Modes "Open Play" Should be the Ideal Mode

[WindWpn]

Agreed, and not only Ideal but it should be ONLY mode!

The key, in my opinion is expanded space. The Galaxy in ED is huge, far larger than the entire player base can experience in a real lifetime, and far beyond the size for a very small percentage of PvP to occupy, and for those who simply want to operate in peace, pack up ship and head out to somewhere in the galaxy which is remote and/or operates with minimal CMDR passage (I have my own little home system myself and rarely if ever have experienced someone passing though in mission ranges of that home system). Currently we have Colonia, but why not more areas of the galaxy budding of human expansion? If activity is spread out, conflict between CMDRs would be so rare to be a non-issue (frankly it is like that now anyway even in the "bubble" if you settle into a system that is "standard."

The "fear" of Open is so incredibly overrated that its borders on nonsense. Indeed, it does happen, and I have been victim a few times myself, but in my time in ED, its been less than 5 times in 100s of hours of game play (started playing in 2016).

The only, and I mean ONLY issue with being all Open now are consoles and technical limitation of instancing. PS4 and Xbox have the integration issues with PC Open (I assume from reading other threads?) so this limits ability to have one space. However, if this is overcome, and ED is only one space, it would make for such a better all around ranging player experience and game development.

In the wish myself for seeing something big in ED such as atmospheric landings and interesting planets, expansion of pockets of "life" in the galaxy would be awesome... centered on one "Open Play" instance.

 

[Jockey79]

Agreed, and not only Ideal but it should be ONLY mode!

The key, in my opinion is expanded space. The Galaxy in ED is huge, far larger than the entire player base can experience in a real lifetime, and far beyond the size for a very small percentage of PvP to occupy, and for those who simply want to operate in peace, pack up ship and head out to somewhere in the galaxy which is remote and/or operates with minimal CMDR passage (I have my own little home system myself and rarely if ever have experienced someone passing though in mission ranges of that home system). Currently we have Colonia, but why not more areas of the galaxy budding of human expansion? If activity is spread out, conflict between CMDRs would be so rare to be a non-issue (frankly it is like that now anyway even in the "bubble" if you settle into a system that is "standard."

The "fear" of Open is so incredibly overrated that its borders on nonsense. Indeed, it does happen, and I have been victim a few times myself, but in my time in ED, its been less than 5 times in 100s of hours of game play (started playing in 2016).

The only, and I mean ONLY issue with being all Open now are consoles and technical limitation of instancing. PS4 and Xbox have the integration issues with PC Open (I assume from reading other threads?) so this limits ability to have one space. However, if this is overcome, and ED is only one space, it would make for such a better all around ranging player experience and game development.

In the wish myself for seeing something big in ED such as atmospheric landings and interesting planets, expansion of pockets of "life" in the galaxy would be awesome... centered on one "Open Play" instance.

As much as there is to pick fault with here, I'm going to focus on 1 point;

Why should others have to "pack up ship"?

That is a double edged sword, because the Devs confirmed that PvP is the minority in Elite: Dangerous - so why doesn't the minority group pack up and leave?
They can keep the main bubble as PvE and send PvP'ers / open only folks to Beagle Point to have what they want.

See how this works?

 

[WindWpn]

As much as there is to pick fault with here, I'm going to focus on 1 point;

Why should others have to "pack up ship"?

That is a double edged sword, because the Devs confirmed that PvP is the minority in Elite: Dangerous - so why doesn't the minority group pack up and leave?
They can keep the main bubble as PvE and send PvP'ers / open only folks to Beagle Point to have what they want.

See how this works?

"Pack up ship" could be 6 lt yrs away from where PvP action is and there you would never see a CMDR....

Frankly, the worry is that "peaceful" CMDRs simply need to be smart and stay away from locations of danger, if they do not want it. If course if you are engineering up, there may be a slight risk going into an Engineer system, but simply be prepared. CGs too are dangerous, but if you do not want to deal with PvP (even if it is rare too there), simply do not do CGs. CGs offer nothing beyond what a normal system mission offers.

And now, all can be integrated with no issues. Again, even the human bubble space is soo vastly large that a "peaceful" CMDR can be lost in the noise of that space with no PvP interaction ever if they desire.

Post script: I am a "peaceful" CMDR flying small/medium ships only. I usually run from a PvP interdiction in the less than 5 times experienced, and was killed once. My home system rarely has a CMDR pass-though (checking on ROSS), and I am allied with the lead faction so mission payouts are substantial. Fun times!

