Just a question for Enthusiast Elite Dangerous players in VR and... Frontier developers!

[Dark Okram]

Hi!
I wanna say Elite Dangerous i my preferred game with my 2500+ hours ingame and i made everything year by year to reach the higher quality and performance possible... I updated my hardware step by step until now...
There are three cases where you have the worst performance in Elite: on a planet with SRV (i don't play on foot in VR, i've an H.O.T.A.S., just space and SRV), in the rings with asteroids and maybe pirates, parked in a base... i usually use FPSVR when parked in a coriolis so i can always have a scientific repeatable test to see how much fps i do with my hardware at every update... until now!
Now i have an AMD Ryzen 7800x3D with 32 GB DDR5 6000MHz CL30, 4090 OC, playing on Windows 11 with a Quest 3 via Virtual Desktop (godlike quality), SteamVR SS 130% and Elite Dangerous on a SSD m.2 and parked in a base i reach... 60fps! And i don't have the video quality at the top everywhere, and HMD is 1.25x.
The quest is: until now i bought and bought new hardware in years from 2016 until now... now i think i reached the top, can't buy anything better anymore... WHAT HARDWARE DO ELITE NEED TO HAVE 90fps at 90Hz always at the best quality? May you help me in this? I would play in VR (that is real immersive and fantastic) with better quality and faster... is it possible? Do someone plays in VR with all the settings at max quality with better results than me?
For developers: Do you think in future you could implement things to help like a working antialiasing like DLSS 3 or similar? I don't think will buy a 5090 to try have a dozen fps more... do you know if you wil optimize somithing in future update to have better quality AND faster game?

 

[DeckerSolo]

With that PC hardware you should be able to play ED in VR at between 60-90fps almost anywhere in game with those game setting, I can with similar PC specs on my Q3 with WiFi.
Some suggestions for you would be:
Use OpenXR not SteamVR with Virtual Desktop if you can.
Have a wired Ethernet connection between your PC and WiFi router (you probably already have this if your using Virtual Desktop).
Have you WiFi router close as possible to your headset and check is connected via a 5GHz connection not 2.4GHz.

 

[Dark Okram]

With that PC hardware you should be able to play ED in VR at between 60-90fps almost anywhere in game with those game setting, I can with similar PC specs on my Q3 with WiFi.
Some suggestions for you would be:
Use OpenXR not SteamVR with Virtual Desktop if you can.
Have a wired Ethernet connection between your PC and WiFi router (you probably already have this if your using Virtual Desktop).
Have you WiFi router close as possible to your headset and check is connected via a 5GHz connection not 2.4GHz.

Thank you DeckerSolo!
Yes, i stay between 60-90fps, but with this PC i hoped to stay more close 90fps in every situation... but in the three cases of "more stress" i stay close 60fps and parked in an hangar i have 60fps... that "are good to play, but non so good for that hardware" i say...
So just set the VDXR instead SteamVR in OpenXR Runtime in the streamer? If i launch Elite from Steam it will not run the SteamVR in this mode? Or what should i do?

And yes, i have a wired PC to the router and play in 5GHz connection, i have 17xxMbps on VD streaming with my FritzBOX! 7590
So OpenXR (now VDXR) are better than SteamVR you tell me? I'll try soon... thanks!

 

[DeckerSolo]

Try this guide:

Quest 3 Virtual Desktop & VDXR - PCVR Setup Guide

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81k6KvXJXc8

forums.frontier.co.uk

And this thread:

Quest 3 - How do you use Virtual Desktop with non-SteamVR ED

Hi all I should know this. When I tried to run ED with Virtual Desktop it tried to launch SteamVR which I don't want to use. (Airlink is unplayably laggy for me and I would like to make use of VD's upscaler.) What is the process for getting ED running in VR using VD. Or do I have to use...

forums.frontier.co.uk

 

[DjVortex]

WHAT HARDWARE DO ELITE NEED TO HAVE 90fps at 90Hz always at the best quality?

If you are asking about VR, then I don't have much experience with that. Wouldn't it depend on the resolution of the VR headset?

But I can tell you my experience on a normal display: I have an i7-9700K and an RTX 3080, and a 120 Hz 4k g-sync display. In-ship the game runs at full 120 Hz @ 4k without the GPU even getting warm. On foot, especially inside stations, the framerate might drop to about 90 Hz, but I have rarely seen it drop significantly lower than that.

