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Shield Booster Diminishing Returns- Stop the Stack
- Thread starter Snoiperman
- Start date
Well, does "organic" just mean "people who didn't want to take part and weren't expecting to"? Maybe this is the real problem?
My only PvP experience in recent months was when hauling in my Cutter and I noticed another player manoeuvring to get behind me. I throttled down and pitched over to face him and scan. He vanished before my scan completed. I guess he'd seen my A-rated shield, SCBs and all the boosters. In other words: on that occasion having enough boosters was fundamental to my playstyle.
Hands off my playstyle.
Bigmaec and I were discussing possible rules in a PvP tournament. Were you speed-reading?
If the idea is to better counter shields with missiles, the right answer is probably to allow the Reverb effect on them. Or add other effects that allow partial shield bypass. Although I actually quite like the idea of gradually plinking away a stacked Cutter's shield gen using reverb dumbfires.
Its not that the loadout is better, it is that the PVP is just not fun. Sort of like encountering a player using premiums, you have to use premiums or be at a slight disadvantage. When everyone uses premiums, PVP becomes less fun.
Yeah my bad. Sorry. Edited out what I said
In a perfect world, there would be several viable loadouts and the skill would be deciding.
In the current world, I fly a FAS and can be as good as I want, the meme FdL with thrice the hitpool and more dps just blows me out of the water.
I'm far from risk averse. I don't like to explode, from an ego point of view, especially not in organic PvP. But I risk nothing except a 10 million rebuy.
In prearranged duels I couldn't care less.
The joke in this whole situation is, a Corvette with 60% resistances and 2000 mj of shield strength would still be amply sufficient to kill (nearly) everything in PvE. Toning down of HD boosters would cost the PvEr nothing. But the effect for PvP would be immense, in a positive way.
One would have to take a look at high alpha weapons like frags or thermsl conduit PAs to make them not OP against traders.
But it would cost the PvE side nothing, but would make PvP much more enjoyable and ganking a lot more risky.
Yeah, but like I said, even with 200 mostly absolute DPS, the Cutter still takes 30 minutes at the very least of pure shooting to kill it.Don't think anything needs to be changed here. Large ships have good shield and hull strength but lack manoeuvrability, medium and small ships have worse shield and hull strength but are much faster and can easily outrun and outmanoeuvre a large ship. This allows for two different playstyles and makes combat more interesting.
To compensate for its shield tanking potential, the Cutter has the worst firepower of the big three, and considering that it can also be outmanoeuvred by smaller ships, one or two average PvP builds can easily take it down, provided that their pilots aren't lazy gankers who expect all their victims to not have decent defences.
I think Boosters are fine. The reason you have 23 minutes of shields is the Cell Banks. Personally I would much rather get rid of the “magic get my shields back” button, which at least would then allow you to make a realistic assessment during the battle of whether your shields are going to outlast your opponents based on DPS dealt so far.
honestly, all lasers should have the ability to slightly damage shield boosters. Give them a reason and purpose in PVP. If we want to buff beams, give them like 20-30% better damage to the boosters.
Organic is not prearranged.Well, does "organic" just mean "people who didn't want to take part and weren't expecting to"? Maybe this is the real problem?
My only PvP experience in recent months was when hauling in my Cutter and I noticed another player manoeuvring to get behind me. I throttled down and pitched over to face him and scan. He vanished before my scan completed. I guess he'd seen my A-rated shield, SCBs and all the boosters. In other words: on that occasion having enough boosters was fundamental to my playstyle.
Hands off my playstyle.
It can be ganking, it can be like our BGS war against SPEAR in Carcosa, it can be powerplay, it can be piracy.
The target can be willing, or not. In prearranged fights, both participants agree. And it still is - for example - impossible ingame to detect
if your opponent 'cheats' by using premium ammo.
These are factors contributing a lot to ganking. Make PvP shorter, meaningfuler (like bounty boards as reason/method to kill gankers) and more transparent and a big deal of ganking will vanish.
Still, purely off boosters, I get 600% better shields than regular people without them. Even more considering the 6x boost is onto my base shields, which is also extremely high already. Banks can be cancelled with railgun cascade, shield tanking cannot.
Banks are terrible but can at least be countered somewhat. You can't counter a 6 booster FdL, when every other medium (except the clone FdL) has only 4, and ships like the FAS which are meantvas hybrid/hull tanks need some utility to not totally get rekt by module sniping with multis (chaff) or packhound mission kill (ecm/pd).
So, you are essentially suggesting that something you want to do isn't fun, so the game should be changed just to make your fun?
Yeah, that makes a whole lot of sense, doesn't it? You are not having fun...
Now that’s simply not true.
I have a Corvette with 2000MJ BiWeaves and 60% resists. I agree, that is largely all you need but it’s by no means impervious ... jump in to a pirate mission USS populated by 9 ships that instantly turn hostile and those shields will evaporate VERY quickly.
Now, I don’t have an issue with that ... those are vastly overwhelming numbers and it is perhaps reasonable that - outside of a wing - I should have to flee sometimes. But the only reason I have those shields is because I’m running multiple boosters (and GSRMs) so reducing the impact those have WOULD absolutely impact me as a PvE player.
Come on Ratty, don't troll.So, you are essentially suggesting that something you want to do isn't fun, so the game should be changed just to make your fun?
Yeah, that makes a whole lot of sense, doesn't it? You are not having fun...
You know he means PvP in general is fun, just no slugfests of 20-30 minutes
Outside of when I am leaving an AX CZ, not once, not ever, have gankers tried to interdict me while I was piloting a combat outfit ship. I don't engage gankers with the intent to kill them because outfitting a ship actually capable of that would compromise the purpose of my trade, mining, exploration, passenger, ships too much to keep them truly fit for purpose. What I do is engineer my shields, stack boosters, and run, because I never really had a chance to kill them in the first place. Not unless they were totally incompetent anyway.
Edit. I have killed 2 commanders in 3 years. One on accident with a ram in a CZ, the other must have saw a video of a Vulture taking out an Annie or something, and tried the same thing with my turretboat G5 everything cutter in their unengineered Vulture while I was messing around in a hazres. It was over b4 I even realized I was in a fight. So not a ganker.
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You said it yourself. Some people in this game have the irritant notion that they are the top dogs and everything should be possible for them alone, even stuff that is meant for wings. This should die in a dumpster fire. Get yourself a wing if you can't kill a threat9 uss alone. It's multiplayer content.
I could get on board with that idea.
Indeed! Planetary systems form quicker than a 9k prismatic shield setup recharges...
NO! The Fed'Vette is already OP as frack, with mamba type agility, class 8 distro and powerplant and 2x C4 hardpoints and convergence to die for, I mean you can drive a corvett between the outer hardpoints on a clipper or a cutter.
Therein lies your answer, gimp the HD blueprint, not the stacking.
Why should other builds be gimped to nix edge case PvP metas? Look at it another way, PvE meta is resistance based mods on genny and boosters, my Vette the INV "Andominous" only has around 18mj of absolute shields, so if you come at me with your 1200 absolute DPS Annie, my shields are gone in 2 seconds and my armour will be eviscerated in a similar time frame.