.
Exactly what I expect to be honest.
Overpromising and underdelivering but at the same time fans will take the "promise" as measurement and keep clinging to it even after the underdelivering. Thats how the current difference in perception and evaluation came to be. Procgen, seamless transition, simulated environment, fully detailed planetary surfaces, unique handcrafted locations etc etc...it all sounds awesome but reality is a different beast.
And its the inability to see or accept reality that makes the whole topic so toxic to discuss in the first place. We ve come to compomises in this place (well, truth is, the people who couldnt are long gone by now...) but take YT or similar less enforced sites....its completely out of control.
This I understand. Its actually the main reason for the "initial impression" people have with SC (me included). The potential, the scope. And yes, SC does make it better then ED. The problem is that Star Citizen literally is a sandbox in the way that its a tiny "box" with nothing much in it. Sandbox in todays massive AAA games is used to describe a fully fleshed out world that gives you the freedom to do whatever you want, basically is a romantic version of the word. But thats not what SC is. They share the term but not the meaning. A trend thats happening very frequently within Star Citizen and CIG I have to say.
My resentment mainly comes from the fact that CIG is mostly "promises". They almost NEVER come through on what they announce. After a year or two of following it closely I started feeling like I v been taken for a ride and even tho it wasnt MY money directly I understood that its peoples money that all this overpromising and underdelivering is happening on.
This snapshot comparison alone (I believe it but of course I ll check again once evocati goes live) tells me that CIG promised something (and received money for) that they cannot deliver. It doesnt matter if specific individuals (sorry Mole) say its "stunning" (and I refuse to call it "tech")...its NOT what they showed and announced, the difference is MASSIVE and as such I will rate it a "failure" if it really comes out in that state. But of course I do because I m biased and a hater. Or, maybe...I simply expect what they told me they would deliver.
Also....when they deliver this impressive environment. What will that change? Its yet another handcrafted thing which CIG probably used the last 4 or 5 months working on for this specific location, probably under crunch conditions. Do you expect that the underlying "technology" (sorry, laughable) can be applied openly to the rest of the universe because thats what the fanatics will assume and advertise? Will other planets receive weather tech? Or will we continue to wait months on end for a single location that remains to be "impressive" because the technology is non-existing and CIG relies heavily on handcrafting to keep up the "potential"?
As I said...I understand the impression but fact is theres not much to explore. Apart from one or two locations PER PLANET the whole thing is barren and void of content. Worse....in terms of exploring the project doesnt even have any kind of supporting features or mechanisms in place to empower a profession that focuses on exploring. Star Citizen remains to be basically a tech demo. It shows what "could be possible" far far in the future but its not "it" yet. My point of view is that CIG didnt even has started with development yet. They are still busy coming up with ideas and finding a vision that encompasses everything they want to achieve. While they are busy with ideas and theorycrafting they just continue to flesh out the tech demo. Tell me I m wrong?
The screenshots shown on this page so far have been really impressive, theres no denyiong it. But the underlying question or statement remains the same.
Where is the game / how does THIS make SC "better" then already released AAA games?
because that is the leap in logic and assumption that SC fans usually demonstrate when it comes to discussing the topic.
Weather tech...regardless how it pans out (could be a desaster, could be a success, could be local thing etc etc) is a tiny part of Star Citizen. It doesnt bring the project forward in any major way. Its not even a blocker or critical compnent. Its just more "seasoning" Its one of the ingredients and it never even was required. No doubt people will MAKE it critical now but its not so important for the game as a whole. Again, visual fluff is the main criteria on which people judge and evaluate the projects value as a game. A critical flaw. In my gaming life there have been quite a few tech demos that made me hungry for a game of that sort. That triggered a desire and longing.
Star Citizen is exactly like this. Its designed to trigger that reaction, based on its visual presentation. It doesnt have the content, it doesnt have the features and after 7 years it seems like CIG is incapable of delivering the game that its current tech demo is promising. Doesnt change the fact that people still log in to get that "feeling", that "impression" and the remaining hardcore are still discussing that all this can be achieved eventually with more time and more patience while the actual experts on the matter judge it very differently. Mocking or open ridicule or at best ignoring. If CIGs progress would really be realistic or impressive as people think, wouldnt other companies pick up on it and use it as reference? I m sure its envy and hate on a global scale. just like any other cult in the world that preaches how only "they" can see the truth and everybody else is a threat due to envy and hate.
But its been 7 years (or 8...depending how you count) and we ve gone through 300+ million dollars to achieve what we currently have. At what point are people going to "wake up" and accept reality? Some lost causes continue to spout "take as much time as you need" or show a little more reservation by saying "10 years isnt uncommon" or the most extreme as of today "it doesnt matter if they fail, its already been better then any other game, I regret nothing".
