Petition to bring back the DDF/DDA and get back on track.

Objectively stand back...and read the following. PP introduced almost all of the following in one update.

TIER 1 CHARACTERS
Tier 1 characters are major characters within the game world, for example Planetary Presidents, Major Corporation CEO’s and top ranking crime bosses. Typically the player will interact with tier 2 characters associated with the tier 1 character rather than directly with the tier 1 character.
There is a global list of tier 1 characters.
They are identified by the following characteristics:


  • Players do not interact with these characters directly.
  • The character is common to all online players.
  • The character is created via an in-game invent – typically manually.
  • The character can only be killed by an in-game event.
  • A tier 2 character can be promoted to tier 1, but only by an event.


TIER 1 CHARACTER EXAMPLES

  • Faction leaders
  • Station leaders
  • Regional persons of note
  • Engineering/Scientific specialists (enhanced weapons and modules)
  • Can provide missions, but only on rare occasions, for example:
    • Very high faction rating
    • Very high player rank

I think you're missing the point aren't you? What about all that work on a grind-ladder? Is that a necessary part of T1 NPCs? The bulk of powerplay is the PP system and the gameplay, not the fairly bland figureheads sitting at the top of the powers themselves.

EDIT: tl;dr: you don't need the PP system to introduce Tier 1 NPCs. You could have done that with minimal investment of time and effort and spent the rest of the development effort spent on the PP system on something else from the DDA, something gameplay related, which perhaps, when PP ultimately came along, would have made PP itself far more interesting and meaningful.
 
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Objectively stand back...and read the following. PP introduced almost all of the following in one update.

TIER 1 CHARACTERS
Tier 1 characters are major characters within the game world, for example Planetary Presidents, Major Corporation CEO’s and top ranking crime bosses. Typically the player will interact with tier 2 characters associated with the tier 1 character rather than directly with the tier 1 character.
There is a global list of tier 1 characters.
They are identified by the following characteristics:


  • Players do not interact with these characters directly.
  • The character is common to all online players.
  • The character is created via an in-game invent – typically manually.
  • The character can only be killed by an in-game event.
  • A tier 2 character can be promoted to tier 1, but only by an event.


TIER 1 CHARACTER EXAMPLES

  • Faction leaders
  • Station leaders
  • Regional persons of note
  • Engineering/Scientific specialists (enhanced weapons and modules)
  • Can provide missions, but only on rare occasions, for example:
    • Very high faction rating
    • Very high player rank

You are correct. However they need an awful lot of fleshing out. The only ones I'd even noticed the existence of before powerplay was Arissa and Aisling. Once some proper background and fluff is added to them then I'll truly consider them to be fulfilling the role of tier 1 characters.
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How much of the rest of powerplay fits things from the DDA?
 
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This alone forms one of the main reasons Elite was going to be my dream game...

Same, I really, really wanted to be an explorer, and got into beta mostly for that. I thought about either going on my own, starting a blog to describe my adventures, or joining the First Great Expedition.
Does anyone even remember those guys? Looks like they have disappeared. They made plans to go to the core, thought a lot about issues like logitistics, protection, etc, and were even featured in a newsletter. Reaching the core was expected to take many months with a hundred players involved. Stuff like that could have made the headlines, like big EVE battles. Yet at gamma FD burst the hyperspace bubble and the core was reached within a week...

With respect to exploration FD just had gold in their hands, and wasted it completely. Now what do we have? Honk with infinite range and stare at a blob for 15-35 seconds, and that's supposed to be exploration? There's no challenge, no skill involved, and the data we get back to core systems is probably not even used (so much for the gold rushes uh?).

Reading Ryder's list just hurts.
 
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Viajero

Volunteer Moderator
You missed a few:

Indeed, You also missed a couple more:

I actually tried to do that a few months back but gave up when I got to the 5th page of my word document and realised I had hardly screatched the surface.

