Rev-Enging Mission Boards

Jmanis

Jmanis
goemon said:
doesn't fit what i am seeing:

" Mission Mining Boom from [Faction], Reward:1.668.651 cr, System:[System], Station: [Station]
Commodity:Water"

"Mission Mining Boom from [faction], Reward:9.992.171 cr, System:[system], Station: [station]
Commodity:Bertrandite"

etc.
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Quick question: Were both those missions Wing missions?

I forgot to mention, but Wing missions seem to play by different rules (they don't usually respect state for flavour either, generally)

Also, long time no see @goemon !

EDIT: Yeah, I suspect those might both be Wing missions.
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goemon

goemon
Mining Rush for 300 Units of Water from Defence Force of Baga, System:Baga, Station:Stephenson Port, Expiry:05.06.3306 23:10, Influence:++, Reputation:++, Reward:318.880 cr, (Wing)
Deliver:Water

... it's somehow hard to track down, because mission accepted does not include "boom" for any missions, while mission completed does (at least in my edd exports). looks as if any Mining Boom mission is called Mining Rush for....

this only extends to mining missions - "Boom time delivery" will called by that at the mission accepted event. but from what i can get by comparing rewards is that you might be right, and i only find wing missions that include "boom" and are for non-mining-only commodities.

i will watch it more closely if we ever have to work that system again which gave out almost exclusivly mining missions.

it's really funny if you are sitting at a source of water like in the exampel above, and pick up water mining missions ...
Mine 36 Units of Water from Baga Energy Partners, System:Baga, Station:Stephenson Port, Expiry:05.06.3306 23:10, Influence:++, Reputation:++, Reward:526.928 cr
Deliver:Water
 

Bottom Hat

Bottom Hat
Jmanis said:
Just while you're perusing this while I do some more research for another post, 10/10 for whoever made the fix a while back to Hijack missions (e.g Recover 8 Hostages/Diplo Bags/Political Prisoners/Precious Gems) to make them dump the mission cargo first. Especially when the target is a DBX or similar, and tries to recover the dropped cargo at the same time, while combatting their PD turrets, and potentially tanking escorts (or killing them, which makes the hauler go red-ten)... and heaven forbid a tail from another mission drops in....

I used to ignore these missions because they were too fiddly working through all the other junk... now they're super-fun and I grab them where I can! Just dusted off seven of them tonight.
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Sorry for the slight off topic reply to this interesting thread @Jmanis , but am I right in presuming that this mechanism is still working mate?

Like you mentioned, I have been ignoring these missions for ages, as having to wade through all the guff that comes out of the target before the dip bags, prisoners etc, was just a huge pita and time sink, so making them less than viable when trying to push bgs.

So, if they have been fixed now, that is really interesting news, and I should apologise if this is already widely known?!

Thanks for your time and help pal, much appreciated.
The Hat :)
 

Jmanis

Jmanis
Bottom Hat said:
Sorry for the slight off topic reply to this interesting thread @Jmanis , but am I right in presuming that this mechanism is still working mate?

Like you mentioned, I have been ignoring these missions for ages, as having to wade through all the guff that comes out of the target before the dip bags, prisoners etc, was just a huge pita and time sink, so making them less than viable when trying to push bgs.

So, if they have been fixed now, that is really interesting news, and I should apologise if this is already widely known?!

Thanks for your time and help pal, much appreciated.
The Hat :)
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Yup, still works this way, though i haven't done one since FCs went live.
 

goemon

goemon
do you have any insights to share how target faction is chosen, if not down to targeted asset?

target or "destination". i can't get my head around how the game decides who gets that inf from a "deliver 45t of cobalt" mission.
 