 

[Goose4291]

I know we've gone well of the rails for the thread, but as we seem to be getting somewhere with this chat I don't want to interrupt it

1) As part of the first cargo grab, it could "damage" the bay after a successful break so a 2nd limpet won't connect until its fixed? (and the trader would need to fix it when docked to be able to unload their cargo / get new cargo)

2) Despawn bug? You lost me. I know there is an instance limit of 20T of cargo, due to people spamming cargo to cause "grief" (lag spikes) outside stations.
Perhaps the limit needs bringing up to 10% of the max a Cutter can carry (so 76T of cargo for the limit)

3) Alas, P2P and Server/Client suffer from Alt+F4. Server/Client can at least do something about it (keeping people in game), but P2P there isn't much that can be done.
With luck Frontier do investigate reports of genuine CL'ing, but with the false ones reported as well (as menu log is legit, as you well know), it's an uphill struggle for them.
Though one thing is to have the limpet cycle to be around 3 to 5 seconds once attached to drop the cargo, so by the time someone menu logs, you have the cargo anyway.

4) Well, Power Play is supposed to be the opt in, consensual PvP system. So if both parties are pledged, then fire away.
I would have a wind up and cool down for joining powers though. To stop people hot swapping to bypass C&P for CGs.
7 days after application to join, 7 days from notice to leave. So people pick a side and stay with it (hopefully)

I'd like the thank the mod team for allowing this side chat, how great are they

1) That could work.
2) Once players get a certain distance from a cargo container (cant remember the distance off the top of my head) it despawns). Speed and limpets bring a few further issues I only just thought of as well, specifically around the fact you need to slow down to collect your limpet, possibly limiting the chances of getting that 'big score'
3) Yeah, I get that. Ideally, I'd say if you suffer a disconnect, the server should spawn double the tonnage of whatever is the most profitable item in a loggers hold into the instance for the pirate, and subtract it from their inventory when they next log in (assuming inventory is handled in the same manner as an ArmA hived server). This might discourage logging on pirates a little as well as youre theoretically losing more by cheating.
4) I agree, but I think you misunderstand. Actual Pirates dont do powerplay, as there's nothing in it for them really, much like Open Traders dont. Consideration needs to be given to that, last thing we want is to stop those who can and do try to defend themselves from having that option.

Re: Pledge times, I agree. Its an easy fix to stop people pledging at the CG of the week to avoid C&P ramifications week in, week out.

 

[Mouse]

Agreed, and not only Ideal but it should be ONLY mode!

The key, in my opinion is expanded space. The Galaxy in ED is huge, far larger than the entire player base can experience in a real lifetime, and far beyond the size for a very small percentage of PvP to occupy, and for those who simply want to operate in peace, pack up ship and head out to somewhere in the galaxy which is remote and/or operates with minimal CMDR passage (I have my own little home system myself and rarely if ever have experienced someone passing though in mission ranges of that home system). Currently we have Colonia, but why not more areas of the galaxy budding of human expansion? If activity is spread out, conflict between CMDRs would be so rare to be a non-issue (frankly it is like that now anyway even in the "bubble" if you settle into a system that is "standard."

The "fear" of Open is so incredibly overrated that its borders on nonsense. Indeed, it does happen, and I have been victim a few times myself, but in my time in ED, its been less than 5 times in 100s of hours of game play (started playing in 2016).

The only, and I mean ONLY issue with being all Open now are consoles and technical limitation of instancing. PS4 and Xbox have the integration issues with PC Open (I assume from reading other threads?) so this limits ability to have one space. However, if this is overcome, and ED is only one space, it would make for such a better all around ranging player experience and game development.

In the wish myself for seeing something big in ED such as atmospheric landings and interesting planets, expansion of pockets of "life" in the galaxy would be awesome... centered on one "Open Play" instance.

No fear at all... Fdev promised me a game where I didn't have to PVP. Now you are wanting them to renege on that promise for your own playstyle...

 

[Goose4291]

No fear at all... Fdev promised me a game where I didn't have to PVP. Now you are wanting them to renege on that promise for your own playstyle...

You still dont have to pvp

Simply don't play powerplay, a mechanic you've previously declared as having no interest in.

 

[Mouse]

You still dont have to pvp

Simply don't play powerplay, a mechanic you've previously declared as having no interest in.

I do play power play, though not avidly, and even if it is open only it relies on PVE mechanics.

 

[Deleted member 110222]

I do play power play, though not avidly, and even if it is open only it relies on PVE mechanics.

Stopping Powerplay cargo/merits from reaching home is very much a PvP activity.

 

[Mouse]

Stopping Powerplay cargo/merits from reaching home is very much a PvP activity.

Can be stopped in any of the three modes and is very much a PVE activity.

 

[Goose4291]

Can be stopped in any of the three modes and is very much a PVE activity.

Your lack of mechanics knowledge is showing here.

How can a power (which is comprised of players) stop you (as a commander) from delivering tokens/handing in merits if youre behind an unassailable wall of your own construction?

 

[Deleted member 110222]

Can be stopped in any of the three modes and is very much a PVE activity.

Hardly.

NPCs simply don't have teeth unless you're really bad.

Powerplay needs to go Open only so that transport ships face an actual threat. You know, because it is meant to be a conflict.

Mouse, mate. I know better than most how daunting PvP can seem. I won't get into the details, but what I will tell you is you DO NOT have to destroy your opposition. As a merit mover you simply have to get home. To survive.

