think again what that image means, I am sure you'll be able to figure it out eventually. Hint: That figure is not talking from @Doctor Dread 's perspective.
Solution for Ganking
- Thread starter Sirlance
- Start date
I’ve always wished there were no hollow squares for reason of immersion, or anything differentiating player from NPC, so on board with that much of the suggestion. I don’t see why that would need a module though, that would actually be even worse for immersion, having to do something in character essentially to bypass a blatant gamey aspect that breaks character.
I assumed the image was in reference to some strawman caricature of a 'ganker' and represents a perspective not likely to be present in any relevant fraction of the actual player base, or even the ganker subset of the player base, which is very poorly represented on these forums in any case. It was also a confusing response to galahad saying that those not accepting of the conditions implicit to Open are better off not coming to Open, which may have confused galahad as to Dread's intent, prompting an equally confused response.
Why would they want to? That kind of attempt at pseudo-policing is beyond Inara's purview and would be a large investment of time and effort for what purpose.
You said...
...which presumes things like:
- CMDRs can be killed
- which is something to be angry about
- there are few other motivations to be reported as a ganker
- the instigator of hostilities is not the one being shot down
- there is some burden of consent upon players, beyond following Frontier's rules
Which I am sure some people do think.
That's a pretty naive assumption too.
May as well say, "I just assume that you're all adults and know not to wear socks with sandals", like it's some kind of unversal truth or everyone has the same thing in mind when you say sandals.
I'll say it again.
I recently searched for 11 enemies in my system, it's not just here it is, catch it, you have to scan the ship.
And that's the game.
Someone misled the developers and said that empty squares is right, it really isn't. It's up to you to decide to declare yourself to the entire system or not.
We have a button to report a crime and for some reason it doesn't put anyone on hold because the NPCs are very weak.
Automatically showing people as hollow squares violates the integrity of the game.
Why should I use a scanner to figure out if it's another power's ship or not? The first one to scan it will report it to the entire system!
I don't know about Inara, but the frequency with which this comes up on the forums seems to indicate a sizable number of people would want such a service to exist. One of those might be bothered enough to implement and maintain it.
That is not a presumption, that is just how the game works.
It is something some people are angry about, quite obviously. Or do you think people open such threads because they are just bored? But if they are not angry, why would they report the ganker? So why would you object to a database, if you believe no one is angry and thus no one would be motivated to report the gankers?
No, not at all. Of course there would be other motivations, but why would that bother me? The website gets some kind of simple fact-checking, such as how many people report the CMDR in question, done.
Why would that matter? Anyone who reports a ganker is not okay with being ganked, obviously. Whether they can successfully fight back or not hardly matters there.
That is also not a presumption, that is the basic consensus of all adults playing games in human history. People who do not accept that consensus are generally... not seen as acceptable individuals, regardless of what society they live in.
You really want to think a bit more about that post you replied to there.
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When a CMDR's ship is destroyed they get punted to the last starport they were docked at with a shiny new ship, minus 5% (sometimes even less) of it's value, sans any cargo, exploration data, and maybe a few missions. The whole procedure takes maybe 90 seconds. That's not exactly 'killed'.
Indeed, I've had to shoot down the same gankers twice in the same fight on more than one occasion. Doesn't sound like my CMDR killed them to me.
I think people can become very angry about very many things.
Sounds like a popularity contest.
I'm sure you realize that anyone can make up whatever they like and find a half dozen acquaintances to swear the same name did the same thing to them. Without a thoroughly impractical standard of proof (Frontier's own logs, or a video long enough to show context), it's not possible to verify any claim with certainty.
Sure a tiny number of gankers are prolific enough that it would be fairly absurd to doubt what they're doing, but that's a pretty small fraction of gankers.
As an adult playing games who vehemently disagrees, I'm going to call that statement, which would presume to include me, categorically false.
I'm sure there is a sizable subset of players who would presume to impose their own subjective rules upon this game, but to claim there is a universal consensus on what those rules are is flatly ludicrous.
I gave it at least another half-second of thought and came up with the same response.
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My daftness has on a few occasions left me perplexed with NPC behavior before finally getting the “ah, ha” moment from chat that it was actually another player I was interacting with, so I’ll say I’ve had a glimpse of this better world and I liked it (although the Commander in the T-7 I shoved sideways into a mail slot while never speeding resulting in the station destroying him was rather vocal about not liking it, after the fact).
Can you share the build?
Oh wow! Yet another thing I never knew was a thing
Good post, missed it before. It's this imbalance that begs the question: Why bother at all trying to fly in open as a bulk trader or any similar role. You have to compromise to the point that it's just not worth it, and probably not fun for you anymore, too.
Of course all this doesn't matter if you're trading in some backwater system at the fringes of the bubble. But where events like CGs are concerned, the only answer to the murder boat vs. trader question is: Don't bother.
