Making Credits - Very slow time consuming process - i.e. Ships cost way to much

[Flyinpiranha]

Like I said, if you aren't interested in ever having the 'big' ship, why do you care how much it costs or how long it takes others to get it.

I think it's more the case, you simple don't want other people flying big ships.

Of course I don't. Bigger ships mean that trade routes get decimated faster, and everything else goes up, damage, cargo, etc ... the game JUST LAUNCHED and you want everybody in end-game ships? How does that even make sense, it would ruin the economy, ruin trade routes, ruin PVP in general because there would be no variation.

The ONLY thing keeping people from running around in fully decked ASP's and Pythons is the price. Take that away and then they have to add a 150m ship, then that's easily achievable, then a 400m ship ... but then you'll just complain that you can't get that fast enough.

This isn't Team Fortress 2 or CS:GO where you have a fairly even playing field, there are a vast array of choices for you to make and huge time sinks involved. It's the nature of the game. I don't think a couple years for the most awesome crazy ship in the system is that off-base for a casual player.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be pricing adjustments, but the fact that some think they should be in a Python right now, barely 2 weeks after launch tells me the "adjustments" would be more like black Friday sales.

 

[Wurmfist]

The problem lie in the ways we make money.

Bounty hunting are fun and can get you a nice cobra but it's way too slow for an asp... and a good class A cobra is enough for anything you face.
Mining can barly top 150-200k/h and it make you hate cargo scooping after a few hours.
Missions are good at the beginning but it's not enough past a certain point. I had a few ~100-150k benefit missions but... thoses are rare and it's not enough.
Basic "commerce" is incredibly boring and depressing, it's horrible once you realise you have to do the same run hundred of time in order to get the next ship.

Bounty hunting rewards have to be increased for mid-high end (special events with multiple pirate ships?), mining need a new module allowing to scoop from a distance (drone, tractor beam...).

Mining could very profitable if we could avoid scooping. Still grindy and a bit boring but a valid alternative.

I mean, if i do a trade run with a type 6 i can get ~100-150kcred for a 100 ton cargo w/o trying too hard, a mission to kill an anaconda pirate? 130-170k credits.

The game is clearly unfinished. I realize ED wants to make the galaxy "realistic" but they sort of need to make an MMO approach to it slightly. They already do this in a slight manner with conflict zones but there needs to be places that are harder and easier than others. The equivalent of being able to take your level 80 character into an area that a level 20 couldn't. Thereby giving those "higher level" players a larger reward for the risk they take. As I see it now, there really isn't much benefit to flying around in a python, other than the cool factor, because the python can only do much of the same missions and things that a sidewinder or any other lower tier ship can do and you have that much more expenses you have to make up for just in the upkeep.

The only people I know that run around in a python were beta/gamma players who exploited the rares trading and made millions upon millions of credits.

I love this game, but it is nowhere near finished, or balanced, or optimized, or whatever.

 

[CMDR Cheknov]

Thats funny cause i dont ahve any galaxy map0 info on trade or what systems are controled by what factions even when i pay for data there is nothing just dots i can plan routs through

 

[Zzabur]

I guess that people asking for cheap ships to reach the bigger ships won't play anymore after getting it. This game is about decisions and the way you get things, moreover ship prices is not the only cost, what aboutclass A modules? They cost much more than the whole ship, so if Frontier lowers the ships' prices, we'll get threads with "class A too expensive".

In the end, you play 2 days, grinding grinding grinding, get the best ships with all class A modules and then? Someone said that prices are unrealistic, i would find very unrealistic to see only Anaconda and big warships flying around, and no one in hauler, eagle.....

When i played Elite and Elite 2, it was a pain to get a Puma, and upkeep costs were hard to maintain too, but it's the way it's meant to be, it's far more difficult as a bad trade route will cost a lot in fuel while you can fly around with a small ship to explore and check prices for a very low cost.

 

[Solarwind]

Yeah, see? Those prices are seriously laughable at this point. If all of a sudden I woke up tomorrow and my life consisted of nothing but playing video games and eating Hot Pockets, then I might be able to afford all of that in a reasonable time frame. I have devoted all of my free time since release, doing all the most profitable activities there are in the game at the moment(no exploits), and my assets are just barely at 25 million. Getting to a fully fitted Anaconda or a Python isn't even a grind, it's a death sentence. Because I would literally die of boredom before I ever made it there. If you do make it to a Python, the game is like "Congrats! Now to fit a some half way decent mods, prepare to do all that again, and then again... and then probably one more time". Outer space is awesome, but it's not THAT awesome.

