[Proposal] shield generator overhaul Imperial Clipper

[veryinky]

Clipper has too much useless surface area, that's a lot of ship to shield. Form vs Function, for the price of looking pretty the clipper gets weak shields. It's a space yacht built by the least technologically inclined major faction in the game.

On the other hand, there's no logical reason for the Dropship's shields to be that weak, it's an actual military ship and it's shaped like a brick.

 

[Vertexico]

Clipper has too much useless surface area, that's a lot of ship to shield. Form vs Function, for the price of looking pretty the clipper gets weak shields. It's a space yacht built by the least technologically inclined major faction in the game.

On the other hand, there's no logical reason for the Dropship's shields to be that weak, it's an actual military ship and it's shaped like a brick.

+rep

When I realized this I stopped complaining about the Clipper shields. A ship shaped like that, not a compact spacebrick/wedge would be less efficient to shield and makes sense that the modifier is rougher on the Clipper than these other ships. Do wish the logic held true for FDS and others though. xP

 

[Poseidal]

Clipper has too much useless surface area, that's a lot of ship to shield. Form vs Function, for the price of looking pretty the clipper gets weak shields. It's a space yacht built by the least technologically inclined major faction in the game.

On the other hand, there's no logical reason for the Dropship's shields to be that weak, it's an actual military ship and it's shaped like a brick.

The size/surface area is what allows it to turn on a dime.

Also, Empire technology is actually the furthest ahead.

 

[veryinky]

Also, Empire technology is actually the furthest ahead.

What are you basing that on?

 

[Poseidal]

What are you basing that on?

The books and Frontier background.

 

[veryinky]

The books and Frontier background.

I found that they illustrated the exact opposite. The nobles in the empire do live a comfortable life though. Empire also has an excellent spy service which allows them to steal technologies from the Feds.

Still. Artificial Intelligence > Slaves, no matter how many slaves you throw at a problem a computer will do better.

 

[h347h]

Yes you have proven mine point,

You only survive because you use 4 shield boosters, and stacked with A6, 2*A4, 2*A3 SCB.

I myself hate to use them and should not be like that,

CQC then!

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Lore wise its Core Dynamics that's ahead. Imps are slightly behind.

 

[veryinky]

Doesn't mean the Empire's technology isn't ahead. Imperial slavery is a replacement for welfare, not a replacement for automation. The Empire uses AI where it's needed.

Wait, there's an official canon use of AI by the Empire? And the description of an Imperial computer factory I read made it sound like it was something out North Korea. Making stylish boxes but the insides were antiquated technology assembled by hand.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

doesn't the name not already imply that its a fast trading ship ?

 

[veryinky]

Well, the picture of the Empire that is emerging in this game is vastly different than anything I saw in previous games. I guess DB has had a lot longer to think of it by now... Plus those books may have been Federal propaganda. Or that sweat shop may have been producing crap for export or to be used by slaves, not anything regular Imperial citizens would touch; just something to give slaves something to do.

(Confession: I'm forming my impressions based solely on FFE and this game and coming up with my own ideas, I haven't read the books. In fact I didn't know there were any.)

Personally, I saw the Clipper and Courier as confirmation. Pretty but useless neon tubes everywhere to make it look more high tech and a cheap plastic look. And the Imperial News articles from FFE didn't portray the empire as particularly truthful or sane. "Friend to the Aliens", right.

 

[Poseidal]

I found that they illustrated the exact opposite. The nobles in the empire do live a comfortable life though. Empire also has an excellent spy service which allows them to steal technologies from the Feds.

Still. Artificial Intelligence > Slaves, no matter how many slaves you throw at a problem a computer will do better.

The Federation is better at automation due to infrastructure and resources; the Empire's greatest asset is their manpower. They don't get AI, it is banned throughout human space.

Wait, there's an official canon use of AI by the Empire? And the description of an Imperial computer factory I read made it sound like it was something out North Korea. Making stylish boxes but the insides were antiquated technology assembled by hand.

The books state the Federation makes cheap stuff that breaks all the time, while Empire stuff is good but expensive. So it in fact the other way around. [Elite Reclamation]

The Imperial robot which seen by the scavenger was much more advanced for its time than what she thought, and the fact was they are capable but only custom build them for specific missions, preferring to use manpower for ideological reasons; but the technology was there. [Faust]

 

[ROSS-128]

The Dropship has even weaker shields.
And it is less maneuverable.
And it has a top speed of about 200m/s with A grade thrusters and a combat setup.
And it has a top boost of 320m/s with A grade thrusters and a combat setup.
And it has less internals.