If I take a step back and look at myself I cannot deny that I am NOT neutral in all this. Whatever news come out of CIG immediately come under suspicion from me, are rated very harshly and I am prone to assume "the worst". That is not natural behavior for me. People tell me I am good-natured and too trusting instead. So why the difference on this topic?
Abuse and disappointment of said trust over YEARS I d say. I have been looking forward to progress and achievements, I ve justified as well in the beginning (oh its early, they have so much to do, give em time) but at some point you gotta wake up. In my case its probably come quicker specifically BECAUSE I dont play it. Because I dont experience "the rush" from entering or leaving my pilot seat or "run" through the station. I evaluate the project based on what I see not what I feel, So am I a hater or simply the only "woke" person in this discussion while the other side talks from a state of intoxicated stupor reliving "the feeling" when they discuss facts? Frankly, thats how it often feels to me.
And I m still not invested into SCs failure not like the other side which is undeniably invested into its success. I just refuse to grant it achievements or victories that I dont see...not that my opinion or view matters at all but when I voice them people react as if it does...trying to silence me, to change my view or attack me in order to render my input "worthless".
Theres a lot of games on the market where I dont see the value, the quality. Its simply different tastes. But even if I dont like COD or PGUB or DOTA I do understand it, I can read about and confirm its qualities. I can come to a conclusion and give my verdict, regardless how qualified it is in terms of "expert commentary" and every community has its fair share of argument.
But Star Citizen certainly is unique in all this. I have never experienced this level of investment in a video game. Some people argue like their lifes depend on it...or their sanity. And they will lash out at timid or insensitive comments with a hostility that makes you feel like you offended somebodies mother. At the same time qualities are boosted out of proportion to a degree that makes discussion impossible because the difference stances are so extreme. Even with moderation (without, its simply chaos) you degenrate to mocking or "clever" ridicule quickly.
And while most people discussing it are "plebs", inexperienced, clueless of all the various dependancies on the surface it doesnt matter. You could be an expert in project management, an expert in coding, an expert in various technologies utilized in SC, you could ve put hundreds of hours into "testing".....all of this doesnt matter the moment your evaluation is negative or less then positive. Acceptance today only goes to the "respectful" criticism. How I say something shoudnt change its meaning but it seems that is a critical differentiation. But how harsh criticism actually becomes depends mostly on the people refusing it in the first place. FTR and how he comments his videos is a good example for this. He isnt acting like he does because of the game, he does it because of the community that attacks and mocks him at every corner.
I wont deny that for some time (years ago honestly) I was trying to word my impression carefully and provide lengthy detailed posts to change peoples mind. To help others to "wake up" and realize their folly. Years later I understand how much in vain that was and still is. When you talk to people who "dont want" their opinion to be changed any kind of effort is wasted from the get go. Today I continue to do it becasue I have some kind of "knowledge" about Star Citizen and CIG because of the previous years and I can provide insight and facts that others probably wont...plus I have more time on my hands that I know how to fill. If it really would be a topic I m not interested in I would simply walk away and not care.
And I realize how naive it is to hope to convince any of the hardliners at this point. Thats not why I write my posts in the first place (anymore).
Instead I m thinking about all the potential ̶v̶̶i̶̶c̶̶t̶̶i̶̶m̶̶s̶ players who are yet uninvested and outside this mess. Do I care about how others spend their money? No because I realize I cannot change it anyway. I dont agree with spending money on alcohol or drugs or tabacco but I m powerless to change that so I dont even try. I WILL however share my view on it and I dont care if some addicts think I m wrong or rude.
After 7 years I have been challenged with lots of different views, interpretations, assumptions and outright lies. Engaging in any SC discussion requires effort and time because of how easily the lies and exaggerations are shared and hoq quickly the personal attacks come. Staying in reality is hard work and from where I m standing, some have lost that perspective for good when it comes to SC.
So my view is "hardened" and I m slow to convince otherwise. But hardly anybody even tries anymore. Instead people look for ways to "disregard" me....a massive difference. Whats left is posting to the people looking in from outside. People who are yet not invested either way or who are looking for some information. Doubtful that the FD forum is a good place for that but its one of the few places where you even "can" discuss the topic in a civil manner (my priority focus for deciding to participate). My sanity and time is too precious to waste it on more frequented higher-impact locations (I dabble in YT comments when i feel "nasty" hehe).
I guess at some point I will simply "walk away", doesnt mean I change my mind or "yield victory" but no doubt will come to the conclusion that the time spent on massive walls of text is better used otherwise. Whoever then is glad I m gone only admits that my posts felt like a threat to them, or were a thorn in their mind. Disturbance, annoyance call it what you want. But I can say I never tried to "crush" Star Citizen, only stated what I really thought.
wow, that came across whiny
time to take a break I think hehe
lolMight be a bit early... :/
Exactly what I expect to be honest.