 

[Dark Okram]

Try this guide:

Quest 3 Virtual Desktop & VDXR - PCVR Setup Guide

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81k6KvXJXc8

forums.frontier.co.uk

And this thread:

Quest 3 - How do you use Virtual Desktop with non-SteamVR ED

Hi all I should know this. When I tried to run ED with Virtual Desktop it tried to launch SteamVR which I don't want to use. (Airlink is unplayably laggy for me and I would like to make use of VD's upscaler.) What is the process for getting ED running in VR using VD. Or do I have to use...

forums.frontier.co.uk

Thank you DeckerSolo, i'll check it ASAP
Esactrly @DjVortex, but with VR you have 2 screen with two different images (one for left eye and one for the right one) so is like have 2 monitors @90fps with SteamVR SS130% is like 3000x3000+ for eye if i remember well...
I'll check ingame ASAP and will upload here the FPSVR screenshot with resolution, GPU and CPU use, frametime etc...

 

[DjVortex]

Esactrly @DjVortex, but with VR you have 2 screen with two different images (one for left eye and one for the right one) so is like have 2 monitors @90fps with SteamVR SS130% is like 3000x3000+ for eye if i remember well...

Well, if you use a headset with such high resolutions, you'll have to have the hardware to run it too...

 

[BigBANGerZ]

The quest is: until now i bought and bought new hardware in years from 2016 until now... now i think i reached the top, can't buy anything better anymore... WHAT HARDWARE DO ELITE NEED TO HAVE 90fps at 90Hz always at the best quality? May you help me in this? I would play in VR (that is real immersive and fantastic) with better quality and faster... is it possible? Do someone plays in VR with all the settings at max quality with better results than me?

Yes, try the Pimax Crystal with Dynamic Foveated Rendering. You should see a higher resolution, better performance, better colour and better contrast from the local dimming.

For developers: Do you think in future you could implement things to help like a working antialiasing like DLSS 3 or similar? I don't think will buy a 5090 to try have a dozen fps more... do you know if you wil optimize somithing in future update to have better quality AND faster game?

Frontier don't seem to want to talk about VR anymore, in fact most ED content creators will walk past it as well. You can try a polite message to the community manager(s)? I hope that changes as some point hell I've even offered to go down to their Cambridge offices to show them how good the experience can be...

 

[FatzDomingo]

I purchased my first VR Rig because of Frontier’s Promise. Graduated to a Valve Headset (£1000) only to find out VR has been parked/dumped. There seems to be a small but not insignificant number of us who were quite happy in our ships and never wanted to walk about on planets, everything we had was lost for legs.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

How have you lost everything? Ship based VR still works perfectly fine to this day. The only restriction is we didn't get any on foot VR. Which you apparently don't care about anyway.

I wish people would stop exaggerating and being overly dramatic.

 

[jojon]

I mean, if anybody do not care about walking about, good for them -- no skin off their nose, but 3D immersion really comes into its own in smaller scale; When most stuff one see is hundreds of metres away, the part contribution that stereoscopy adds to the experience is diminished -- it is strongest with things near range, where angular deltas are more dramatic.

 

[Rat Catcher]

I purchased my first VR Rig because of Frontier’s Promise.

What promise was that? (Frontier appear to have made so many promises according to players)
I bought my first VR rig because I wanted to play games in VR, and ED was one of them. EDO still looks pretty fine in VR too, even if walking isn't VR, but at least it has the same VR as Horizons - instead of dropping VR as was the original intent.

 

[FatzDomingo]

What promise was that? (Frontier appear to have made so many promises according to players)
I bought my first VR rig because I wanted to play games in VR, and ED was one of them. EDO still looks pretty fine in VR too, even if walking isn't VR, but at least it has the same VR as Horizons - instead of dropping VR as was the original intent.

The one that said "Made for VR"?

 

[BigBANGerZ]

 

[Northpin]

The one that said "Made for VR"?

Still perfectly valid for Elite Dangerous Legacy

They made no such statements for Odyssey.
Even more so, they were planning to drop VR support from Odyssey, but eventually cave in and they let Odyssey have full VR support in-ship (like Legacy) and pancake on-foot.

 

[Dragsham]

EDO has exactly the same VR implementation as Horizons - do you disagree on that?

Can't see why you've stated this? I'd say "so what?!"
Edo edh legacy wotever! It's not relevant.
What's relevant is edo came out a mess incomplete unoptimised and broken. Elite lost 10s of 1000s of cmdrs as a result of it.
What's relevant is this game needs help. And I'd say its too little too late.
VR had no part in that monumental mulch up. Bad implementation and focused game loops that were meh did.
Don't paint this game as unbroken because that's just not true. Granted it works as does VR. But the opportunities to make this game amazing were missed. And trust me I more than anyone, am gutted because of it.
Let's hope they fix it.. really really I do because I love this game. I'm just not going to cite it as being fab.
SC is even worse as a comparison.. so it's not alone.
Fact is these games are huge in their scope. Mayhap that's their problem. Trying to do too much.
The VR forum is dead because nothings changed there's been no new stuff announced.