If you want any advice on survival, you need only ask. I cannot offer advice on killing. I can offer advice on not getting killed, however.

 

[Mouse]

Hardly.

NPCs simply don't have teeth unless you're really bad.

Powerplay needs to go Open only so that transport ships face an actual threat. You know, because it is meant to be a conflict.

Mouse, mate. I know better than most how daunting PvP can seem. I won't get into the details, but what I will tell you is you DO NOT have to destroy your opposition. As a merit mover you simply have to get home. To survive.

If you want any advice on survival, you need only ask. I cannot offer advice on killing. I can offer advice on not getting killed, however.

Other week watched a youtube video of a guy in a shielded T-9 getting masslocked and killed by NPCs...NPCs have teeth for many people, I know some think they are a joke but many do not and conflict doesn't mean killing. Power Play has been available and done by people in all modes from the beginning. And it isn't that PVP is daunting.. but some cannot PVP for whatever reasons, Fdev offered them the ability to participate in Power Play.. and now three years down the road one dev is contemplating yanking that rug out from them ?

 

[Mouse]

Your lack of mechanics knowledge is showing here.

How can a power (which is comprised of players) stop you (as a commander) from delivering tokens/handing in merits if youre behind an unassailable wall of your own construction?

A power is comprised of players? Hmm... Goose can you please tell me which person is playing Duval? Winters, Hudson??? I am very well aware of the mechanics which you seem to ignore also affect Open *Cough* instancing. Yet you want to vilify the modes who don't want to play like you do even though you CHOSE to play how you do.

 

[Deleted member 110222]

A power is comprised of players? Hmm... Goose can you please tell me which person is playing Duval? Winters, Hudson??? I am very well aware of the mechanics which you seem to ignore also affect Open *Cough* instancing. Yet you want to vilify the modes who don't want to play like you do even though you CHOSE to play how you do.

The power actions are done by players. He was not saying that players are the power characters... That you are making up.

As for people not able to PvP... Why should they have an unopposed say over other players?

Thing is dude, games change. Especially games with multiplayer. I've been on the bad end before. My all-time favourite FPS made drastic changes to its gun handling... And I didn't like it one bit. So I quit. Seven years later... That game is still going strong, despite losing players. It was fixing a broken mechanic.

And right now, Powerplay is a broken mechanic. Broken as it's a competitive mechanic that is able to be played without facing competition.

 

[Goose4291]

A power is comprised of players? Hmm... Goose can you please tell me which person is playing Duval? Winters, Hudson??? I am very well aware of the mechanics which you seem to ignore also affect Open *Cough* instancing. Yet you want to vilify the modes who don't want to play like you do even though you CHOSE to play how you do.

A powers actions in powerplay are purely driven by the sum actions of its playerbase.

Writing a vague strawman coupled with allusions to you 'knowing the mechanics' while every powerplayer here has to explain in extensive detail to you why youre grasp of mechanics is wrong, and adding a personal attack with a hint of victim politics does nothing to reinforce your position.

 

[Jockey79]

The power actions are done by players. He was not saying that players are the power characters... That you are making up.

As for people not able to PvP... Why should they have an unopposed say over other players?

Thing is dude, games change. Especially games with multiplayer. I've been on the bad end before. My all-time favourite FPS made drastic changes to its gun handling... And I didn't like it one bit. So I quit. Seven years later... That game is still going strong, despite losing players. It was fixing a broken mechanic.

And right now, Powerplay is a broken mechanic. Broken as it's a competitive mechanic that is able to be played without facing competition.

Competitive does not mean PvP.
Power Play is based on shoving PvE tokens about, the competitive part is who can shove the most in the shortest time, which can be done in any mode.

 

[Deleted member 110222]

Competitive does not mean PvP.
Power Play is based on shoving PvE tokens about, the competitive part is who can shove the most in the shortest time, which can be done in any mode.

And FD is now open to changing the rules.

It's hardly radical. Sporting leagues do it every year.

Competition evolves.

 

[Jockey79]

And FD is now open to changing the rules.

It's hardly radical. Sporting leagues do it every year.

Competition evolves.

Changing rules and yanking the pitch from under people are two very different things.
And in a game where direct PvP was always optional, trying to suddenly force PvP by taking content away from people will harm the game more than solve a minorities blood lust.

 

[Goose4291]

Changing rules and yanking the pitch from under people are two very different things.
And in a game where direct PvP was always optional, trying to suddenly force PvP by taking content away from people will harm the game more than solve a minorities blood lust.

Or it could be them correcting a glaring mistake based on their naive viewpoint that a large chunk of their playerbase are here for the experience and not min/maxxers chasing the path of least resistance when it comes to competitive play.

 

[Deleted member 110222]

Changing rules and yanking the pitch from under people are two very different things.
And in a game where direct PvP was always optional, trying to suddenly force PvP by taking content away from people will harm the game more than solve a minorities blood lust.

I give up.

You clearly don't understand how competition works.