out but I understand why) gave me less creds than my codex discoveries. Biggest bonus was 40k. From that trip my payout was 7m or so. 6 for the system honk and another mil from combined first mapping bonuses. I didn't keep count but I must have mapped over 100 CO and and somehow I made less a single VO core. This highlights both the heights of mining and the depths of exploration.
Having said all of that, I agree mining is by far the highest paid, non CG activity and probably needs a bit of work done. Rebalance is fine but if you aren't patching at the same time, you'll find yourselves constantly having to retweak without fixing underlying issues. Buff other activities to make them more attractive may help buy time to really resolve the issues with mining and the economy. I personally mine to gather funds my other desires (collection and exploration) and my attempts to 'git gud' at combat. Also...I've become a little addicted to core mining (don't tell anyone). If I could fund my combat attempts with just bounties, assassinations and the like I'd do that. Likewise with exploration, although there isn't much I need funded there. There are some excellent suggestions here on things that can be done to bring other activities up to mining's level if you find the rebalance fails to help.
Edited for grammar and spelling
Now the fun part, my break was due to frustration wit PvE combat. Not the best combat pilot obviously but my hard earned Fed Dropship got destroyed while bounty hunting a couple of times and eventually I couldn't afford the rebuy. The bounties and assassinations were definitely not worthwhile. Even massacre missions didn't pay great unless you were doing the wing missions, then you were likely to break the 1m barrier. I don't wing up because most of my friends don't play and the few who do are stillPC and I'm on Xbox. Now that I'm back, used that the missions are paying a bit better but the bounties suck. I'm in a system under pirate attack and the best bounty I saw was 200k on an Alliance Chieftain with a dangerous pilot... I think. KWS isn't even adjusting their bounties when scanned, it stays the same. Definitely could used some buffs in the payout. Also for a system under pirate attack I'm barely being bothered when I return from mining. Maybe 1/4 trips I'm being interdicted, not that I'm complaining. Just noting the oddity.
Now since I came back I wanted to do other things, I've done quite a bit of trading, mining, and a bit of exploration. Just getting into the BGS too. This mining rebalance may be necessary, I mined very little previously and since I've returned I've made over 800m in trade (95% mining). I've bought back and outfitted (and reoutfitted twice) my dropship, an ASPX for exploration, a python for combat turned mining rig, and a FDL to replace my python as a combat vessel. I can afford the Anaconda, just don't want it yet. I'm a collector, I plan to own all the ships I like. Anyway all this is to say I completely understand the grind for credits to do as you please, but I can also very clearly see the need for rebalance when it comes to mining. My current grind is for that sweet FC and the rebalance may slow me down but I'll plug along. Now on the subject of the PWA, I can't say. I've only been using it since after it 'broke' but I've made 99% of my creds core mining. It's definitely buggy, I sometimes go a good minute with no reaction. Also the colors drive me crazy, half the time I can't tell if the asteroid has a core or not (based on color alone). I've had asteroids be super bright at first glance then a second look and they're dull and uninteresting. Or they'll glow for all of .5 seconds the go back to normal. I have more issue with hotspots feeling like I just jumped into a random spot on the ring. I mean I literally flew 700km in a pristine VO hotspot and found 5 core asteroids, only 2 of which were VO. I find more bromellite when I mine honestly. That may in part be caused by the PWA but seriously? If hotspots were an oasis, mine are mirages that lead to a little mud hole.
Moving on, exploration! This why I'm really here! I just recently left the bubble, heading westerly about. Ofc that's when CG drops on the other side of the galaxy! T_T I decided my first deep space exploration was going to be the heart neb. I got about 500ly+ I to my journey, bounced on a 1.74g planet and realized I couldn't repair my hull. I whip on back, fully mapping every unmapped system along the way. First mapping bonuses (I had a lot, people barely do more than 'honk' the system and duece out but I understand why) gave me less creds than my codex discoveries. Biggest bonus was 40k. From that trip my payout was 7m or so. 6 for the system honk and another mil from combined first mapping bonuses. I didn't keep count but I must have mapped over 100 CO and and somehow I made less a single VO core. This highlights both the heights of mining and the depths of exploration.
Having said all of that, I agree mining is by far the highest paid, non CG activity and probably needs a bit of work done. Rebalance is fine but if you aren't patching at the same time, you'll find yourselves constantly having to retweak without fixing underlying issues. Buff other activities to make them more attractive may help buy time to really resolve the issues with mining and the economy. I personally mine to gather funds my other desires (collection and exploration) and my attempts to 'git gud' at combat. Also...I've become a little addicted to core mining (don't tell anyone). If I could fund my combat attempts with just bounties, assassinations and the like I'd do that. Likewise with exploration, although there isn't much I need funded there. There are some excellent suggestions here on things that can be done to bring other activities up to mining's level if you find the rebalance fails to help.