Dude. That is semantics. Whether you call it "killing" or "losing your ship explosively", it's what bothers people.
This whole reply shows you are not honest or sincere about what you want to discuss here. Let us leave it at that. But please give me your CMDR name.
@Sophokles Logimo I'm curious as to what you think of this scenario and how you'd apply your system to it.
How does ganking work in the context of self-defense? How does self-defense work in the context of being wanted? Is being interdicted a hostile act?
Honestly, it's mostly a waste of time, for the same reasons hiding hollow squares would be in the absence of any other changes. They know someone is there, and you're revealed the second you're targeted. Was only ever useful in very high traffic density instances, especially during the period of that bug where all the NPCs would constantly roll in SC (if you were also rolling to most people would just skip past you while cycling targets without even trying to get the basic scan).
For me, that's kinda the game. Without at least the hope of risk, risk which my CMDR appropriately dreads enough to take all practical contextual precautions, the game would have gotten stale for me about a week after I made this forum account.
That's also why I'm hostile to the flag idea. I don't want a PvP flag around my CMDR's neck while he's trading or running missions, but I want to be immune to PvP even less.
Imagine playing a 4X game with no provisions for combat.
Semantics are pretty important when talking about the definition of words and their implications.
Essentially no one is loosing a ship when 'killed'. Most of the time, one is losing five percent of it's credit value and a few minutes of time. It's clear that this bothers people, but there are vastly greater inconveniences that seem to bother some people a whole lot less. It's almost as if there is little rhyme or reason to what causes offense. It may even be wholly subjective.
Personally, I don't mind having my characters' utterly valueless assets go through a very temporary animation with me being able to use them immediately after, as if nothing had happened. It's only my insistence on trying to immerse myself in my character that makes it relevant at all.
I've been nothing but earnest. I just find your whole outlook alien to the point of ridiculousness, given we've seemingly been playing the same game for similar lengths of time. It's really quite fascinating.
What do you need my CMDR's name for? Are you a ganker or something?
How does ganking work in the context of self-defense? How does self-defense work in the context of being wanted? Is being interdicted a hostile act?
Honestly, it's mostly a waste of time, for the same reasons hiding hollow squares would be in the absence of any other changes. They know someone is there, and you're revealed the second you're targeted. Was only ever useful in very high traffic density instances, especially during the period of that bug where all the NPCs would constantly roll in SC (if you were also rolling to most people would just skip past you while cycling targets without even trying to get the basic scan).
For me, that's kinda the game. Without at least the hope of risk, risk which my CMDR appropriately dreads enough to take all practical contextual precautions, the game would have gotten stale for me about a week after I made this forum account.
That's also why I'm hostile to the flag idea. I don't want a PvP flag around my CMDR's neck while he's trading or running missions, but I want to be immune to PvP even less.
Imagine playing a 4X game with no provisions for combat.
Semantics are pretty important when talking about the definition of words and their implications.
Essentially no one is loosing a ship when 'killed'. Most of the time, one is losing five percent of it's credit value and a few minutes of time. It's clear that this bothers people, but there are vastly greater inconveniences that seem to bother some people a whole lot less. It's almost as if there is little rhyme or reason to what causes offense. It may even be wholly subjective.
Personally, I don't mind having my characters' utterly valueless assets go through a very temporary animation with me being able to use them immediately after, as if nothing had happened. It's only my insistence on trying to immerse myself in my character that makes it relevant at all.
I've been nothing but earnest. I just find your whole outlook alien to the point of ridiculousness, given we've seemingly been playing the same game for similar lengths of time. It's really quite fascinating.
What do you need my CMDR's name for? Are you a ganker or something?
Because playing against players is a different, but not necessarily more difficult, experience compared to playing against NPCs. Tactics that work against players don’t necessarily work against NPCs, and vice versa. I find it makes the game more interesting, and thus more fun.
As a hauler in Open, I use the exact same build in Open that I would use in Solo/PG. The same armor and shields I use to safely Buckyball my takeoffs and landings can be used to kill a lone pirate or survive long enough to escape from a hostile player … assuming I don’t do something as foolish as fly slowly in a straight line away from them!
I’ve participated in numerous trade CGs in Open, and have yet to be killed. It’s how I’ve come to my impression of gankers: they are so bad at PvP that they need the active cooperation of their target to make the kill. If you don’t follow their “script” (AKA common forum “wisdom”) then they’re not much of a threat,
Let's just say I want to avoid meeting you in game. But of course, if you don't want to, there is nothing I will do.
We do, but we then get complaints about it and requests to change the game in favour of those flying in open.
We are always in the wrong.
Well, yes, but its nothing special. I'm sure others could find ways to improve it.
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Its good enough though. Deletes stuff easily. Its main weakness is longevity. Tends to run out of ammo quickly.
LOL, this is so true.
"Don't like it? Go play in Solo!"
"Waaa! People play in solo! Its not fair!"