the laughin devs

[Tas Devil]

"Yes, this Elite thingy is bound to flop. No goals, no points, no end game. No depth whatsoever, and not interesting for today's youth. "

Those were exact words when the big gaming companies turned down Braben & Bell 33 years ago. And oh boy, how they were right...

There were big gaming companies 33 years ago ? Are you sure you have any idea what you are talking about ?

No one said ED was doomed to flop. No need for the hyperbole white knight it only weakens your argument.

What I am saying is that ED was sold as a game where players would drive content and define their own goals. But unfortunately the tools to achieve this are sorely lacking. The game is immense but lacks any depth and is very very repetitive. Look at all the videos made to sell the game especially the one for the launch and try and replicate any of its content in game.

It's currently impossible and as predicted the white knights spent all of beta and gamma telling us to wait till the launch for this content and features. And now we have to wait for the next update.

Meanwhile FD are silently cutting features from the list to be implemented and rewriting the promotional material to avoid openly misleading potential new customers.

I'm enjoying the game and have since June last year. That doesn't mean I'm going to avoid saying what is painfully obvious to more and more people.

 

[spe3d]

Ok I'll play...

What are the goals of these popular single/multiplayer games' that everyday players aim for:

• League of Legends
• Battlefield (any)
• Team Fortress 2
• FIFA (any)
• Kerbal Space Program
• Call of Duty (any)
• Sims (any)
• DayZ (either)
• World of Warcraft
• Minecraft
• Need for Speed (any)
• Space Engineers
• Grand Theft Auto (any)
• Civilisation (any)
• EVE
• Starcraft (either)
• DOTA 2

You don't mean this right? You are just kidding?


Most of the games, like Battlefield simply are games with ladder systems. When you Play it, you wanna win and if you can you wanna be the best. In the modern parts you can advance in weapons, unlock new cool stuff and so on. These are simply the goals of every game!! And you really wanna ask this? GTA? To Play the Story, getting better, buy better cars, better guns. Get yourself a flat, advance in a storyline until you reach the end.
WoW? No goals? rofl - you cannot mean this for truth.

You really wanna compare minecraft with elite? A game where you can nearly do everything? You know, minecraft deserve the name "sandbox-game". I only can laugh about the argument, that elite is a sandbox-game. You nearly can do nothin in it. You can fly around and earn credits. Finito. The rest is Imagination because of the lack of content.

Exactly. The universe is vast and uncaring, and you (and I) are the tiniest speck of nothingness imaginable in it. That's the beauty of Elite.

I'll open this Forum through their mainpage and i this morning i read:

Fly alone or with friends, fight for a cause or go it alone; your actions change the galaxy around you in an ever unfolding Story.

This doesn't match up with your Point of view and it doesnt match up with what this demo delivers.

 

[Marsman]

This here is not a game. its a nice demo, a really nice demo-thing. But its not a game. And when i look at all those stupid design-descisions, it's not only "not a game" and it's against players.

I made about 20mio credits.

It took you all the way up to 20 million? I noticed the same thing around 780.251 cr

 

[spe3d]

It took you all the way up to 20 million? I noticed the same thing around 780.251 cr

Well, yea I i got time and watched "24" while trading rares to get credits ^^ The Goal i had was a nice Explorer ASP. Now i have it and i am very excited about my first "deep flight" into the unknown.

 

[DYSEQTA]

"You cannot advance, no levels, no character-data, no skills to improve"

it is YOU, the player who is advancing, learning and improving, not some avatar, no minmaxing involved, your actual skills are improving and that's beautifull!

Sweet, sweet, truth right there. Actual player skill is what matters.

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There were big gaming companies 33 years ago ?.

Yes, big is a relative term... Are you sure you know what you are talking about?

 

[RealFury]

This game want to give the player the opportunity to feel free and to do what he wants, but there is a difference between "think, try and learn" and letting them completely alone. This does not give me the feeling, that devs want me to do something, this gives me the feeling, that devs themselves DONT want to do something.

SNIP....

I ROFL'd so hard reading this... thanks for the entertainment. Unfortunately i have to agree with most of the content of your post as well, i really feel for a new player coming into the game, especially one that has no idea what the original elite was all about. this game is about as far away from a modern multiplayer game as is possible. I'm just hoping that they prioritize quality of life improvements before adding expansions, wings, a proper communications system for groups, ability to "sell all" in carto screen and commodities market, ability to plot your own routes on the map, a fleshed out mission reputation system, group content, a REAL storyline... once we have these it might start to feel a little bit like a multiplayer game and not be so annoying.

My self set goal at the moment is working towards to Python.... not because it allows me to do anything that i can not do in a ship that is 100the the cost and costs 100th of the upkleep... simply because its something i have not done in the game yet and im holding on hoping for something worthwhile for myself and my friends to do together in this "multiplayer" universe.

 

[Amaze]

That was funny, and "it's funny cause it's true".

