Got Bounty for attacking wanted Ships!

[Jukelo]

It's not about what the cops want.

It's about that a wanted ship (which is at the time under police fire btw) should not be able to report a crime.

It's the same situation when you are sent on a mission to eliminate a pirate lord. You know for sure who he is, you know that he is wanted, and yet you have to wait for the scan result.

It's about you flouting the authority of the local ruling faction. From their perspective you're nothing but a trouble maker they can't fully control. They're not going to give you the benefit of the doubt when they see you barge in and interefere with local matters, flashing your pilots' federation priviledges and arrogance, killing people in their jurisdiction before you've even made them the courtesy of at least asking if that's okay with them.

But the police should not be able to know that you were shooting at an unscanned ship, because that ship, being in fact wanted, should not have been able to report a crime in the first place.

One can imagine a wanted ship doesn't stop broadcasting about being under attack, the police just naturally doesn't come to its help (although from a consistency pov that should lead to a police reponse to come and actually apprehend the criminal).
But ultimately it's about punishing you the player for failing to exercise trigger discipline. That's what is important and that is what needs to stay.

 

[Martind Forlon]

I've got bounty for shot pirate (discharge weapon) in 'wing pirate mission' in mission point where that pirate ship fired on me already. There were more hostile ships so time 'lost' with scan not helped me much ... I needed let them shot to finish scan. It wasn't big issue, but logic hidden behind it is little weird.

 

[Aashenfox]

One can imagine a wanted ship doesn't stop broadcasting about being under attack, the police just naturally doesn't come to its help (although from a consistency pov that should lead to a police reponse to come and actually apprehend the criminal).
But ultimately it's about punishing you the player for failing to exercise trigger discipline. That's what is important and that is what needs to stay.

I don't agree with this. A wanted ship should not be able to report an unprovoked attack. The thing of this arises when interdicted, you already know the ship is wanted, cos they interdicted you, there should be no need to let them get the first few shots in while you scan them. It's idiotic, has nothing to do with trigger discipline and should be at the top of the list for future Beyond fixes.

Going to a RES or a CZ teaches trigger discipline, this idea that a ship is clean (even if wanted) until scanned, is actually ludicrous.

 

[GunnerBill]

I thought this was a bug that was fixed in 3.0...



I'm guessing the fix didn't work if it's still happening, I'd put a support ticket in..

Seemingly not it has happened to me twice since 3.0 dropped.

 

[Dakron Nova]

So I had something strange happen which Im not sure is related to the new crime system or not. So any feedback would be appreciated.

In a resource site, scanned a clean ship with the KWS, ship "changed" to wanted. Opened up and became wanted myself.

 

[Aashenfox]

Seemingly not it has happened to me twice since 3.0 dropped.

What has happened twice? Shooting a wanted ship and getting a bounty, after scanning it and identifying it as wanted?

Without multiple independent bug reports, it's hard to believe, especially when it's so easy to accidentally tag another ship nowadays (happened to me on the first day of 3.0, a missed PA shot went 5km before hitting a clean ship and getting me a bounty. To add insult to injury, another NPC killed it a few seconds later and I got the murder rap, for ONE single stray large PA round.)

 

[RidingTheFlow]

I tend to think now that in my case it was bounty for attacking just launched fighter - it was a Gunship I was shooting at.

Problem is I don't think there is particularly good mechanic here - for instance in my case I've just launched massive volley of packhounds and MC rounds, and even if fighter was launched just a second later - I didn't even see it and certainly were not able to react to do anything to prevent bounty on me (since all these rounds & missiles were in flight already).

 

[Riverside]

I tend to think now that in my case it was bounty for attacking just launched fighter - it was a Gunship I was shooting at.

Problem is I don't think there is particularly good mechanic here - for instance in my case I've just launched massive volley of packhounds and MC rounds, and even if fighter was launched just a second later - I didn't even see it and certainly were not able to react to do anything to prevent bounty on me (since all these rounds & missiles were in flight already).

I agree with regard to the fighter, it is an extension of the mothership with the same wanted/clean status. If one has been scanned the other should automatically be too.

