Gunner = Arcade Action Cam for the 12 yr olds?

[Zambrick]

It's amazing how the forums have flipped 180 on that. Maybe it's time to ask if anyon'e stupid enough to want an autopilot again

Yes it would be horrible for them to ask for something that we invented and used on earth over half a century ago. Even the space shuttle landed using autopilot. But o well.


What I am really truly wondering is how and why this thread exists?

The title of the thread derogatory in nature and clearly violates all forums guide lines and rules. The content of said thread is cyclical and worthless. What really gets me is how and why was this thread not closed almost as soon as it was started. At the very least made to change the Thread title.

Any forum Mod doing their job would know that the title alone was meant to create division and drive everyone apart. They would also know that it violates the badgering and harassing rules that apparently are only applied to posts in such threads.

The title and OP alone has no interest in in discussion. There has been no useful information in this thread and it is purely opinion based. So how about it gets closed already because no good discussion will ever come of it.

One side of the argument modified a scarce few statements to fit a delusional narrative. The other side of the argument is tired of having the game destroyed by the personal opinions and poor interpretations of the other crowd. They are tired of letting said group of people gut any new or fun portion of the game before it has even launched.

That impasse will never be breached because one side wants to have fun and logically knows they are playing a game. The other side resolute in their personal opinions and interpretations as somehow being the only choice for every situation.

You cant fight Zealotry all you can let them do is destroy themselves. I dont want to be here when they do so I fight against it.

You can tell that was the sole purpose of this thread by its title and by its OP. If the Mods actually moderated they would have closed this as they knew no good discussion could or would ever be had.

 

[lysan]

If the Mods actually moderated they would have closed this as they knew no good discussion could or would ever be had.

Do we have Moderators here??

 

[Ian Phillips]

Nope - we are all hiding.

 

[Vorxian]

But the gunner role IS an arcade action cam!

(or am I missing something?)

(not sure about the age demographic of those enjoying arcade action cams, but the gunner role definitely is one hellava arcade action cam!)

EDIT: 3rd person arcade action cam at that to!

 

[Ian Skippy]

But the gunner role IS an arcade action cam!

(or am I missing something?)

(not sure about the age demographic of those enjoying arcade action cams, but the gunner role definitely is one hellava arcade action cam!)

EDIT: 3rd person arcade action cam at that to!

I think the issue is that 'arcade' as used by you et al. seems to refer to something unknown to contemporary dictionaries: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/arcade

It seems to fall in the same group as 'depth' and so on: vague, non-defined words that serve no purpose other than as a cheap way to buff your own opinion or counter another. Like such words, whatever definition one has, its never used consistently. Try me: define 'arcade' and I'll list five things that conform to it in the game that you've never railed against. Its why most of DD topics go nowhere, because without internal consistency there isnt much to discuss:

Player 1: "Devs said there would never be 3rd person!"
Player 2: "They also said no to Open-PvE..."
Player 1: "They dont know their own game, who cares what devs say! They never listen to our feedback!"
Player 2: "Well, they had a long beta based on combat feedback, which they'll revisit in 2.3 again..."
Player 1: "Boo FD! They dont care about anything other than pewpew!!!!!!"

Me thinks this board would work better if people would replace their crappy logic with a simple preface saying "this is just my opinion, yours may vary." In this case: "I dont/do like the turret cam. That is my opinion. It is not better than your opinion, nor is it worse. If you disagree, one of us will be happier than the other with whatever FD decides to do. Thats okay. We're grown adults, and this is just a game."

 

[Fishy]

What I am really truly wondering is how and why this thread exists?

Because it's about something many people feel strongly about? How many times did you post in here?

 

[CylonSurfer]

Those in favour of the third person view must surely accept that, from a development and implementation point of view, it's the easiest/simplest solution for FD to do? Right?

So you are happy then that FD are choosing the easiest/simplest solution to implement a feature development? (basically the same reasoning behind the solution to multi-crew)

Would you be happy if all future developments took this route? Implement whatever is the simplest solution. Forget developing any real substance, just slap something together and the customer will be happy.

THAT is the main issue here. It's a cheap solution that could easily be seen as a downturn in the enthusiasm FD has for the game as a whole. We're only into the second season of a supposed 10 year plan and they give us this overly simplistic implementation of a key game area - what does that say for the potential future? What's the point of them going the extra mile with anything in the future if their customers are happy with the arcade solution they are given...?

Why bother with any real substance in that case.

Those of us who want the depth of game originally promised, those of us who, yes, want immersion in a game, those of us who've been here for a long time etc. etc. have been somewhat ridiculed in this thread and others of late for our views, our age perhaps, our choices. But, I guarantee you this one thing, we are the ones that will be around playing this game through the seasons and supporting it long after those happy with and calling for simple, "fun", instant action solutions are long gone.

Well said.

