Modes Reworking the game modes

[Haggbad Celine]

It does, to an extent, in my opinion - as the game design is quite clearly advertised and every player has the opportunity to familiarise themselves with the game features before making the purchase.

If players are seeking a game with only one mode then this is not that game and has, rather clearly, never been that game.

I think this needs to be differentiated, as I would assume not a lot of player that get griefed quit the game.
The one that joins Mobius was never into any PvP in the first place and therefore doesn't need to quit.
The one that quits the game gets dissapointed because he was looking for excitement in a contained area, that idea would promote your suggestion of a 'mini-bubble'.

The later one is similar to the one who quits because they have an easy option.

You know, if I had the option to lock my account to open only, while having significant reduced rebuys, I most certainly would do so.

People leave games for many reasons,

While none of my ships can carry 800T of expensive goods, I have flown my Python fully maxed out for cargo in open, so trading in open isnt that bad, of course I dont mind being blown up. I actually fly in solo/pg with guns and shields more than in open. In open there really is no point since most of the people who would pull you over are going to be over engineered and destroy you anyway. Insurance is less without the shields and guns.

The lazy comment at the end is probably just to get a rise out of people but I find it much less lazy in pg/solo since in open its just submit and walk away most of the time. But to each their own

True, people leave for lots of reasons, it wasn't the core of my point.
I was just arguing towards quitting because of having an easy option being equally valid as quitting because of getting griefed.

There is git gud guide to trading in open.
Showcasing an unengineered T-7 escaping an fully engineered gank FDL without any problems.
Trying to win that fight is pointless, but having defense mechanisms allow you to escape.

It's lazy because if you want to be greedy (like fly without shields and max cargo) you need to put in extra effort to compensate and this extra effort is redundant by going pg/solo.

 

[Jockey79]

I think this needs to be differentiated, as I would assume not a lot of player that get griefed quit the game.

Nope, some swap to Solo. Some swap to a Private Group.

The one that joins Mobius was never into any PvP in the first place and therefore doesn't need to quit.

Actually, PvP'ers / Griefers spent the first year of the game telling people to get out of Open and join Mobius if they didn't want those types of interactions.
So PvP'ers pushed more people to Mobius than anyone else did or ever will.

I was just arguing towards quitting because of having an easy option being equally valid as quitting because of getting griefed.

No such thing as an easy option.

There is git gud guide to trading in open.

Why am I not shocked your a follower of SDC.

 

[Haggbad Celine]

Yo Jockey, what about reading and understanding what I write?
You are completly missing the point here.

SDC's statement is valid for reasons, their methods aren't.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

W... what? Then all the discussion here... 8-|

That doesnt mean jack, I used to be in a PF working actively in the BGS. Just because I think this feature is a sad joke does not mean I dont understand its mechanics.

 

[Jockey79]

Yo Jockey, what about reading and understanding what I write?
You are completly missing the point here.

SDC's statement is valid for reasons, their methods aren't.

You're the one ignoring what is written.

Valid - buying a PvP game and complaining about PvP problems
Not Valid - buying a PvE game and making up PvP problems

And while some things SDC do are helpful hints; most of the time - it's a cover to force Open Mode PvP on people who don't want it.
Rinzler didn't make that video to be nice, he thinks he is mocking people who trade in Solo / PGs.
That's why they are named in the typical mocking fashion of "Git Gud" that we endure from typical griefers.

 

[ALGOMATIC]

You're the one ignoring what is written.

Valid - buying a PvP game and complaining about PvP problems
Not Valid - buying a PvE game and making up PvP problems

And while some things SDC do are helpful hints; most of the time - it's a cover to force Open Mode PvP on people who don't want it.
Rinzler didn't make that video to be nice, he thinks he is mocking people who trade in Solo / PGs.
That's why they are named in the typical mocking fashion of "Git Gud" that we endure from typical griefers.

No such thing as griefers in a game that allows for open pvp even inside a station.

Itd both PvP and PVE game, the game stats are balanced around PvP that's why we dont have magic OP weaponry.