Don't get me wrong, I love the game, and I really want a Python. But if they don't increase the flow of income, lower some of those dramatic module prices, or start slinging ships from their website like ol' RSI, then only the super die hard fans will ever make it that far. That some how just doesn't seem fair to the working class portion of the community that's shelled out hard earned money to see Elite: Dangerous get to where it's at.

OK you are doing something wrong , i have spent most of my holiday season with my wife and have played less than 4 hours a day and have a type 7 full A kit and 15 mill in cash , and make 2.2 mill a hour , hauling pays the most mining is probably second bounty hunting is 3rd.
i can make 500k an hour mining ,,,, money is not hard to get , i could have easily had the base 150 mill for the conda NP. but i have been doing other things because yes just grinding hauling would be a PAIN , but some people can do it. i haul for a hour or 2 then go do something else for a while.

my long range plan is to get a Python get at least a B kit on it then just cruise around the universe taking missions hauling and having a good time seeing what is out there

 

[Im_Lost]

There are still 15 ships missing from the game right? The gaps will get a lot shorter eventually.

 

[CMDR Cheknov]

OK you are doing something wrong , i have spent most of my holiday season with my wife and have played less than 4 hours a day and have a type 7 full A kit and 15 mill in cash , and make 2.2 mill a hour , hauling pays the most mining is probably second bounty hunting is 3rd.
i can make 500k an hour mining ,,,, money is not hard to get , i could have easily had the base 150 mill for the conda NP. but i have been doing other things because yes just grinding hauling would be a PAIN , but some people can do it. i haul for a hour or 2 then go do something else for a while.

my long range plan is to get a Python get at least a B kit on it then just cruise around the universe taking missions hauling and having a good time seeing what is out there

yes we heard you three times already, you are a master of the game and have elite title in trading yes mayby so, not all people play the same. sry wrong quote!!!

 

[changtau2005]

Buy the ship you need and parts that fit the job. Do you really need that class A part? Part B parts cost 1/5th that of class A and perform almost just as well except mass.

If you buy a ship just to "experience" it or "look at it during outfitting", you're going to regret it unless you bought it using throwaway income; not many players have 100m Cr throwaway income. A rational person wouldn't spend your life savings on a top-of-the-line sports car unless they can comfortably afford it or have a use for it (maybe you race professionally?). These ships have astronomical maintenance, running, and repair costs, so they are not practical as combat vessels, and they're not practical in most situations. They're absolutely powerful, but if you take damage on a regular basis, your bank balance goes to pieces, even if you trade.

 

[anikaiful]

yes maybe working as intented, but that dosnt make the game ne better, and does not fix what alot of people think are poroblems

There is nothing to "fix" in the prices.

 

[Wurmfist]

I guess that people asking for cheap ships to reach the bigger ships won't play anymore after getting it. This game is about decisions and the way you get things, moreover ship prices is not the only cost, what aboutclass A modules? They cost much more than the whole ship, so if Frontier lowers the ships' prices, we'll get threads with "class A too expensive".

In the end, you play 2 days, grinding grinding grinding, get the best ships with all class A modules and then? Someone said that prices are unrealistic, i would find very unrealistic to see only Anaconda and big warships flying around, and no one in hauler, eagle.....

When i played Elite and Elite 2, it was a pain to get a Puma, and upkeep costs were hard to maintain too, but it's the way it's meant to be, it's far more difficult as a bad trade route will cost a lot in fuel while you can fly around with a small ship to explore and check prices for a very low cost.

In the end, there has to be some element that is more game-like. Nobody wants to log into a game and go about a day-to-day routine just like the job they work at in real life to pay the bills. Let's be realistic here.

 

[CMDR Cheknov]

In the end, there has to be some element that is more game-like. Nobody wants to log into a game and go about a day-to-day routine just like the job they work at in real life to pay the bills. Let's be realistic here.

This is the point ive been tryoing to make and maybe ED Devs will take a look at this, cause only 4 or 5 people who have been posting are say prices are fine so there must be a legit issue especially since the mods havent closed my post down like they normally do lol

 

[Dabba]

There are still 15 ships missing from the game right? The gaps will get a lot shorter eventually.

This is true, and it will be good, but I don't think its going to change the mentality of the people programmed to seek the endgame. Theyre still going to want the Conda, they're still going to complain about how long it takes. What happens if 5 of those ships are bigger than the Conda, and the biggest one costs 10x that of the Conda. Oh my the forum slagstorm, it will be glorious.

This is the same casual v hardcore argument that happens on the forums of every online game. "I want the best stuff, but I don't want to put in the time to get the best stuff." Tough cookies, not everyone is entitled to the best stuff, you want it, go earn it. I used to be hardcore when I was a kid, now I have a wife and 2 kids of my own. I want the best stuff, I realize I dont have the time to get it in short order, I accept that.