Zam, nobody modified any quotes, you just don't like the quotes and have tried your darnedest to dismiss them. Quite halarious really.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Those in favour of the third person view must surely accept that, from a development and implementation point of view, it's the easiest/simplest solution for FD to do? Right?

Wrong. It would have been equally easy to add a SRV turret-cam to a fixed position (at the hardpoint). It would have resulted in terrible gameplay so they didnt do it. So no, they didnt went with the 'easiest' solution, they went with a solution that makes sense from a gameplay point of view.

The rest of your post dies with this false premise. How about just saying "I think 1st person turret would have been cool!" without the crappy argumentation that is easily discarded? Its really ok.

- - - Updated - - -

Well said.

Zam, nobody modified any quotes, you just don't like the quotes and have tried your darnedest to dismiss them. Quite halarious really.

You mean "I also dont like the 3rd person turret."

Just because you agree with someone's opinion doesnt mean you have to accept crappy logic.

 

[CylonSurfer]

You mean "I also dont like the 3rd person turret."

Just because you agree with someone's opinion doesnt mean you have to accept crappy logic.

Nope, not what I said above at all. My comment referred to quotes taken from dev comments which Zam has gone from saying, outright don't exist, to they're out of context, to they were made too long ago to be relevant, to now they were modified. Comedy gold.

I admit that I don't like the turret camera and believe that a first person implementation would have been better and inline with the impression devs gave in the form of comments here on the forum at the time myself and many others purchased this game. Be that bubble turrets manned in first person to promote cooperative gameplay between gunner and pilot, or some sort of in cockpit screen system the gunner viewed and controlled the turrets from. I also stated that my belief is that FDEV took the easiest, quickest and cheapest way out possible. Which didn't sit well with me and worried me when thinking to the future.

MultiCrew in all, doesn't in my opinion improve the multiplayer aspect of this game. The implementation prevents many social experiences from being possible such as taxi services to rescue operations. Its also extremely lacking in cooperative gameplay as no missions catering to this new mode have been created and rewards from existing missions are not even sharable between crew. All in all its extremely lacking and feels more like box ticking than anything else. You can MC up instantly (wow) and do pretty much nothing with that but RES hunt (wow).

 

[House0fDerp]

But the gunner role IS an arcade action cam!

(or am I missing something?)

(not sure about the age demographic of those enjoying arcade action cams, but the gunner role definitely is one hellava arcade action cam!)

EDIT: 3rd person arcade action cam at that to!

What is an "arcade action cam" and how does it differ from a "tactical 3rd person rendered view"?

It doesn't differ at all because it's the same thing just without the negative spin from those predisposed to dismiss it. It's being added because it's a decidedly superior solution to other options so far as this function is concerned. From an in universe standpoint it makes sense to have for that purpose.

 

[House0fDerp]

Nope, not what I said above at all. My comment referred to quotes taken from dev comments which Zam has gone from saying, outright don't exist, to they're out of context, to they were made too long ago to be relevant, to now they were modified. Comedy gold.

I admit that I don't like the turret camera and believe that a first person implementation would have been better and inline with the impression devs gave in the form of comments here on the forum at the time myself and many others purchased this game. Be that bubble turrets manned in first person to promote cooperative gameplay between gunner and pilot, or some sort of in cockpit screen system the gunner viewed and controlled the turrets from. I also stated that my belief is that FDEV took the easiest, quickest and cheapest way out possible. Which didn't sit well with me and worried me when thinking to the future.

MultiCrew in all, doesn't in my opinion improve the multiplayer aspect of this game. The implementation prevents many social experiences from being possible such as taxi services to rescue operations. Its also extremely lacking in cooperative gameplay as no missions catering to this new mode have been created and rewards from existing missions are not even sharable between crew. All in all its extremely lacking and feels more like box ticking than anything else. You can MC up instantly (wow) and do pretty much nothing with that but RES hunt (wow).

The quote aside, I believe the reason we're seeing the easiest solution is because it's the best one at the same time. The argument that a first person mechanic fits in line with past comments is all well and good for consistency in that respect, but as the game works it doesn't make sense. This isn't the millennium falcon with turrets designed to be manually occupied. Further no one has mentioned any sort of per turret optics, which, unironically still wouldn't be a first person pilot view anyways. If we want to argue we should be in first person looking at a display showing the 3rd person view as a gunner you may have a point from an immersive perspective (literally) but the extra work to effectively do nothing but reduce usable screen space seems hardly worth it.

As far as preventing certain experiences, please explain as neither of the items you listed have anything to do with multicrew as currently proposed and developed.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Nope, not what I said above at all. My comment referred to quotes taken from dev comments which Zam has gone from saying, outright don't exist, to they're out of context, to they were made too long ago to be relevant, to now they were modified. Comedy gold.