C & P was developed due to PvP (more like cries from the PVE crowd but its related to PvP).

Engineers were changed to pull more people to PvP.

The game is unfinished in any area not just PvP. The whole mode system only works because both BGS and PP are not as popular so the salt is not heard on the forums about those areas, although arguably PP has many issues with regarding to undermining in SOLO.

Any meaningfull interactive multiplayer content that involves objective control will never be developed while the modes are the way they are. This involves both PVE and PvP content.
BGS at the moment has no meaning since there is nothing really to control other than a system which is 1 of many. There is nothing unique in this or another terretory at the moment so the whole concept of controlling a faction while can be easily abused via solo does not really give any point of having a conflict. This is one of the reasons we dont see the forums overflowing with salt of people's factions being "griefed" in solo. People just dont bother because the only reason to undermine one another is for salt and this can be much easier archieved by killing a rat or sidewinder noob.

 

[Darkfyre99]

Trading in solo/pg only, cus you can carry more cargo while having less risk of being caught with your pants down, so to say.
You wouldn't want to carry 800 tons of very expensive cargo without any defensive mechanisms in open.
Having an easy option to increase your reward while reducing your risk can feel like cheating yourself as you are missing potentially interesting engagements.

Ah, the "I can't trust myself to obey by my own rules, therefore everybody needs to be forced to follow them" school of thought.

 

[AbsinthSvK]

If someone buys a Ford Ka and starts screaming they expected a Audi TT - you'd not give them the time of day.

The mode system was advertised long before the game was ever sold, this information was free available then and still is now.
So the argument that you want an open only PvP game because you prefer it is completely irrelevant to what you bought.

Next time you want an Audi, go buy an Audi.

you again completely misunderstand whole topic and again compare software with hardware. Start compare T9 ship for example before and after update, its different and with your logic you should ask for refund again. Silly...

As advertising modes are SOLO/GROUP/OPEN, PvP players have same right to wrote same text as you wrote but with switched modes. Open is part of the game as SOLO/group. And you completely ignore that.

 

[Haggbad Celine]

You're the one ignoring what is written.

Valid - buying a PvP game and complaining about PvP problems
Not Valid - buying a PvE game and making up PvP problems

And while some things SDC do are helpful hints; most of the time - it's a cover to force Open Mode PvP on people who don't want it.
Rinzler didn't make that video to be nice, he thinks he is mocking people who trade in Solo / PGs.
That's why they are named in the typical mocking fashion of "Git Gud" that we endure from typical griefers.

Sorry if I am being disrespectful, but it's pretty hard to argue reasonably with someone who replies with a 'no you' style of argumentation to being hinted that they disagree with a statement they repeated in the same manner and therefore didn't get the point.

As for why Rinzler did make this video I can't tell and neither can't you as he didn't mention the intention of his video.
Fact is all of his guides start with 'the git gud guide to ...', so I wouldn't consider that mocking.

Fun fact: Git Gud is used not to mock players but to tell them not to victimize themselves, but you know get good.

 

[Haggbad Celine]

Ah, the "I can't trust myself to obey by my own rules, therefore everybody needs to be forced to follow them" school of thought.

Yes.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Yes.

No-one is in a position to decide how others should play this game.

 

[Robert Maynard]

I think this needs to be differentiated, as I would assume not a lot of player that get griefed quit the game.
The one that joins Mobius was never into any PvP in the first place and therefore doesn't need to quit.
The one that quits the game gets dissapointed because he was looking for excitement in a contained area, that idea would promote your suggestion of a 'mini-bubble'.

We don't know how many players consider that they have ever been griefed in this game, in fact, some contend that griefing is impossible in this game - opinions vary on that though.

As you state, players who don't like the unrestricted direct PvP of Open can choose to join a Private Group that better suits their play-style - which is why Frontier included Private Groups in the game design from the outset. Similarly, they can choose to play in Solo and never meet another player.

Players that bought the game looking to play in a contained area bought the wrong game - the galaxy was always going to be as big as it is.