Still here is exploration for you ( implemented in green)

Explorer players must discover different points of interest using different methods

Explorer players’ main method of making money is through selling details of points of interest they discover
Points of interest players can discover include:
Star Systems
Dark Systems (systems without a star, but other features)
Stars
Planets

Asteroids, comets
Moons
Structures
Other Phenomena
These Discovered locations may include:
Secret Locations
Resources
Events/Missions (time limited and permenant)
Beauty spots (usually attached to other entities)
Messages/Beacons [Note: Voyayer, the ancient artefacts...]
Players explore to build up the details on their galaxy map
When starting a new commander the player will have some details on their galaxy map
This will allow the player to travel to any locations they have map data to, without having to explore
Players can buy map data from authorities to expand their ships computers library of maps
New map data will allow the player to travel to new locations without needing to explore
Map data that is bought from authorities is not to the highest level of detail and can be improved with player gathered data
Map data includes hyperspace routes to systems and major points of interest in that system

Players can use scanning equipment and probes to detect systems and record new hyperspace routes
Scanners are used to detect any nearby systems that are within the players jump range
Scanners will give the player a vague indication of the direction of a system
High end scanners can give the player a better details of the system they have detected (is it a star, an asteroid field etc.)
Players can then launch hyperspace probes that will give the player more information on the part of space they are looking at
Probes will give the player heat-map style data to help guide the player to the correct co-ordinates for a jump
Heatmap data might be ambiguous, creating skill based gameplay where the player learns to interpret the readings they recieve
Different equipment can determine the quality of heatmap data
Different probe ammo can provide different information, or react based on objects in the target system
Using the data they have gathered the player must align their ship as best they can with the target system and activate the hyperdrive to jump to the system
The player’s ship records data of any successful jumps the player makes
The pilots federation will always pay players for the first successful jump they make using the exploration method (If the player bought the map data for the jump they cannot sell the data), even if the player is not the first person ever to make the jump (the pilots federation use the data to improve their telemetry and keep maps up to date)
If the player is the first person to ever make the journey they receive a bonus for discovering the hyperspace route
The closer the player lines up their jump to the target system, the higher quality the data the players ship will gather on the jump. Higher quality data is worth more money when sold to authorities
If a player’s jump is not accurate enough they may suffer a miss jump
Longer distance jumps require a higher level of accuracy
A systems contents may also affect how accurate a players jump must be to avoid mis-jumping



Players use scanners to detect points of interest within systems
The player’s scanners detect various points of interest around the player
It takes time for players scanners to detect points of interest
Player’s proximity to a point of interest can affect the time it takes to detect
Proximity may often have risks associated with it - Solar Radiation for example
Players ship facing can affect the time it takes to detect a point of interest (e.g. pointing my ship at a undiscovered point of interest will allow me to scan it faster)
Different types of points of interest can require different player actions to detect
For example to detect a mineral rich formation of asteroids the player must launch probes around an asteroid field
The probes provide a cross section from their perspective of the asteroid field they’re launched at
Each additional probe the player uses provides more details on the target asteroid field
The player uses their scanner to view the data from the probes, and must tag the areas with the highest concentration of minerals in the field
Once this process is complete the point of interest is completed
The quality of the players scan of the area affects the value of the data
The quality of the player’s scan can affect the amount and type of materials found in the asteroids
Players can sell the information that they discover through these methods
Players will have to travel back to sell the data they acquire while exploring
The first player to sell/discover the information recieves a greater reward
Information by become redundant from time to time as the galaxy moves and it can then be resold



Players can sell information they have gathered to other players as well as authorities. This is done through a trade interface similar to the trade goods trading interface. Players can sell hyperspace routes from their location to any single system they have explored to. The purchasing player then offers a price (this can be 0 if it is a gift), and if both players are satisfied they agree to the trade. Players can also trade in system data including locations of points of interest using the same method.

