Requesting feedback regarding 'part time' players
- Thread starter hunterm101
- Start date
You have bought an online multiplayer game. Just accept that you bought the wrong game for you, and move on
Edit: Wait for the next Beta release. Sign up as a tester, fly whatever you want for the duration of the Beta. Best option you have!
This. I tried the Cutter in Beta and that is how I decided I wanted the Corvette first. Beta access is a great way to try/fly any ship you want without having to break your bank to do it. Beta credits stay in Beta and do not affect your "real" credit balance. Also, ships, modules, etc. are sold at only 10% of their in-game value and you get to fly them against other CMDRs who are doing the same thing. Even if you get blown up a dozen times in Beta you win because what happens in Beta, stays in Beta and does not affect your "real" score or credit balance. o7
The very same applies to you. You are the one trying to change the game, not him. Not everyone wants a game with a completely lunatic economy where you play for 15 minutes and buy the most expensive ship.
Ultimately, it's FD's decision and they have decided.
No forcing going on here. But you really are being a hypocrite. You were using a terrible analogy and argument using han solo, and then mentioned something about pretending in a cardboard box. My cheeky suggestion was perhaps you should stay imagining in that cardboard box - because really, Han solo and that analogy don't belong to Elite. Ironically, I haven't told anyone how they should play- just laughed at this argument.
You then told me to stop telling people what to do. Do you not see the hypocrisy in that statement?
The only ones who are leading anyone down any route are the game designers. I'm actually up for better payouts if I'm honest. They are getting better with each patch, albeit slowly. Gold rushes happen but they are just gold rushes. They run out.
Btw... here's some more hypocrisy from yourself:
unity100 said:
I feel Vasco Sapien's argument had a fair point. A sandbox does not make a good film. Simply saying irrelevant shows that you are unable to perceive the argument - since there is massive relevance here. You have effectively dismissed the argument because you don't actually understand it. Unless this is a tactic used against an argument that you understand, see the relevance of but can't actually admit so.
Also a film is a recording with limited interaction. You have no choice in what happens whatsoever. Nor the same level of immersion that a game can achieve. I agree that they are not the same.
I'm much in the same situation as op.
Working as an airline pilot I'm away a lot, so playing is limited to when I'm home after kids are in bed.
I bought Elite beta and started to play in summer 2014.
The progress was reasonable in the early stages but for the last year I've been stuck at the Python level.
I have tried to enjoy it and haven't been doing too much grinding. Made it a-rated and upgraded with most engineers.
But from here it seems to take unreasonably too much time to advance to bigger ships, without putting in weeks of grinding only!
And with limited time to play, I don't know if it's worth it.
I have, of course missed all Quince, Rhea and other shortcuts that's been available.
How is that even possible?
If I fit my Python with 280 cargo slots and find a good loop route from eddb.io, I can maybe make 1.4 mcr per roundtrip. Four round trips in an hour gives me 5 millions.
So in order to get 150 million, I would need to grind for 30 hours. Playing a couple of hours a couple of evenings per week, would take me months to get there.
Months of doing boring grinding, instead of enjoying the game, doing different missions, joining with factions, bounty hunting etc.
I have chosen the latter, which is probably one reason that I haven't advanced further. It's a shame Elite isn't rewarding that kind of play enough.
How is that even possible?
Any hints would be appreciated.
Then you have found something I haven't even been close to.
I have never managed more than 5-6 m per hour from trading. On rare occasions I have been close to that with bounty hunting.
According to the right side menu I have a total play time of 6 weeks. That's about 1000 hours. Some of that is beta testing of course. Trade rank is Entrepreneur and combat rank is Dangerous.
Don't you think almost 3 years and 1000 hours of varied playing (not grinding) should be sufficient for more than a Python?
I've been playing just a little over a year now, have acquired every ship, including the Cutter and the Corvette.
I've not used "exploits", or even cheesy get-rich-quick schemes (Quince/Rhea/Sothis/Ceos/Robigo), massacre mission stacks, skimmers, or even mode-switching.
I started my career, like everyone else*, in a Sidewinder with 1000 credits to my name.
I tried a few missions at first, but found out quickly that NPC's were unforgiving, and fuel was a valuable commodity, so I shifted my focus from mission-running to something else:
Scavenging.
Planet surfaces are littered with lost cargo, caches of goodies, wrecked ships and automated mining facilities.
And I found out quickly too that certain cargo items (Platinum, Jateite, Moissanite and Taaffeite) were not only extremely valuable, but reasonably easy to find.
With my massive 2 tons of cargo space, it didn't take too many full loads of Taaffeite to rack up enough credits for a major upgrade - an Adder with 12 tons of cargo space.