 

[Arioch]

Well, we could point at the most liked suggestion in the Suggestions sub-forum (or the third most liked) but I’m sure that couldn’t be used to try and annoy pro-VR forumites

If the VR sub-forum (5.7K threads, 102K messages) is to be held up as a dead thing, what does it say for the Thargoid & Gaurdians sub-forum (2.6K threads, 70.4K messages) or those poor BGS enthusiasts (1K threads, 29.3K messages)? Thankfully the VR forum is quiet because no new issues have been introduced in recent updates (well, not many ) though new users do pop up occasionally asking for advice.

“Made for VR” used (emphasis on “used”) to be a prominent full page thing on the Elite Dangerous website - people shouldn’t try to make out like it was never a thing, likewise other people shouldn’t try to apply it to the current situation with Odyssey.

Hopefully the current bugs with flickering shadows and view glitches will be fixed in upcoming Updates and Odyssey might finally come closer to matching the VR experience of Legacy.

 

[Rat Catcher]

Don't paint this game as unbroken because that's just not true.

Where have I done that?

Granted it works as does VR

It works as FD intended - and yes, EDO on release was abysmal in VR performance, it is massively improved today over then. (but will never, ever, come close to the optimisation that went into HL: Alyx, or Boneworks, or....)

But the opportunities to make this game amazing were missed

Isn't this the same thing said by some since the day ED launched?

FD decide how much development money is spent on their games, surely, if they thought that a full implementation of VR, ship interiors, space EVA, ELW's and all of the other features that are considered essential by differing player interests, the money would have been spent, anticipating a return in excess of outlay.

As Frontier hold their cards very close to their chest over development of the game, I, personally, find it easier to just play what I have, than be disillusioned over what it 'might have been', it works well enough for me.

 

[Rat Catcher]

“Made for VR” used (emphasis on “used”) to be a prominent full page thing on the Elite Dangerous website - people shouldn’t try to make out like it was never a thing, likewise other people shouldn’t try to apply it to the current situation with Odyssey.

Marketing does change, to be more in line with current trends, and that particular plug disappeared around the launch of Odyssey, didn't it? (I remember it being prominent for years)

The crazy thing is that ED, serendipity probably, does convey scale & depth in VR very well indeed - it is the first game of choice I've used to 'demonstrate' VR to friends & family, just because of the "WOW!" factor presented by the cockpit view. (Alyx comes 2nd)

But, it is factual, PCVR takeup never hit the anticipated adoption being touted in the recent past, needing too much power to produce a good experience, and the cost of components, particularly GPUs, going very high because of crypto mining, chip shortages and massive price gouging that followed. That and the current (and next, apparently) generation of GPUs have inflated costs due to a mixture of fabrication cost & greed.

I have a reasonable library of VR games, all of which are entertaining, but most don't really try to get the most from VR, possibly because to do it very well, these days, costs too much? (I have no idea, just conjecture)

 

[Arioch]

I have a reasonable library of VR games, all of which are entertaining, but most don't really try to get the most from VR, possibly because to do it very well, these days, costs too much? (I have no idea, just conjecture)

While I’m quite happy being able to play “in” the sort of standard games we’ve always had, there aren’t that many that embrace what VR can really do - but I’d say that depends on the creativity of devs in the face of financial considerations. For every 10x multiplayer 5v5 arena shooter games pumped out, you might get 1x Fisherman’s Tale or Batman: Arkham VR, both of which use VR in some very inventive ways.

The VR market looks to be facing towards stand-alone now - there was one dev a while back who said they made more in 2 months from releasing on Quest than they’d made in the previous 4 years on PCVR. A more recent report from a PCVR KickStarter project has said that they’re now aiming to also release a flatscreen version of the game as the PCVR market is very stagnant. I’d be interested in the figures for simulation games though, I’m sure VR will have a bigger user base there.

Hopefully the newly formed Flat2VR Studios can reinvigorate PCVR - they’re hopeful of working with game studios to bring VR versions of existing games to market (they’re made up of the bods who’ve been releasing excellent VR mods, some of which have got officially sanctioned like Half-Life 2 VR) and have lots of experience with the VR parts of modern game engines.

Hey, FDEV, give them a shout about Odyssey feet