Players can take photographs (essentially screenshots) from their view ports (with and without cockpit and GUI etc)
Player photographs can be submitted to a regular photography contest [NOTE: This has been done with videos already for the Ctr+Alt+Space]
Players can only submit one photograph each
Players can vote on a selection of the best photographs
The player(s) who get the most votes wins the competition
The winner gets a (in game) cash prize (plus prizes for 2nd 3rd most weird etc.)
The photograph (and other user submissions) will be used in appropriate places in the game (billboards, news papers, etc.)
[/COLOR]

And after all this, we can sumarize what is left missing of the Exploration DDA in a few bullets:

- Additional points of interest to discover
- Exploration probes and associated mechanics
- Mis-jump and new system charting mechanics
- Player info trading mechanics
 
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I think you're missing the point aren't you? What about all that work on a grind-ladder? Is that a necessary part of T1 NPCs? The bulk of powerplay is the PP system and the gameplay, not the fairly bland figureheads sitting at the top of the powers themselves.


So the devs fulfill the DDF...give us game play reasons for INTERACTION (from the ddf)..and you are not happy with the outcome. Point taken. However, that does not mean they did not follow the DDF...or turned their back on it.

- - - Updated - - -

Indeed, You also missed a couple more:



And after all this, we can sumarize what is missing of the Exploration DDA in a couple bullets:

- Additional objects of interest to discover
- Exploration probes and associated mechanics
- Mis-jump and new system charting mechanics

I know we had a photo contest...wasn't sure who the sponsor was...it would be nice to have monthly or quarterly in house...winner gets x creds type stuff...
 
So the devs fulfill the DDF...give us game play reasons for INTERACTION (from the ddf)..and you are not happy with the outcome. Point taken. However, that does not mean they did not follow the DDF...or turned their back on it.

PP is not a "gameplay reason for interaction" alone though, is it?

Let me get this straight: you believe PP, in its entirety, constitutes a feature from the DDA? Because, if you believe that, then you seem to be in a minority.
 
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So the devs fulfill the DDF...give us game play reasons for INTERACTION (from the ddf)..and you are not happy with the outcome. Point taken. However, that does not mean they did not follow the DDF...or turned their back on it.

- - - Updated - - -



I know we had a photo contest...wasn't sure who the sponsor was...it would be nice to have monthly or quarterly in house...winner gets x creds type stuff...

What are you talking about? Is your agenda to convince people PP was in the DDA or to proclaim how much you like PP?

You're in the wrong thread for that.
 
Indeed, You also missed a couple more:



And after all this, we can sumarize what is left missing of the Exploration DDA in a few bullets:

- Additional points of interest to discover
- Exploration probes and associated mechanics
- Mis-jump and new system charting mechanics
- Player trading info mechanics

I'm not sure what your point is. If you define broad enough categories, you can define any collection of things as part of smaller number of bigger collections.

Eg. All that is missing is: more exploration mechanics.

Also, you started with 2. It's now 4! ;)
 
You are correct. However they need an awful lot of fleshing out. The only ones I'd even noticed the existence of before powerplay was Arissa and Aisling. Once some proper background and fluff is added to them then I'll truly consider them to be fulfilling the role of tier 1 characters.
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How much of the rest of powerplay fits things from the DDA?


There is one word that is very important in that DDF...INTERACT. They always stated there would be some interaction between the players and the NPC's. That is what PP is. As I stated to another person...I take your point you do not approve or like the interaction they provided....however, they promised it AND delivered it.
 
Indeed, You also missed a couple more:



And after all this, we can sumarize what is left missing of the Exploration DDA in a few bullets:

- Additional points of interest to discover
- Exploration probes and associated mechanics
- Mis-jump and new system charting mechanics
- Player trading info mechanics

That's hardly accurate or the point of this thread.
 
Yeah, where did all those ideas go anyway?.... Poof, up in smoke?.... or burried under mounds of uSoft cash?.........