Edited for grammar and spelling
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There is no doubt that all activities are redundant and no matter what style of play you adopt. The credits don't change that in the end.
It seems to me that a game has to allow game play in the activity that you engage in.
Take the BGS You have a sub-faction in the game, a squadron you are in charge of the system and you are expanding (already you have spent a lot of hours on the game). Well. You are located in another system…. and we start again… for the glory!
So could we have a gain when we are ruler of the system. Like for example reductions on goods or a rank 2 engineer weapon. After 5 systems you give "something else" and to make the task more difficult, you can send Targoids or a pirate invasion, to destabilize the systems of the sub-faction, when you reach 10 systems….
This would give the players a sense of expansion. They wonder why maintain this BGS which brings nothing to game play. They get bored and quit this style of play, see the sub faction and the squadron.
How many sub-factions are inactive?
New players would be interested in staying in sub-factions to own these weapons or reductions and participate in the maintenance effort. The interactions between players would be more relevant, because if the systems with a lot of population give more rewards…. The game would be worth the candle… The attack would be justified. Of course, you have to remove the BGS influence points for the single player and private group play that is ruining the PVP game.
You want to balance the game, make sense, I trust you.
trad google
It seems to me that a game has to allow game play in the activity that you engage in.
Take the BGS You have a sub-faction in the game, a squadron you are in charge of the system and you are expanding (already you have spent a lot of hours on the game). Well. You are located in another system…. and we start again… for the glory!
So could we have a gain when we are ruler of the system. Like for example reductions on goods or a rank 2 engineer weapon. After 5 systems you give "something else" and to make the task more difficult, you can send Targoids or a pirate invasion, to destabilize the systems of the sub-faction, when you reach 10 systems….
This would give the players a sense of expansion. They wonder why maintain this BGS which brings nothing to game play. They get bored and quit this style of play, see the sub faction and the squadron.
How many sub-factions are inactive?
New players would be interested in staying in sub-factions to own these weapons or reductions and participate in the maintenance effort. The interactions between players would be more relevant, because if the systems with a lot of population give more rewards…. The game would be worth the candle… The attack would be justified. Of course, you have to remove the BGS influence points for the single player and private group play that is ruining the PVP game.
You want to balance the game, make sense, I trust you.
trad google
This is something I really don't understand. What chore? Maybe if you're trying to "finish" the game in a week. But otherwise... everything you feel you must do in this game are the things that you'll be doing anyway, so there's no reason to hurry, but rather enjoy doing them (if you actually like the game).
The Cutter and Corvette were just examples of best ship, best modules, substitute whatever ship you like. They are probably the 2 ships seen by a lot of people as the ultimate achievement due to cost and rank requirement so made good examples.
Your second point that you need a fully engineered ship to start having fun I disagree with. I had fun flying my unengineered Cobra into Res sites and blowing stuff up, not Haz Res, granted, but it was still fun. Now I can take my fully engineered FDL into a Haz Res and blow up anything. Is it more fun? Not really. If anything it is less fun as it is less of a challenge.
ED is a grind fest?! Is it really? Go onto YouTube and there are dozens of videos telling you how to get what you want quickly. Zero Fed rank to Admiral in 8 hours. You can do that in 2-3 evenings relaxed play. Same goes for everything else, there will be a guide telling you how to get it quickly and efficiently.
I am glad you are enjoying the game and I think you are right, imagination is the key to getting the most out of the game.
It is. Grind is real. Not everywhere but certain aspects of collecting stuff could be improved. It is getting better over time but to start with it is a bit of a nightmare. YouTube videos will show you how to get things done but you still need to put considerable amount of time actually getting those things done...
Maybe because you need to spend very considerable amount of time getting anywhere in ED. In the current state the game excludes more casual players with full time job, families or other time consuming activities IRL... OK, "excludes" is probably wrong use of the word here, more like putting those players into disadvantage...
I think engineering has been changed for the better over time. What things would you change? I have my own ideas, but genuinely interested to hear what other people think.
What "disandvantage"?
If you play Elite for competitive PvP, than maybe, but you would be better off choosing CQC for that.
Otherwise, you can play how you want and the game will more or less let you be, adapting to your level. It's not like you'll encounter some high level boss that will block your progress. There are enemies that might be difficult for you to tackle in the beginning, but you must actively look for them.
There's no need to grind anything before enjoying the game - people who say otherwise are too much in a hurry to get somewhere where gameplay is pretty much the same, only details change, like ship, improved equipment, etc. There's no need to skip through all that, because the only reason those things exist, is to provide players with something that will be changing their game as they play (and the games like that are supposed to be designed to provide enjoyment for long time, not AC:Valhalla 50 hours gameplay and you're through), because after all, you are repeating the same game loops here.
From my own experience I'm telling you: if you enjoy Elite, you should avoid rushing through it. When you have everything, the game starts to get little bit boring and you begin considering starting over.