Overpromising and underdelivering but at the same time fans will take the "promise" as measurement and keep clinging to it even after the underdelivering. Thats how the current difference in perception and evaluation came to be. Procgen, seamless transition, simulated environment, fully detailed planetary surfaces, unique handcrafted locations etc etc...it all sounds awesome but reality is a different beast.
And its the inability to see or accept reality that makes the whole topic so toxic to discuss in the first place. We ve come to compomises in this place (well, truth is, the people who couldnt are long gone by now...) but take YT or similar less enforced sites....its completely out of control.
This I understand. Its actually the main reason for the "initial impression" people have with SC (me included). The potential, the scope. And yes, SC does make it better then ED. The problem is that Star Citizen literally is a sandbox in the way that its a tiny "box" with nothing much in it. Sandbox in todays massive AAA games is used to describe a fully fleshed out world that gives you the freedom to do whatever you want, basically is a romantic version of the word. But thats not what SC is. They share the term but not the meaning. A trend thats happening very frequently within Star Citizen and CIG I have to say.
My resentment mainly comes from the fact that CIG is mostly "promises". They almost NEVER come through on what they announce. After a year or two of following it closely I started feeling like I v been taken for a ride and even tho it wasnt MY money directly I understood that its peoples money that all this overpromising and underdelivering is happening on.
This snapshot comparison alone (I believe it but of course I ll check again once evocati goes live) tells me that CIG promised something (and received money for) that they cannot deliver. It doesnt matter if specific individuals (sorry Mole) say its "stunning" (and I refuse to call it "tech")...its NOT what they showed and announced, the difference is MASSIVE and as such I will rate it a "failure" if it really comes out in that state. But of course I do because I m biased and a hater. Or, maybe...I simply expect what they told me they would deliver.
Also....when they deliver this impressive environment. What will that change? Its yet another handcrafted thing which CIG probably used the last 4 or 5 months working on for this specific location, probably under crunch conditions. Do you expect that the underlying "technology" (sorry, laughable) can be applied openly to the rest of the universe because thats what the fanatics will assume and advertise? Will other planets receive weather tech? Or will we continue to wait months on end for a single location that remains to be "impressive" because the technology is non-existing and CIG relies heavily on handcrafting to keep up the "potential"?
As I said...I understand the impression but fact is theres not much to explore. Apart from one or two locations PER PLANET the whole thing is barren and void of content. Worse....in terms of exploring the project doesnt even have any kind of supporting features or mechanisms in place to empower a profession that focuses on exploring. Star Citizen remains to be basically a tech demo. It shows what "could be possible" far far in the future but its not "it" yet. My point of view is that CIG didnt even has started with development yet. They are still busy coming up with ideas and finding a vision that encompasses everything they want to achieve. While they are busy with ideas and theorycrafting they just continue to flesh out the tech demo. Tell me I m wrong?
The screenshots shown on this page so far have been really impressive, theres no denyiong it. But the underlying question or statement remains the same.
Where is the game / how does THIS make SC "better" then already released AAA games?
because that is the leap in logic and assumption that SC fans usually demonstrate when it comes to discussing the topic.
Weather tech...regardless how it pans out (could be a desaster, could be a success, could be local thing etc etc) is a tiny part of Star Citizen. It doesnt bring the project forward in any major way. Its not even a blocker or critical compnent. Its just more "seasoning" Its one of the ingredients and it never even was required. No doubt people will MAKE it critical now but its not so important for the game as a whole. Again, visual fluff is the main criteria on which people judge and evaluate the projects value as a game. A critical flaw. In my gaming life there have been quite a few tech demos that made me hungry for a game of that sort. That triggered a desire and longing.
Star Citizen is exactly like this. Its designed to trigger that reaction, based on its visual presentation. It doesnt have the content, it doesnt have the features and after 7 years it seems like CIG is incapable of delivering the game that its current tech demo is promising. Doesnt change the fact that people still log in to get that "feeling", that "impression" and the remaining hardcore are still discussing that all this can be achieved eventually with more time and more patience while the actual experts on the matter judge it very differently. Mocking or open ridicule or at best ignoring. If CIGs progress would really be realistic or impressive as people think, wouldnt other companies pick up on it and use it as reference? I m sure its envy and hate on a global scale. just like any other cult in the world that preaches how only "they" can see the truth and everybody else is a threat due to envy and hate.
But its been 7 years (or 8...depending how you count) and we ve gone through 300+ million dollars to achieve what we currently have. At what point are people going to "wake up" and accept reality? Some lost causes continue to spout "take as much time as you need" or show a little more reservation by saying "10 years isnt uncommon" or the most extreme as of today "it doesnt matter if they fail, its already been better then any other game, I regret nothing".