I admit that I don't like the turret camera and believe that a first person implementation would have been better and inline with the impression devs gave in the form of comments here on the forum at the time myself and many others purchased this game. Be that bubble turrets manned in first person to promote cooperative gameplay between gunner and pilot, or some sort of in cockpit screen system the gunner viewed and controlled the turrets from. I also stated that my belief is that FDEV took the easiest, quickest and cheapest way out possible. Which didn't sit well with me and worried me when thinking to the future.

MultiCrew in all, doesn't in my opinion improve the multiplayer aspect of this game. The implementation prevents many social experiences from being possible such as taxi services to rescue operations. Its also extremely lacking in cooperative gameplay as no missions catering to this new mode have been created and rewards from existing missions are not even sharable between crew. All in all its extremely lacking and feels more like box ticking than anything else. You can MC up instantly (wow) and do pretty much nothing with that but RES hunt (wow).

Pretty sums it up for me too. I can live with and maybe use it, but would have prefered a better solution.

 

[CylonSurfer]

What is an "arcade action cam" and how does it differ from a "tactical 3rd person rendered view"?

It doesn't differ at all because it's the same thing just without the negative spin from those predisposed to dismiss it. It's being added because it's a decidedly superior solution to other options so far as this function is concerned. From an in universe standpoint it makes sense to have for that purpose.

Could just be the opposite, mutton dressed as lamb. Fancy name for a lame implimentation.

 

[House0fDerp]

Could just be the opposite, mutton dressed as lamb. Fancy name for a lame implimentation.

Mutton is lamb, just older, which is my point.

Same animal, same view, different perspective. It's only an "arcade cam" from a decidedly negative interpretation.

 

[CylonSurfer]

Mutton is lamb, just older, which is my point.

Its a well known saying, i'm sure you know what it means and the context I used it in. I.E dressing something up to hide what it really is. A plain old third person camera.

Yes it would be horrible for them to ask for something that we invented and used on earth over half a century ago. Even the space shuttle landed using autopilot. But o well

Yup, its called the docking computer, yup - check, Elite has the option for the player to fit one.

 

[House0fDerp]

Its a well known saying, i'm you know what it means and the context I used it in.

No, I didn't (still don't if it's not what I addressed). Wasn't aware you were using an idiom. Rather I just googled to make sure I wasn't wrong about mutton and lamb coming from the same animal.

Yup, its called the docking computer, yup - check, Elite has the option for the player to fit one.

Says "you know what I meant" in the first half of a post, ignores the contextual argument about autopilot to limit function to docking immediately below that.

Wat?

 

[Zambrick]

Still trying to up your rep or something surfer? Not enough posts yet saying nothing. Auto pilot and Docking computer are not the same thing. Especially seeing how a piece of software in the ED universe takes up the physical space of 1 tonne of cargo.

 

[CylonSurfer]

Up my rep, is that how low you want to go now? seriously dude.....

 

[Zambrick]

Has to be a reason for your continued posting. You dont make sense and your supposed theories are lies or fantasies. So however you wish to play it I dont care. Dont reply to something unless you have something to say. At least more than all the trolling you have done so far.

I surmise you are rep farming, willfully ignorant, a troll, or utterly uninformed. Or any combination of the previously listed items. Other than jibes at other peoples posts, you have produce nothing meaningful or backed by anything than your supposed word. Somebody else has to give me the links to the quotes you so wholly believe as gospel. I read said posts and your interpretations are both wrong and taken out of context of the post. Anyone that points that your interpretations are wrong or misconstrued ,then you attack them and still are not able to provide proper context or proof. Then you blame that person when you cant back up what you say.

So either troll another thread or put a complete thought of your own together. I dont care which.

 

[CylonSurfer]

lmao, posting in this thread the same as you is trolling when I do it.... serisouly dude every time you post you seem more desperate. You not agreeing with me make my posts no less valid than anyone elses. You just don't like them or maybe me. I care about rep as much as the later. Maybe you just think that you can somehow bully or belittle me out of the opinion I hold or stop me posting my point of view.

Anyway, lets try and stay on topic shall we. My thoughts on this subject are extremely clear, just check back one page.

Here they are again, I know you don't like searching:

"I admit that I don't like the turret camera and believe that a first person implementation would have been better and inline with the impression devs gave in the form of comments here on the forum at the time myself and many others purchased this game. Be that bubble turrets manned in first person to promote cooperative gameplay between gunner and pilot, or some sort of in cockpit screen system the gunner viewed and controlled the turrets from. I also stated that my belief is that FDEV took the easiest, quickest and cheapest way out possible. Which didn't sit well with me and worried me when thinking to the future.

MultiCrew in all, doesn't in my opinion improve the multiplayer aspect of this game. The implementation prevents many social experiences from being possible such as taxi services to rescue operations. Its also extremely lacking in cooperative gameplay as no missions catering to this new mode have been created and rewards from existing missions are not even sharable between crew. All in all its extremely lacking and feels more like box ticking than anything else. You can MC up instantly (wow) and do pretty much nothing with that but RES hunt (wow)."

You are very welcome. Discuss if you like.