Now I didn't have to be quite so selective, and I could load up on goodies like these found laying around on planets. A couple of trips, at an average of 200,000 cr credits, and I was looking at my next upgrade, an 80 ton hauling Keelback. Now we're talking. Now I could actually start taking on some missions, and I did - quite a few of them, but it wasn't enough, and I discovered Rare Goods - Eranin Pearl Whiskey was the first I found, and though the quantity was limited (8), it didn't take me long to realize the further I hauled these the more they were worth - and before long, I'd established a nice little trading loop of my own - hauling Eranin Pearl Whiskey out to Witchhaul to trade for Kobe Beef, I was was turning quite a good bit of credits, all the way up to... the first time I decided to try my hand at a Community Goal. It just happened to be Moira.
The Moria CG had a glitch, and in the end, paid out far more than it should have. But I put in the work with my trusty Keelback, and had worked myself all the way up to 22 million credits by this time. I kept eyeballing a Type-7, thinking I could afford it, use it for the CG, sell it after, make back my credits along with the CG payout - I'd worked myself into the Top 50% and the payout was more than the depreciation of the Type-7, so I'd come out ahead... and then it was over, and the payout was skewed, and I wound up making a couple hundred million credits instead. I bought myself a couple of ships - a Fer de Lance and an Orca.
At the time, we didn't have passenger missions, so the Orca didn't have any special purpose, but I loved the look of it, and I found it to make a more than suitable short-to-mid range hauler, weighing in at 138 tons of cargo, and I started expanding my search for rare goods, finding more of them, and longer distances, and I kept making pretty good money with it. My Type-7 hauled more, but it wasn't as much fun to fly and always seemed to attract NPC's - my Orca not so much.
So I kept flying around in circles, buying and selling Rare Goods, and turning up at CG's, though none have paid out like Moira. They still paid out though, and I always made money on them. I also started experimenting with more combat-related stuff, and found the Fer de Lance more that suited for combat missions, and I'd take those when the payouts looked good and I was weary of hauling freight. After a time and growing my credit balance, I picked up a mining ship - a Federal Dropship and gave a go at mining for a while. It wasn't bad, and I made pretty good credits with a bit less risk than hauling rare goods around. Then Passenger missions happened, as did an upgrade to the Fuel Tank of the Orca, and I switched gears, hauling passengers - making credits and rank, and was able to keep some cargo space for some rare goods as well, and things were good.
And then, some time later, Ram Tah introduced us to the Guardian Ruins - and the payout then, 201 million was far too tempting, so I started making the effort, and despite being bugged as can be, I was able to complete this twice, though it was a terrible pain to complete, but it did net me enough to buy an Anaconda and Outfit it, and it quickly became my choice ship for bounty hunting, which was now a pretty profitable venture for me.
Now fast-forward to today - I bank a little over a billion credits, have another 3.5 or so billion in assets (at least one of every ship, two or three of some), and am largely "free" from the sense of "need" to do any specific thing and able to simply do whatever entertains me, which at the moment, is a mid-range trip (around 6500 Ly) out of the bubble.
*Except for those who paid a whole lot more, a whole lot sooner than I and got to start with an Eagle instead.
The thing is that in this game the ships ARE the tools, and you need to use the right tool for the right job. You don't need a $5000 pneumatic nail gun if your just learning carpentry, and you want to build a small bird house. All you need is a $5 hammer. The $5000 nail gun is for professionals who who build houses for a living. Using said $5000 nail gun is not only a waste of money for the beginnner, but also a great way to destroy the birdhouse you're trying to build.
Or drive a nail into your leg, due to inexperience!
We have a LOT of players who seem to think that getting a big ship will make their game better. It won't. Its not how big your ship is, but whether your ship suits the job you're using it for, whether you have the skills to support that ship, and whether you enjoy flying it, that matters. It also helps if you enjoy that activity in the first place. If you don't like mining, for example, then spending a quarter of a billion on a mining Anaconda won't make that activity any more enjoyable than in a two million Type-6.
I absolutely agree that if someone wants to paint, then don't make the grind for 18 months for a paint brush. But there is a world of difference between a $1 paint brush you can pick up at your local discount store, and spending $5000 on compressors, airbrushes, and paints on something you may only be able to do once a week.
I am a casual player too. But I was fortunate to get in early. New and casual players today have it far harder than we early adopters.
If you are casual player you are a second class citizen in Elite. It wasn’t always this way, but it has become this over the last season.
The reason is that Frontier has steadily erected time, credit, and reputation gates for new and casual players. They've done this through a series of nerfs to credit and progression streams, and by relying on time-consuming rng for game design. This makes it very difficult for new pilots to move beyond second tiers ships unless they are hardcore. And it makes it nearly impossible for casual players to do so.