The later one is similar to the one who quits because they have an easy option.

Their loss, in my opinion.

You know, if I had the option to lock my account to open only, while having significant reduced rebuys, I most certainly would do so.

There's no need for a mode lock - just don't select Solo / Private Groups.

 

[Haggbad Celine]

No-one is in a position to decide how others should play this game.

If that's the case missions wouldn't get disabled, Mr. Maynard

There's no need for a mode lock - just don't select Solo / Private Groups.

But I won't, if I can achieve my goal in a lazy fashion.
I wouldn't bother with being interdicted if I have the option of evasion in the first place.

 

[Tiny_Rick]

If that's the case missions wouldn't get disabled, Mr. Maynard

I'm not sure he has the guts to opine on that brilliant point, Celine, but I would welcome a response.

 

[Robert Maynard]

If that's the case missions wouldn't get disabled, Mr. Maynard

Hehe.... Except Frontier, of course - it's their game.

I thought that it would be obvious that I was referring to players....

 

[Haggbad Celine]

Hehe.... Except Frontier, of course - it's their game.

I thought that it would be obvious that I was referring to players....

My name wouldn't be Haggbard Celine if I was here to dictate.

 

[UmbraRex]

you again completely misunderstand whole topic and again compare software with hardware. Start compare T9 ship for example before and after update, its different and with your logic you should ask for refund again. Silly...

As advertising modes are SOLO/GRUOP/OPEN, PvP players have same right to wrote same text as you wrote but with switched modes. Open is part of the game as SOLO/group. And you completely ignore that.

*facedesk

OK, lemme try to explain this to you.

Suppose, for a moment, I bought this game, and don't like PvP. I do however like playing around with the BGS. I like trying, for instance, to push anarchy factions up to control a system because for my internal dialog I hate all the major powers.

Now there are PvPers who don't like me manipulating the BGS in private or solo, cause they want to be able to stop me by blowing my ship up. So if they manage to convince FDev to make BGS/PP work only apply in Open what are my options?

a) Play in open where I'm subject to PvP, which I despise (reasons are irrelevant to this discussion).

b) Play in PG/Solo and not be able to affect systems the way I used to.

c) Quit, because I'm not getting the enjoyment from the game I used to.

The whole goal of the PvP crowd is to push people who want to affect the BGS/PP (which one depends on which PvPer you talk to) to open to make them available to be shot at because, even though there are lots of people in Open, there aren't any people in open to shoot at (huh? Whatever.) -OR- They want to be able to shoot people working the BGS/PP in open despite the fact doing so will have

a) little to no effect on the end goal of PP because PvP kills are worth almost no merits (I have no opinion on this due to complete non-involvement in PP to date)

b) an actual detrimental effect on their faction in BGS because killing clean commanders in a system actually degrades the controlling faction's influence.

PvPers want to close down modes/make them useless for the reason they were included in the game.

As a rule I hate RL analogies but, for this I'd go with:

I bought an Alienware Area 51 top of the line computer but someone somewhere convinced Alienware that having that much computer was unfair to their gaming experience, so they convinced Alienware to update the bios on my computer to reduce the graphics capabilities of my computer.

 

[UmbraRex]

Ah, the "I can't trust myself to obey by my own rules, therefore everybody needs to be forced to follow them" school of thought.

Yes.

Why in the name of the void should I be forced to follow YOUR rules when you can't even follow them yourself?

 

[AbsinthSvK]

As a rule I hate RL analogies but, for this I'd go with:

I bought an Alienware Area 51 top of the line computer but someone somewhere convinced Alienware that having that much computer was unfair to their gaming experience, so they convinced Alienware to update the bios on my computer to reduce the graphics capabilities of my computer.

well, funny is , similar thing already exists and is used in cars, mobiles etc to boost or reduce performance. [haha]

 

[Robert Maynard]

But I won't, if I can achieve my goal in a lazy fashion.
I wouldn't bother with being interdicted if I have the option of evasion in the first place.

Your choice.