Jmanis

Jmanis
goemon said:
do you have any insights to share how target faction is chosen, if not down to targeted asset?

target or "destination". i can't get my head around how the game decides who gets that inf from a "deliver 45t of cobalt" mission.
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I think for the most part, it's a random faction. I've tried to collate information on this, but it's as random as destination system/commodity[1]

There is logic, for instance, if you go to an Agricultural economy, and a nearby faction is in Famine, most factions will offer "Deliver Food" missions to that faction, though the prevalence of those missions is somewhat random still. Likewise, "Assassinate Known Pirate" missions always target Anarchy Factions... so I think there's a logic to how factions are chosen, but not which faction is chosen. i.e A set of rules governs which types of factions are eligible to be the target of a mission (e.g "Anarchy Factions, within 10Ly"), but then it's just random choice[1] after that.

[1] With my usual caveat that "Random" for the purposes of mission board generation usually results in blobby/repetative behaviour, e.g generating lots of the same mission type compared to the available pool, or targetting the same faction.
 

Jmanis

Jmanis
So, I often talk about the mission boards being "blobby" and homogenous in a single generation, with no apparent logic behind how missions are generated when like is compared with like.

As a case example, just down in Onoros at the moment, where there's three imperial dictatorships, all in a "None" state.

The boards I've been presented in this generation are:
ID 1: 10 x Donate Credits, 3 x Donate Goods
ID 2: 2 x Donate Goods
ID 3: 5 x Covert Data Retrieval, 5 x Illegal Black Box recoveries, 3 x Donate Goods.

As a secondary contrast, two alliance corporates also in a None state have:
AC1: 5 x Donate Cargo, 3 x Spec Ops (civilian massacre)
AC2: 5 x Spec Ops (civilian Massacre), 4 x Mining missions.

Next rotation, same numbers for same factions, I got
ID 1: 6 x Donate Credits, 3 x Donate Goods
ID 2: 5 x Spec Ops, 2 x Donate Goods
ID 3: 8 x Covert Data Retrieval, 5 x Illegal Black Box recoveries

And for the alliance:
AC1: 4 x Spec Ops, 2 x Donate Cargo
AC2: 5 x Spec Ops

Incidentally I also tried flushing out ID 3, and cleared and the next board generation they got no new missions. I then cleared ID1 of it's donate credit missions... then board generation 4 was quite interesting.

AC1: 3 x Planetary Scan
AC2: No Missions
ID1: 4 x Donate Credits, 4 x Donate Goods
ID2: 4 x Illegal Black Box Recoveries, 2 x Spec Ops, 5 x Donate Goods
ID3: 2 x Planetary Scan Jobs

ID boards seem to be carrying on, but the AC boards have pretty much done a full reset.

Oh, and AC3 (the controlling faction in Investment) has consistently had a mix of Mining, Financial Data Acquisition and Donate Goods.

If there's a logic, I can't see it.
 

Ian Doncaster

Ian Doncaster
Some interesting data points on mission generation and pricing from the recent major swings in galactic average prices.
  1. The mission servers know about the new average prices, including in terms of swapping credits for commodities in the reward stage. They lagged behind the market servers, a bit, which might be marginally useful for arbitrage next time.
  2. This seems to have caused Gold/Palladium/Silver missions to completely dry up (or at least become as rare as the Tritium equivalent) at Extraction/Refinery economies, and similarly for the source cargo equivalents at the other end. This implies that there's perhaps a bias towards lower-GA cargoes for these missions in the generation, which is why the Tritium ones have always been so rare. (Which I think is good - you can get lucky with the missions now and then but can't just sit there spamming them for ridiculous money)
  3. Mining mission pay doesn't work well with the new average prices, though. I've got a mission here to mine 36 units of Osmium for 6.1 million credits. That's about 170k/tonne ... the local commodity market is buying it for 184k/tonne just with a basic Boom state and it seems to go up to 250k/tonne even just with fairly common state combinations. This is probably because Osmium's GA price is still only 45180 - far lower than it actually sells for.
  4. Wing mining missions are even worse - there's one here for 656 units of Bertrandite (high market value about 14 million credits) that actually pays 7.6 million. So not only would it be a terribly unprofitable use of Bertrandite solo, it'd even be only very marginally better than just selling it for a wing of two. Strangely, a Praseodymium wing mission for 192 units also pays about 7.5 million despite the volume being much smaller and the Pras GA being about half that of the Bert. (And Bertrandite's GA is reasonable for what it trades for, too - maybe the issue is just that the pricing algorithm for wing mining missions is wrong?)
 