This is exacerbated by Frontier’s failure to date to achieve Braben’s original vision — a virtual world in space (a cosmos) that combines elements of a simulation and game. What we have so far is a space-shooter with excellent flight and combat, a beautiful simulation of the galaxy, and not much else. Exploring, mining, smuggling, trading, managing the BGS, etc. are all underdeveloped. And because of both the RNG focus of engineers, combat tuning one’s ship for Open is a huge time-sink.
The key to making Elite work with this admittedly difficult context is to develop a strategy for wealth and stability while waiting for Frontier to fix its bad design decisions as well as build out the other elements of the cosmos.
First, make do with best second tier ships you can. For example, the AspX (for transport and exploration), a Python (for trading and mining), and an FDL (for combat). Thereafter, systematically engineer each ship. This does not mean one will never get into a third tier ship, but it takes a long time and close to a billion to outfit and insure one properly.
Second, focus doggedly on reputation and credit gains. This requires keeping an ear to the ground for the best reputation and credit making opportunities. Take full advantage of them before they are nerfed into the ground. These are the only opportunities to bypass Frontier’s gating if you are not hardcore.
Do note that Frontier’s gating may be the precursor to RMT in game. If you have money to burn, this may be a another way to bypass the gates. Many are highly critical of my saying this, but the pattern of Frontier’s design decisions, and the investment of grinding house Tencent, might support this interpretation of Frontier’s decisions about design.
Third, be as efficient as you can. For instance, use tools like EDDB to find optimized trading routes. Or build reputation in a specific bubble. Ignore those who say mode switching is an exploit. It is not, being a design decision by Frontier. Use it to boost your efficiency.
Finally, never fly without the best shields you can buy/engineer, and never play in Open. You risk far too much of your time and effort if you lose a ship to griefers. Join Mobius and/or another private group if you want company.
Good speed Cmdrs.
If you are casual player you are a second class citizen in Elite. It wasn’t always this way, but it has become this over the last season.
The reason is that Frontier has steadily erected time, credit, and reputation gates for new and casual players. They've done this through a series of nerfs to credit and progression streams, and by relying on time-consuming rng for game design. This makes it very difficult for new pilots to move beyond second tiers ships unless they are hardcore. And it makes it nearly impossible for casual players to do so.
This is exacerbated by Frontier’s failure to date to achieve Braben’s original vision — a virtual world in space (a cosmos) that combines elements of a simulation and game. What we have so far is a space-shooter with excellent flight and combat, a beautiful simulation of the galaxy, and not much else. Exploring, mining, smuggling, trading, managing the BGS, etc. are all underdeveloped. And because of both the RNG focus of engineers, combat tuning one’s ship for Open is a huge time-sink.
The key to making Elite work with this admittedly difficult context is to develop a strategy for wealth and stability while waiting for Frontier to fix its bad design decisions as well as build out the other elements of the cosmos.
First, make do with best second tier ships you can. For example, the AspX (for transport and exploration), a Python (for trading and mining), and an FDL (for combat). Thereafter, systematically engineer each ship. This does not mean one will never get into a third tier ship, but it takes a long time and close to a billion to outfit and insure one properly.
Second, focus doggedly on reputation and credit gains. This requires keeping an ear to the ground for the best reputation and credit making opportunities. Take full advantage of them before they are nerfed into the ground. These are the only opportunities to bypass Frontier’s gating if you are not hardcore.
Do note that Frontier’s gating may be the precursor to RMT in game. If you have money to burn, this may be a another way to bypass the gates. Many are highly critical of my saying this, but the pattern of Frontier’s design decisions, and the investment of grinding house Tencent, might support this interpretation of Frontier’s decisions about design.
Third, be as efficient as you can. For instance, use tools like EDDB to find optimized trading routes. Or build reputation in a specific bubble. Ignore those who say mode switching is an exploit. It is not, being a design decision by Frontier. Use it to boost your efficiency.
Finally, never fly without the best shields you can buy/engineer, and never play in Open. You risk far too much of your time and effort if you lose a ship to griefers. Join Mobius and/or another private group if you want company.
Good speed Cmdrs.
Completely false. If you want to pretend to be an early adopter, at least do some research first.
When the game launched, you would be very lucky to see a 40k mission. Now boards are filled with multi-million credit missions. The game has been made easier and easier for beginners with each new update.
Last edited:
There is no difference in trying to preserve a status quo or trying to change it. Both are defending their own perspective.
As seen from the numbers which used this 'exploit', the reaction in online forums, communities around internet, especially like reddit, you are bluntly wrong.