 

[baja2215]

... this game is about as far away from a modern multiplayer game as is possible....

Correct; it doesn't quite fit the stereotypical modern multiplayer; but what's the problem with that?

 

[Komemiute]

Ah c'mon, even if it is the simpliest thing to win, a game always needs goals. Tell me a game which has none. I am a gamer since i was born I really can't remember a game, that has no goals. This isn't working. I mean, it's not a bad thing not being a game eh?

Elite (1984), Elite II, Frontier and Elite III First Encounter comes to mind...

What about setting your own goals? If YOU were in space what would YOU do? And since we're into metagaming- If YOU were in space, do you really think you'd be so HOT everyone would just gawk at you and offer the key to the universe?

We're all nobodys trying to make a name for ourselves---

 

[spe3d]

Elite (1984), Elite II, Frontier and Elite III First Encounter comes to mind...

What about setting your own goals? If YOU were in space what would YOU do? And since we're into metagaming- If YOU were in space, do you really think you'd be so HOT everyone would just gawk at you and offer the key to the universe?

We're all nobodys trying to make a name for ourselves---

I like this!

What i don't like is the way most of you try to get away from the meaning of this thread. Yea, we can philosophize the meaning of gaming and imagination and so on, but i did not wrote, lets talk about goals and gaming.
I wrote about bad mechanics, loveless quests and poor content. About absolutely ...... dev descissions. Where they force me to make 200 clicks, to sell my scans, just because they are too lazy for a "sell all"-button.

Just look at security ships. I am in a fight, they jump in, fly into my shot and *bang* they gave me a 400c Penalty and start attacking me? w t f ?
This is not only a ..... AI, this is against the Player!

That is what i want to talk about. missing and bad Content...

 

[RealFury]

Correct; it doesn't quite fit the stereotypical modern multiplayer; but what's the problem with that?

the only problem with that is that they market it to people as being a multiplayer game when really it isn't, and the average gamer will not know this until they get a few days into the game after dropping the cash... and then we get threads like this.

 

[Komemiute]

I like this!

What i don't like is the way most of you try to get away from the meaning of this thread. Yea, we can philosophize the meaning of gaming and imagination and so on, but i did not wrote, lets talk about goals and gaming.
I wrote about bad mechanics, loveless quests and poor content. About absolutely ...... dev descissions. Where they force me to make 200 clicks, to sell my scans, just because they are too lazy for a "sell all"-button.

Just look at security ships. I am in a fight, they jump in, fly into my shot and *bang* they gave me a 400c Penalty and start attacking me? w t f ?
This is not only a ..... AI, this is against the Player!

That is what i want to talk about. missing and bad Content...

And that's all fine and dandy.
No, seriously it is- but dude (if you're a guy, otherwise dudette): the 'game has been released, what, a month ago?!
Ok, we all see some shortcomings here and there. Really, I do too- and while for me many are really small issues I can see why someones else might not.
And maybe, just maybe, yeah the release was *a bit* early.

What about trying to focus on the bigger picture and wait at the very least six more months? Let it go, in the mean while- By all means don't burn ourself out on Elite if you find it empty.

Let's all see what these gals and guys come up with- Nobody here REALLY think development is over, right?

 

[antonygoldrick]

You also have to take into account that the game was created mainly by the British.

We can be a very cold, detached and cynical people.

We don't like to hug you, hold your hands or even care if you fail.

The brutal truth is space is a cold and empty space.

Have fun xx

 

[spe3d]

Agree. I am also looking forward and hope they put the drugs away and start making some right descisions like TABs in the fitting-area.... and there we are not talking about issues. They got Alpha testers, no excuse for this -.-

 

[baael]

the only problem with that is that they market it to people as being a multiplayer game when really it isn't, and the average gamer will not know this until they get a few days into the game after dropping the cash... and then we get threads like this.

And the problem with "fandome" is that they keep repeating about what they believe the game is like, so no reviews will help them to understand. Right now it is changing but last year it was crazy, was like "where to hell is the game they were talking about"

You also have to take into account that the game was created mainly by the British.

We can be a very cold, detached and cynical people.

We don't like to hug you, hold your hands or even care if you fail.

The brutal truth is space is a cold and empty space.

Have fun xx

It's a 5 o'clock, Jenkins!!! Time for Elite...

 

[jhondidfool]

Ah c'mon, even if it is the simpliest thing to win, a game always needs goals. Tell me a game which has none. I am a gamer since i was born I really can't remember a game, that has no goals. This isn't working. I mean, it's not a bad thing not being a game eh?

Minecraft, Star Wars Galaxies, The Repopulation, Elite, Frontier: Elite II, Frontier First Encounters: Elite 3, Kenshin, Euro Truck Simulator 1 and 2, Dwarf fortress (and all of its clones), Maia, Space Engineers, Garry's mod, DayZ, Rust, Life is feudal, Star Forge, Universe sandbox, Star Ruler, Mount & Blade (the three of them), Landmark, Neo Scavenger, Starbound, Terraria, TUG... Those out of my mind and my Steam list. Your game-fu is weak.