 

[Jukelo]

I don't agree with this. A wanted ship should not be able to report an unprovoked attack. The thing of this arises when interdicted, you already know the ship is wanted, cos they interdicted you, there should be no need to let them get the first few shots in while you scan them. It's idiotic, has nothing to do with trigger discipline and should be at the top of the list for future Beyond fixes.

That's already how it works, when a ship interdicts you they become hostile and you get full data (including wanted status) on them without the need to scan. And this data survives the supercruise -> normal space transition.

 

[Aashenfox]

That's already how it works, when a ship interdicts you they become hostile and you get full data (including wanted status) on them without the need to scan. And this data survives the supercruise -> normal space transition, so you don't have to waste time on a scan.

I'd never noticed, thanks for clarifying, but you get my point, right? When I'm wanted in a jurisdiction, the npc bounty hunter that indicted me definitely does not have to wait for a basic scan to complete before opening fire, and because I'm wanted, no crime can be reported, all attacks are considered to be attempts to collect my bounty. It doesn't work the other way around, but it should. Somehow, despite being wanted, npcs can still report the crime of 'not scanning first', which is silly, no?

 

[Lucius-Darcia]

The second ship could have been an SLF launched by the Gunship, or some other ship you got caught out by a FF issue. If it was a FF thing, just go pay off the bounty at an IF contact. Check your Notoriety, if it is at zero, you're good. If the second 'red' ship was an associated SLF I can't say why you got a bounty. I have seen reports of misapplied bounties, but I'm guessing, because of the amount of the fine, that you got a 'Reckless Weapons Discharge" bounty some how.

This, the SLF bug is back.
I guess that the gunship has launched a fighter on your attack and you accidentally have hit it. SFL's have to be scanned seperately or otherwise you will gain a bounty. I've did that mistake myself. Anaconda has launched a SLF and i have ordered my SLF to attack it (becauser it was red and hostile already) but i've didn't finished the basic scan and immediatly i've got a bounty on my head.

 

[Jukelo]

I'd never noticed, thanks for clarifying, but you get my point, right? When I'm wanted in a jurisdiction, the npc bounty hunter that indicted me definitely does not have to wait for a basic scan to complete before opening fire, and because I'm wanted, no crime can be reported, all attacks are considered to be attempts to collect my bounty. It doesn't work the other way around, but it should. Somehow, despite being wanted, npcs can still report the crime of 'not scanning first', which is silly, no?

I'll agree with you that there are various consistency holes all across the game, and this is probably one of them.

 

[galahad2069]

It's about you flouting the authority of the local ruling faction. From their perspective you're nothing but a trouble maker they can't fully control. They're not going to give you the benefit of the doubt when they see you barge in and interefere with local matters, flashing your pilots' federation priviledges and arrogance, killing people in their jurisdiction before you've even made them the courtesy of at least asking if that's okay with them.



One can imagine a wanted ship doesn't stop broadcasting about being under attack, the police just naturally doesn't come to its help (although from a consistency pov that should lead to a police reponse to come and actually apprehend the criminal).
But ultimately it's about punishing you the player for failing to exercise trigger discipline. That's what is important and that is what needs to stay.

Look, I know and understand perfectly well how the current system is working. I'm not saying that it fails to work as intended.

All that I'm saying is that wanted NPCs should not, figuratively speaking, fly with "report crimes against me" enabled.

It would make perfect sense lore-wise (why would they want to attract cops?), not to mention that it would be much more immersive (for me, at least) to be able to come to help of a clean ship without having to wait for the scan result of its attacker. Besides, it would help in at least half of the "friendly" fire situations virtually all BHers entangle themselves into occasionally, which most of the time adds nothing else to the game than some completely unnecessary annoyance.

 

[RidingTheFlow]

Its a classic case of "it makes sense from software engineer's/game code standpoint" over "it does not make sense from user's/appearance standpoint".

 

[Aashenfox]

This, the SLF bug is back.
I guess that the gunship has launched a fighter on your attack and you accidentally have hit it. SFL's have to be scanned seperately or otherwise you will gain a bounty. I've did that mistake myself. Anaconda has launched a SLF and i have ordered my SLF to attack it (becauser it was red and hostile already) but i've didn't finished the basic scan and immediatly i've got a bounty on my head.