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Jmanis

Jmanis
Factabulous said:
Hmm, interesting - I'll check some of my usual Trit mission farms later. They tend to have a lot of Palladium, or used to ...
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Ian Doncaster said:
  1. This seems to have caused Gold/Palladium/Silver missions to completely dry up (or at least become as rare as the Tritium equivalent) at Extraction/Refinery economies, and similarly for the source cargo equivalents at the other end. This implies that there's perhaps a bias towards lower-GA cargoes for these missions in the generation, which is why the Tritium ones have always been so rare. (Which I think is good - you can get lucky with the missions now and then but can't just sit there spamming them for ridiculous money)
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1606250707105.png


Seems the same as it was last night for me. 2 of 5 eligible delivery missions spawned like this... 5 of 8 if you count chain missions.

(that's from a single faction... all the others I'm unfriendly to, which isn't helpful)
 

Ian Doncaster

Ian Doncaster
Jmanis said:
View attachment 196759

Seems the same as it was last night for me. 2 of 5 eligible delivery missions spawned like this... 5 of 8 if you count chain missions.

(that's from a single faction... all the others I'm unfriendly to, which isn't helpful)
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That's weird - I haven't seen a single one today, including in systems which used to have plenty.

Do you have one with a Silver/Gold commodity reward on the board? If so, what exchange rate is it using?
 

Jmanis

Jmanis
Very interesting.
Ian Doncaster said:
That's weird - I haven't seen a single one today, including in systems which used to have plenty.

Do you have one with a Silver/Gold commodity reward on the board? If so, what exchange rate is it using?
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1606252563729.png


... though explainable. The mission server is clearly generating the missions & reward combinations, but the reward must be calculated server-side, because that's definitely used the old value for Gold, as the current value of 30 units of gold is =~ 1.4m credits, but only ~300k has been deducted.
 

Factabulous

Factabulous
Checked my favourite system - far less Palladium than usual - only one mission where I would expect a lot. Then again it has some horrible confounding BGS states - ones that generate missions - so it could well be that. I wouldn't base anything on my data.

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Tritium Missions have gone too (well, there was one, but no wing missions where there would normally be multiple). There were more missions to steal tritium than to supply legal cargo :(
 

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Jmanis

Jmanis
Factabulous said:
Checked my favourite system - far less Palladium than usual - only one mission where I would expect a lot. Then again it has some horrible confounding BGS states - ones that generate missions - so it could well be that. I wouldn't base anything on my data.

View attachment 196767

View attachment 196768

Tritium Missions have gone too (well, there was one, but no wing missions where there would normally be multiple). There were more missions to steal tritium than to supply legal cargo :(
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I got a source trit (45t) for 17m... literally first one i took when i logged on.
 

Ian Doncaster

Ian Doncaster
Jmanis said:
... though explainable. The mission server is clearly generating the missions & reward combinations, but the reward must be calculated server-side, because that's definitely used the old value for Gold, as the current value of 30 units of gold is =~ 1.4m credits, but only ~300k has been deducted.
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Very interesting indeed ... well, there's a "get paid twice" opportunity, at least until they notice and give the mission server the new prices.

That might explain why the mining pay was so bad, too, if it hasn't caught up yet.
 

Jmanis

Jmanis
Ian Doncaster said:
Very interesting indeed ... well, there's a "get paid twice" opportunity, at least until they notice and give the mission server the new prices.

That might explain why the mining pay was so bad, too, if it hasn't caught up yet.
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I totally left a bit off that post XD

What I meant to say was the mission server probably generates the rewards, but hasn't been updated with the new prices. Meanwhile, the "Avg Value" we see for goods as mission rewards is probably fetched by the client.
 
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