Personally I am of the opinion that if there are more than 10 player owned (non-gamma) accounts with Anacondas after 2 weeks then they need to increase the price. But Ill compromise and say its fine where it is.

 

[Gremlin]

Prices of ships and equipment are just fine thanks.

Accept the fact you can't have everything you want straight away. Go back to playing the game in your new enlightened state.

In your opinion.

I however think the OP has a point - and FWIW I'm a KS backer and I have a pretty monster ASP.

The point is though, that once you get a big ship, the costs involved in running it dont scale with the ship costs or its ability to earn.

Even an ASP - the fuel costs can sometimes completely swap the mission rewards. A hunt&kill mission becomes a loss-maker if you take any more than a few % hull damage. Dont even get me started on Wear&Tear.. I've dropped 250K at one point on one W&T bill, and I'm not alone. 250K even now that would be 4 average fully loaded hauls - hope you weren't 'wasting' precious cargo space carrying sensors or anything. Now have a look at the module prices - 5M for a class A thing (on an ASP - 50-80 Hauls per upgrade * 10? modules not counting guns or armour) .. IIRC an anaconda class A thing is 50M.. the insurance and replacement costs of a kitted anaconda would be crushing.

I love the game, but what we have right now is a credit grinder.

And please dont bang on about how a viper is good enough for you, or a cobra is the be-all-end-all, thats fine if thats what you want, and has nothing to do with how expensive a ship might be.

Me, I want a fully kitted Conda and then I want to go exploring and pirate hunting in my over-powered melty boat.. Or maybe help over throw a government somewhere.

Currently thats not a viable option and it would take an eternity to get there.

Or, let me inject my RL $ into the game and I'll trade off my RL cash against game time in a manner that suits me.. $1 for 10M .. even then, that makes a fully kitted 'Conda > $100 which is not cheap..

 

[anikaiful]

Or, let me inject my RL $ into the game and I'll trade off my RL cash against game time in a manner that suits me.. $1 for 10M .. even then, that makes a fully kitted 'Conda > $100 which is not cheap..

Now, THAT option would ruin the whole game.

 

[Wicz]

In your opinion.

And mine!

Happy New Year!!

 

[Dabba]

In your opinion.

and mine, and it seems like the majority.

Wasn't me, I didn't make him do it, nothing to see here.

 

[CMDR Cheknov]

Me, I want a fully kitted Conda and then I want to go exploring and pirate hunting in my over-powered melty boat.. Or maybe help over throw a government somewhere.

Currently thats not a viable option and it would take an eternity to get there.

Or, let me inject my RL $ into the game and I'll trade off my RL cash against game time in a manner that suits me.. $1 for 10M .. even then, that makes a fully kitted 'Conda > $100 which is not cheap..

funny cause this is exactly what i want to do, its how "I WANT TO PLAY" and i cant not for a few years it seems

 

[Unpleasant]

I understand. What I'm warning you against is that flying that ship will put you in significant financial risk, given you're currently unable to earn credits rapidly.

It could ruin you. So avoid the rush.

Of course, if you find the game a monotony... A few words to the wise; ship progression is not a way to spruce up your enjoyment of the game. Trust me on this. This isn't like Gran Turismo where your progression is measured by the cars you own. That road will kill the game for you fast.

Settle on a small number of ships and upgrade them. Do new things. Get involved in a civil war. Do bounty hunting with rares in your cargo and sell them periodically once full. Arm a viper to the teeth and take on a capital ship.

Just avoid thinking that the only way to enjoy the game is to constantly get bigger ships.

So there's no point in flying a big ship because financially you just can't earn enough to make it viable... BUT... The costs to buy, to upgrade, to insurance AND the profits we earn from trading is fine... lol made me giggle. lol

 

[Shear]

For a person with a full time job and or college this game will last years if he/she wants the best ship and mods, however, I highly doubt that anyone will be staying that long as it stands right now.
Braben himself said that it is key to not make one method of making money, vastly superior than all others, as it stands right now, trading is the best way to make money by a massive amount and the sad thing is that I see them nerfing that far more likely than increasing payouts from wanted ships and exploration.
The people who say you don't really need big ships in this game are right, but at the moment upgrading to a bigger, better ship is the only real meaningful progress in the game.


Boy, I know I'll get sacked for saying this now.

 

[Dabba]

So there's no point in flying a big ship because financially you just can't earn enough to make it viable... BUT... The costs to buy, to upgrade, to insurance AND the profits we earn from trading is fine... lol made me giggle. lol

These are two different arguments though.

If you want to argue that the payout for bounty hunting and exploring need to be adjusted upwards, you have my sword, I am on your side of that argument.

If you want to argue that the biggest ships cost to much, we are squarely in opposition..