The slf bug is back, or you guess? Which is it? Not being facetious, honestly curious if you've confirmed it in 3.0

 

[Cicha]

I can't wrap my Brain around the new Crime and Punishment System. Did I encounter a new Bug or intended Feature?

My Story:
I took a wing mission to kill 10 Pirates in another system. I thought i would take them out alone with no problem. Fund that the mission marker was on a ringed planet with High RES, what seems to bee very convenient for bounty hunting. I scanned some ships and found a Gunship that was wanted and marked as mission target. Scan was finished, as i even took the time to subtarget the Drive. When i opened Fire i gained a Bounty of 200CR and some other ships turned red as well. I did not take the time to ask them what they wanted and left the area immediately. Back in Supercruise I logged out and came here.

So what are my consequences now? Did I get Notority points? Is Bounty hunting in some systems illegal? Can this mission type be completed in a legal manner?

I had yesterday this same. But it was a Imperial Clipper and I gained 12,400 CR bounty.

 

[Skatez69]

Do the Police really want that trigger happy novice to 'help'? They are already dealing with the crim. I think waiting for the scan to complete is a reasonable trade off. If they fire on you (and hit you) they instantly become wanted so if you are not being attacked there is no hurry.

Hmmm, that's got me wondering if the opposite is also true... If I'm wanted in a system and a clean NPC starts to shoot me without scanning me first, do they then become wanted too??

 

[azor1985]

I have the same issue yesterday. I travel back to change ship to pay interstellar factor. I founded a station for smaller ship with this services. I changed my ship i travelwd to this station and requested permition to dock. Suddenly puf puf and my ship was gone. Station destroyed me. Why? I dont know i have bounties on other ship becouse of the same situation like was in this topic. I was on status hostile but station didnt scan me juz open fire.
Another thing... When i was returning from jail megaship i travel to change my ship for that whitch has a bounty. I found on map another interstellar factor at Dinkas... Nearest station 83000ls. But I was thinking why not, I just whana pay this bounty. I traveled there and when i docked to station i realized that there is no interstellar factor on this station. So thx fdev. Ps. Sorry for my english... And they are suprised that everybody trying to get max money from missions when they find an exploit. But tell me how we should react when we are spending couple of hours to finish mission, and becouse of bug we are loosing lots of credits and reputation. In my case there was 5 mln for bounties from res. 6 mln exploration data. Plus bounty and rebuy cos for my ship. Its about 20 mln. For a bug. They do better when they will be foxing bugs than nerfing missions.

 

[Riverside]

Hmmm, that's got me wondering if the opposite is also true... If I'm wanted in a system and a clean NPC starts to shoot me without scanning me first, do they then become wanted too??

Well in normal circumstances (where they would be expected to have to complete a basic scan) they don't open fire immediately so I guess the rule reciprocates but tbh it could just be part of the NPC's magic. It's never leapt out at me as unreasonable in the way that (for example) spawning right behind me in supercruise has.

What do you think?

 

[Aashenfox]

I had yesterday this same. But it was a Imperial Clipper and I gained 12,400 CR bounty.

That doesn't sound right, WAAAAAY too much bounty. Got game logs?

Hmmm, that's got me wondering if the opposite is also true... If I'm wanted in a system and a clean NPC starts to shoot me without scanning me first, do they then become wanted too??

No they do not, I have highlighted this inconsistency earlier in this very thread.

Well in normal circumstances (where they would be expected to have to complete a basic scan) they don't open fire immediately so I guess the rule reciprocates but tbh it could just be part of the NPC's magic. It's never leapt out at me as unreasonable in the way that (for example) spawning right behind me in supercruise has.

What do you think?

Nah, remember when you have a bounty and you get a bounty hunter wanting to make you 'pay for your crimes (lol)', they drop in behind you and open fire IMMEDIATELY. Since you are wanted, it is not a crime, any attack on you is considered to be an attempt to claim your bounty. As noted by all, this is not reciprocal. Somehow, an NPC that is wanted can report the crime of 'he didn't scan me first'. It needs fixing.