Ironman Elite
During commander creation the player may set the "ironman" flag. Ironman commanders can never be grouped with normal commanders. Players can use the same name for both normal and ironman commanders.

Player to Player Trading
Players can trade directly with each other
 

Viajero

Volunteer Moderator
I'm not sure what your point is. If you define broad enough categories, you can define any collection of things as part of smaller number of bigger collections.

Yes, it is just an example. The goal would be to make the discussion with FDEV more specific and easier to digest. In case they want to discuss the missing DDA content at all, that is.
 
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What are you talking about? Is your agenda to convince people PP was in the DDA or to proclaim how much you like PP?

You're in the wrong thread for that.


You keep asking where PP is in the DDF. I showed you. My overarching point is that the DDF has been followed quite closely and will continue to be followed.
 
Yes, it is just an example. The goal would be to make the discussion with FDEV easier and very specific. In case they want to discuss the missing DDA content at all, that is.

How about we get them to commit to listening and taking action BEFORE we waste time spelling it out for them?

One step at a time no?
 
Yes, it is just an example. The goal would be to make the discussion with FDEV easier and very specific. In case they want to discuss the missing DDA content at all, that is.

I fear the devil is in the detail though. I mean, one assumes that points like "it should take time to scan stuff" is why we have a scanning mechanic which is literally JUST looking at something for a period of time. I've been a software developer for a long time, and a creative professional in a few other mediums (like music and photography), and my professional life has taught me one thing: attention to detail is what separates truly fine craftsmanship from everything else.
 
Yeah, where did all those ideas go anyway?.... Poof, up in smoke?.... or burried under mounds of uSoft cash?.........

Ironman Elite
During commander creation the player may set the "ironman" flag. Ironman commanders can never be grouped with normal commanders. Players can use the same name for both normal and ironman commanders.

Player to Player Trading
Players can trade directly with each other

Ironman..who knows

Player to player trading...already in the game. You drop cargo they pick it up. The hardcore backers in this game did not want, and as far as anyone knows convinced FDev that there should never be, direct trade of credits between players.
 
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Objectively stand back...and read the following. PP introduced almost all of the following in one update.

TIER 1 CHARACTERS
Tier 1 characters are major characters within the game world, for example Planetary Presidents, Major Corporation CEO’s and top ranking crime bosses. Typically the player will interact with tier 2 characters associated with the tier 1 character rather than directly with the tier 1 character.
There is a global list of tier 1 characters.
They are identified by the following characteristics:


  • Players do not interact with these characters directly.
  • The character is common to all online players.
  • The character is created via an in-game invent – typically manually.
  • The character can only be killed by an in-game event.
  • A tier 2 character can be promoted to tier 1, but only by an event.


TIER 1 CHARACTER EXAMPLES

  • Faction leaders
  • Station leaders
  • Regional persons of note
  • Engineering/Scientific specialists (enhanced weapons and modules)
  • Can provide missions, but only on rare occasions, for example:
    • Very high faction rating
    • Very high player rank

Yes, Tier 1 NPCs were introduced by Powerplay. That's the aspect of the update I liked most. But way more interesting than untouchable T1 NPCs and non-persistent cannon fodder T3 NPCs are the T2 NPCs that would give every player his own world of contacts, relations and history:

TIER 2 CHARACTERS
Tier 2 characters are characters that persist for players, but can be interacted with directly. There is a per player list of tier 2 characters and they are identified by the following characteristics:

  • Players can interact with the character directly.
  • Character can be killed by players or by events.
  • Character can be created via an event, by the game or promoted from tier 3.
  • Character can be promoted from tier 2 by being known to a large number of players.
  • Characters can issue missions.



TIER 2 CHARACTER EXAMPLES
  • Faction leader underlings that the player deals directly with
  • Mission targets
  • Mission providers
  • Pilots of NPC vessels that the player has previously interacted with
  • Player contacts

Tier 2 NPCs are where it gets interesting.
 
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