If I take a step back and look at myself I cannot deny that I am NOT neutral in all this. Whatever news come out of CIG immediately come under suspicion from me, are rated very harshly and I am prone to assume "the worst". That is not natural behavior for me. People tell me I am good-natured and too trusting instead. So why the difference on this topic?
Abuse and disappointment of said trust over YEARS I d say. I have been looking forward to progress and achievements, I ve justified as well in the beginning (oh its early, they have so much to do, give em time) but at some point you gotta wake up. In my case its probably come quicker specifically BECAUSE I dont play it. Because I dont experience "the rush" from entering or leaving my pilot seat or "run" through the station. I evaluate the project based on what I see not what I feel, So am I a hater or simply the only "woke" person in this discussion while the other side talks from a state of intoxicated stupor reliving "the feeling" when they discuss facts? Frankly, thats how it often feels to me.
And I m still not invested into SCs failure not like the other side which is undeniably invested into its success. I just refuse to grant it achievements or victories that I dont see...not that my opinion or view matters at all but when I voice them people react as if it does...trying to silence me, to change my view or attack me in order to render my input "worthless".
Theres a lot of games on the market where I dont see the value, the quality. Its simply different tastes. But even if I dont like COD or PGUB or DOTA I do understand it, I can read about and confirm its qualities. I can come to a conclusion and give my verdict, regardless how qualified it is in terms of "expert commentary" and every community has its fair share of argument.
But Star Citizen certainly is unique in all this. I have never experienced this level of investment in a video game. Some people argue like their lifes depend on it...or their sanity. And they will lash out at timid or insensitive comments with a hostility that makes you feel like you offended somebodies mother. At the same time qualities are boosted out of proportion to a degree that makes discussion impossible because the difference stances are so extreme. Even with moderation (without, its simply chaos) you degenrate to mocking or "clever" ridicule quickly.
And while most people discussing it are "plebs", inexperienced, clueless of all the various dependancies on the surface it doesnt matter. You could be an expert in project management, an expert in coding, an expert in various technologies utilized in SC, you could ve put hundreds of hours into "testing".....all of this doesnt matter the moment your evaluation is negative or less then positive. Acceptance today only goes to the "respectful" criticism. How I say something shoudnt change its meaning but it seems that is a critical differentiation. But how harsh criticism actually becomes depends mostly on the people refusing it in the first place. FTR and how he comments his videos is a good example for this. He isnt acting like he does because of the game, he does it because of the community that attacks and mocks him at every corner.
I wont deny that for some time (years ago honestly) I was trying to word my impression carefully and provide lengthy detailed posts to change peoples mind. To help others to "wake up" and realize their folly. Years later I understand how much in vain that was and still is. When you talk to people who "dont want" their opinion to be changed any kind of effort is wasted from the get go. Today I continue to do it becasue I have some kind of "knowledge" about Star Citizen and CIG because of the previous years and I can provide insight and facts that others probably wont...plus I have more time on my hands that I know how to fill. If it really would be a topic I m not interested in I would simply walk away and not care.
And I realize how naive it is to hope to convince any of the hardliners at this point. Thats not why I write my posts in the first place (anymore).
Instead I m thinking about all the potential ̶v̶̶i̶̶c̶̶t̶̶i̶̶m̶̶s̶ players who are yet uninvested and outside this mess. Do I care about how others spend their money? No because I realize I cannot change it anyway. I dont agree with spending money on alcohol or drugs or tabacco but I m powerless to change that so I dont even try. I WILL however share my view on it and I dont care if some addicts think I m wrong or rude.
After 7 years I have been challenged with lots of different views, interpretations, assumptions and outright lies. Engaging in any SC discussion requires effort and time because of how easily the lies and exaggerations are shared and hoq quickly the personal attacks come. Staying in reality is hard work and from where I m standing, some have lost that perspective for good when it comes to SC.
So my view is "hardened" and I m slow to convince otherwise. But hardly anybody even tries anymore. Instead people look for ways to "disregard" me....a massive difference. Whats left is posting to the people looking in from outside. People who are yet not invested either way or who are looking for some information. Doubtful that the FD forum is a good place for that but its one of the few places where you even "can" discuss the topic in a civil manner (my priority focus for deciding to participate). My sanity and time is too precious to waste it on more frequented higher-impact locations (I dabble in YT comments when i feel "nasty" hehe).
I guess at some point I will simply "walk away", doesnt mean I change my mind or "yield victory" but no doubt will come to the conclusion that the time spent on massive walls of text is better used otherwise. Whoever then is glad I m gone only admits that my posts felt like a threat to them, or were a thorn in their mind. Disturbance, annoyance call it what you want. But I can say I never tried to "crush" Star Citizen, only stated what I really thought.
wow, that came across whiny
time to take a break I think hehe