Dont project your own personal preference to the game developer and talk on their behalf.
..........
In the end its your preference, youre just trying to enforce YOUR gameplay ON EVERYONE by preserving status quo to enable YOUR preference.
The other people arent trying to enforce anything on you for their own benefit. You can set your own goals and work towards them and get the grind-achievement format even if other people are able to make money faster.
As such, what you are doing is a self-centered act, which is restricting other people's gameplay in true sense of the word. not metaphorically or emotionally.
There, just a little fixing, and the whole of the issue comes into focus.
Huh? What are you talking about? When I started 2.5 years ago it was uncommon to be in a Cobra in the first month, now, people are making pythons and Anacondas in the first month without exploits!
This^^^ I can go into almost any system and within a week get million credit missions... No problem. Mission payouts were very low when I started and it was agonizing to upgrade or buy a new ship. Friend of mine started in a sidey and within 3 weeks he was in a Ferdie!
Last edited:
Dude, i'm over 2000 hours in, and i still can't afford a cutter, nor have the rank for one.
I think you need to take baby steps, and not look so far ahead. It may be that even after 10 years of play you might never progress to a Cutter. I might not either, and i try and play every day if i can.
I think you need to take baby steps, and not look so far ahead. It may be that even after 10 years of play you might never progress to a Cutter. I might not either, and i try and play every day if i can.
Well, except those who exploited early rares trading, or seeking luxuries, or whatever it was that came after those.... then we had Robigo, then Sothis and Ceos, etc etc....
OP, it seems you want a pay to win game and there are plenty of them out there. I'm glad this is not one of them!
It is as easy as it has ever been, too easy now in fact, to get one of the big three ships.
If this seems like an unsympathetic answer, here's another suggestion. Yesterday I learned from youtube videos and this forum that people were making 120 million CR an hour on the latest Frontier money making bug. At that rate, just wait for the next money making bug and you'll have money for an Anaconda in two hours of play.
Even with current regular money making techniques it will only take you about 20 hours of play to get an Anaconda. It used to take many months to get it when I first got mine.
It is as easy as it has ever been, too easy now in fact, to get one of the big three ships.
If this seems like an unsympathetic answer, here's another suggestion. Yesterday I learned from youtube videos and this forum that people were making 120 million CR an hour on the latest Frontier money making bug. At that rate, just wait for the next money making bug and you'll have money for an Anaconda in two hours of play.
Even with current regular money making techniques it will only take you about 20 hours of play to get an Anaconda. It used to take many months to get it when I first got mine.
Last edited:
OP, I have to agree with you to a point. I started playing this game in Oct. 2014, and I still don't have any of the "Big 3" ships. I came into this game wanting to eventually have an "Annie" that I could enjoy in VR because I wanted the immersion of sitting on the bridge of a ship (not a cockpit, a Bridge). However, I can't possibly put the time I need into the game that most others can, and there are certain activities in this game that I refuse to engage in because they are not fun. FDev are not going to give you an answer to your question because they already have. This is their game, and they have set the rules for it. If you are determined to reach your goal without spending time that others clearly have, then you will have to use some of the means that many others have described on these and other forums. ( Delilah above had some good points ). Try and find some things you like in this game and do them. Do not waste time on activities you hate. Keep your eyes peeled for situations where large amounts of credits can be made. You don't have to cheat or use exploits. Just use the small amount of time that you do have to hit the activities you like. Be as efficient as you can. It WILL unfortunately take time. FDev and many players seem to have forgotten that this is just a game. But that is what it is. Have as much fun as you can playing it. If you can stick it out, you will reach your goal.
I don't think he exploited per say... He just did combat and only combat.
Unlocking rank locked ships requires the same amount of effort from anyone trying to unlock them.
Be it if they get 100 hours a week, or just 2.
Yes, it will take the casual player longer in real life, but the actual time spent in game on the task will be similar to everyone else.
Its actually very well balanced.
Of course, there are some places that allow ranking quicker than others, usually in incredibly dull ways. But it's your choice to do these, or rank up a more fun way.
CMDR Cosmic Spacehead
Be it if they get 100 hours a week, or just 2.
Yes, it will take the casual player longer in real life, but the actual time spent in game on the task will be similar to everyone else.
Its actually very well balanced.
Of course, there are some places that allow ranking quicker than others, usually in incredibly dull ways. But it's your choice to do these, or rank up a more fun way.
CMDR Cosmic Spacehead
Not Irrelevant, Its actually the crux of the issue and you are either unwilling or unable to understand that. So you bail out with a conceited comment all the while enjoying your own flatulence as you go. Just follow the cloud of musty coloured smoke in a crowded room to spot you.