The Dropship advantages over a Clipper are : good hard point placement, and size of the internals (2 class 5 slots). That's it.

The Clipper has a LOT of advantages. Speed, cargo, maneuverability considering its size, number of internals to stack SCBs.
The downsides are the shield strenght, and the hardpoint placement.

The dropship has a lot of odd things about it, mostly due to its seemingly arbitrary hull mass value.

It has more mass than an Anaconda, despite having less everything (the Anaconda even has nearly twice as much armor, where is all this mass going?!)

Despite having more mass, it has about half the Anaconda's mass lock value (mass lock has absolutely nothing to do with mass because... reasons).

It is completely incapable of equipping a shield generator that can handle its mass, so it's stuck with a permanent mass penalty to shields.

I think if the Dropship had a slightly lower hull mass (like somewhere in the 300-400 range), a lot of its... "quirks" would be alleviated.

Though also the Anaconda's hull mass is weirdly low for such a large ship (and for having such a high mass lock value).

 

[veryinky]

The books state the Federation makes cheap stuff that breaks all the time, while Empire stuff is good but expensive. So it in fact the other way around. [Elite Reclamation]

Same can be said of modern cars vs Cuban cars. Disposable doesn't mean low tech, look at smart phones. Empire "stuff" has to last for a long time, they have no choice. Infrastructure and economy just isn't there for a more "just in time" manufacturing culture.

The Imperial robot which seen by the scavenger was much more advanced for its time than what she thought, and the fact was they are capable but only custom build them for specific missions, preferring to use manpower for ideological reasons; but the technology was there. [Faust]

It was much more advanced than expected for a piece of Imperial technology, like finding a North Korean made bicycle with a blutetooth module attached, it's surprising. It didn't mean that the Imperials make the best robots. If the Imperium is ahead of the Feds, why do they keep getting caught trying to steal Fed technology?

 

[GJ51]

The Dropship has even weaker shields.
And it is less maneuverable.
And it has a top speed of about 200m/s with A grade thrusters and a combat setup.
And it has a top boost of 320m/s with A grade thrusters and a combat setup.
And it has less internals.

The Dropship advantages over a Clipper are : good hard point placement, and size of the internals (2 class 5 slots). That's it.

The Clipper has a LOT of advantages. Speed, cargo, maneuverability considering its size, number of internals to stack SCBs.
The downsides are the shield strenght, and the hardpoint placement.

Which is why nobody flies them...

 

[Dark Skies]

Re OP

you've got know when to hold em, know when to fold em
know when to walk away, know when to run.

 

[Kastor]

That class 7 internal slot has always been problematic. It's because of it that clippers also outperform the t7 at trading. (despite similar overall cost).

I personally hope they downgrade it to a class 6 slot and change the base shield value up a bit to compensate. AND I FLY A CLIPPER!

But they won't.

 

[veryinky]

Though also the Anaconda's hull mass is weirdly low for such a large ship (and for having such a high mass lock value).

Anaconda and Python are weird simply because they're 600+ year old museum pieces that somehow manage to be objectively better in every way than ships designed and built within the last couple years.

I chalk it up to nostalgia from the devs who wanted to fly one since they were kids. Type-6/7/9, Dropship are new ships, no nostalgia boost.

 

[GJ51]

These arguments always just depend on what you're currently driving.

Get to Elite trader and it just won't matter.

You'll be able to drive what you want equipped anyway you like it.

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Anaconda and Python are weird simply because they're 600+ year old museum pieces that somehow manage to be objectively better in every way than ships designed and built within the last couple years.

I chalk it up to nostalgia from the devs who wanted to fly one since they were kids. Type-6/7/9, Dropship are new ships, no nostalgia boost.

I guess they just don't build 'em like they used to...

 

[ROSS-128]

As far as the tech base discussion, honestly if it was actually canon that all Imperial tech is Simply Better(tm), their quasi-feudal government functioned perfectly without any impediment to development, their practice of slavery was mysteriously free of all the problems that plagued slave economies IRL, and that the Federation was just a backward, corrupt, totalitarian bannana-republic, that would be some SERIOUS basking. >_>

And honestly it would make me go "Well screw the lore I like my version where the Federation are the good guys."

 

[PotatoOverdose]

The clipper is fine as is.