 

[spe3d]

Minecraft, Star Wars Galaxies, The Repopulation, Elite, Frontier: Elite II, Frontier First Encounters: Elite 3, Kenshin, Euro Truck Simulator 1 and 2, Dwarf fortress (and all of its clones), Maia, Space Engineers, Garry's mod, DayZ, Rust, Life is feudal, Star Forge, Universe sandbox, Star Ruler, Mount & Blade (the three of them), Landmark, Neo Scavenger, Starbound, Terraria, TUG... Those out of my mind and my Steam list. Your game-fu is weak.

I did not really wanted to write it as an answer, but this post needs it.

lol

Minecraft? Minecraft IS a sandbox game. There you can really assign yourself goals and you can create, build, explore. I love this. There you have your own goals and thats because the game gives you the opportunity to have'em!
DayZ - Surviving is THE Goal in this game. You cannot mean this, that this game has no Goal. rofl
StarWarsGalaxy - Awesome!!! I advanced in several skilltrees, we build cities, Setup marketplaces, explore Systems. Yea! My own goals, but also - the game give me Tools to reach them, motivates me to do so. I advance in skills, get better, can buy better Tools, can create more. I love this playstyle - THATS WHY I BOUGHT ELITE.
But Elite does not have all these. Stop being so ignorant.

Pls, really. Stop with this nonsense.

 

[Tas Devil]

I like this!

What i don't like is the way most of you try to get away from the meaning of this thread. Yea, we can philosophize the meaning of gaming and imagination and so on, but i did not wrote, lets talk about goals and gaming.
I wrote about bad mechanics, loveless quests and poor content. About absolutely ...... dev descissions. Where they force me to make 200 clicks, to sell my scans, just because they are too lazy for a "sell all"-button.

Just look at security ships. I am in a fight, they jump in, fly into my shot and *bang* they gave me a 400c Penalty and start attacking me? w t f ?
This is not only a ..... AI, this is against the Player!

That is what i want to talk about. missing and bad Content...

The white knights cannot counter your points with valid arguments because mostly you are correct.

So they shift the conversations to nostalgic reminiscence of 1984 and claim that the success of Elite in 1984 is a good benchmark and starting point to judge the success of this 2014 game.

When we make the point that it's all well and good for a game to let players make their own goals but that they need the ingame tools and mechanics to achieve this you'll notice they shift the conversation again and try and suggest that because 1984 Elite had few mechanics and few goals yet was a huge success 2014 ED MUST also be a success and great as is.

It's quite normal. It's what mostly happens to old men as they grow old. They take roots and hate change.

 

[tucker]

Ah c'mon, even if it is the simpliest thing to win, a game always needs goals. Tell me a game which has none. I am a gamer since i was born I really can't remember a game, that has no goals. This isn't working. I mean, it's not a bad thing not being a game eh?

Well, yea I i got time and watched "24" while trading rares to get credits ^^ The Goal i had was a nice Explorer ASP. Now i have it and i am very excited about my first "deep flight" into the unknown.

BANG... Right there.

You have had your own goal right from the beginning, you have just answered your own question and found out what Elite is all about at the same time.

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Ah c'mon, even if it is the simpliest thing to win, a game always needs goals. Tell me a game which has none. I am a gamer since i was born I really can't remember a game, that has no goals. This isn't working. I mean, it's not a bad thing not being a game eh?

I like this!

What i don't like is the way most of you try to get away from the meaning of this thread. Yea, we can philosophize the meaning of gaming and imagination and so on, but i did not wrote, lets talk about goals and gaming.
I wrote about bad mechanics, loveless quests and poor content. About absolutely ...... dev descissions. Where they force me to make 200 clicks, to sell my scans, just because they are too lazy for a "sell all"-button.

Just look at security ships. I am in a fight, they jump in, fly into my shot and *bang* they gave me a 400c Penalty and start attacking me? w t f ?
This is not only a ..... AI, this is against the Player!

That is what i want to talk about. missing and bad Content...

There is still time for bad mechanics to be sorted out.

 

[veelckoo]

All the things, that make you feel good, make you enjoy games are missing. You cannot build yourself a home, even if you try, there is no way to feel "this system, this station is my home" - no, this sell-all-mentality the game pulls over is allmighty.
You cannot advance, no levels, no character-data, no skills to improve. So you think, ok, then i improve my ship. Fittings, better ships...but there are a handful of very very expensive ships, but there is no use to feel improved. Quests will stay the same. Only the costs explodes. So - no advancement.

You can't build yourself a home?
No levels, no character-data, no skills to improve?

Wow - so I assume that Batman Arkham Asylum is as broken as Elite. What about other games? Crusader Kings? No home, no levels - what to do in those games?
Microsoft Flight Simulator? NO HOME!!!! NO LEVELS!!!
So many broken games.