Let's review facts, and compare apples to apples, ok?.
Jeeze, the word griefer and the personal attacks on the players.. *glass houses*
You don't hear true open players calling other open players griefers.. They call them better or had an unlucky encounter with them. ( Yes there are a few people who use small exploits to do nothing more that break the game ) BUT if they are not using an exploit, they are working with in the game design.
If they are murders... That is totally fine... I get moaned at for being a griefer but if you ask any of the players I killed, truthfully they will admit that before i killed them, I sent them a message asking for 15 Tonnes of cargo. At which point that decided to boost and not send any form of communication.
You speak to everyone else, that stopped or that I manually retrieved cargo from and bar anyone that told me to go F myself for being a pirate, would have gotten away with their ship.
Anyone who ran or fought back got shot down.
I have have been chased around systems by Wings of players and as yet, I haven't died. ( Had a few PVP straight up 1v1s and lost a few of them sure )
There are plenty of players I see, who I know will be hard to get cargo from or even better than me and I run away from them. Because I can and plan ahead.
WHEN I do die and I will.
I will have had a great fight and know that I got beaten by the better player or just was unlucky.
At no point will i scream GRIEFER and run to Solo/Private ( I left Mobius way before any ban was placed because it was really boring and all the Experts and Masters in their big boy ships, either failed to put up any challenge or combat logged ).
So yeah just because you don't like it or can't defend yourself from someone with EXACTLY the same game options as you. Doesn't make them a griefer.
You wouldn't play a football match and complain to the ref when someone tackled you, would you?
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Majinvash, thanks for taking the time to respond. I have some time this evening, so I'll answer your points one at a time.
1. "Jeeze, the word griefer and the personal attacks on the players.. *glass houses*
-
Absolutely the word "
griefer". The behavior I describe in 3 of the 4 examples is *exactly* that. I didn't coin the phrase, I'm just using it appropriately.
- What were my"personal attacks on players"? I mentioned no names. I clearly state a specific behavior, and I questioned the the mindset that leads to it. I then
proposed a way to reduce the negative impact of that behavior on the game by imposing substantial fines/penalties for the behavior. Yes, I did label the offenders
"griefers", and I even allowed myself the fun of questioning their mental capacity. If that is your idea of a "personal attack", we will just have to disagree on that. What I did notice, though, is that
you call out a specific Private group of players by name and criticize them. I haven't yet figured out why you believe it is
reasonable to criticize me for making personal attacks (that are
not personal), and then criticize an entire group of people
by name?
- I'm not really sure how your "glass Houses" statement fits my post? That is a reference to hypocrisy, and I haven't engaged in the behavior I criticize in my post.
You have.
2. "You don't hear true open players calling other open players griefers.."
- That may be true? Its completely irrelevant, but it may be true. If by "true open players" you mean those who play ONLY in Open play, I made it pretty clear that
I have been a SOLO player since I bought the game, and I have played very little in Open Play mode. So I fail to see what your point is in restating the fact?.
3. "They call them better or had an unlucky encounter with them."
- The possibility of bad luck is exactly how I described my nearly instantaneous death in the Combat Zone. I said: "I'm not sure whether that was a fair
representation of an Open-play conflict zone or just a stroke of bad luck of the IMMEDIATELY, irrefutably, fatal kind?" Reading carefully, you would notice that I
described having a problem with three consecutive instances of 3 or 4-on-1 engagements, mostly with ships more capable than mine. I have no problem with
losing a fair fight. And any one of them may have been a better combat pilot than I am. But now we will never know, will we? I just recently reached 'Master"
status, so I have no delusions about where my skills stack up compared to anyone else. I guess it is lucky for me that my ability to win a dogfight in a game has
absolutely nothing to do with my self-image or sense of self-worth.
4. "BUT if they are not using an exploit, they are working with in the game design. If they are murders... That is totally fine..."
- And game design is what we are discussing in this thread. You apparently enjoy the option to play a "pirate", which is fine. The examples I described had
NOTHING to do with piracy. I stated clearly that I had NO cargo, NO bounty, and there was NO communication from the attackers. If there is a legit/valid
reason in-game for such an attack, please enlighten me. If not, I submit that allowing Open players / wings to attack less-capable players for no discernible
reason or benefit (a form of griefing, IMO), WITHOUT SERIOUS CONSEQUENCES OR REPERCUSSIONS keeps a lot of players away from Open play.
Your position is a bit confusing, since in some posts on this thread you seem to advocate for everyone coming to Open play, but in this post you boast about
being one of the players that lots of us avoid by sticking to SOLO / Group mode and avoiding Open play like the plague. And don't forget: The solo/private
group players are "are working within the game design", which you clearly state is fine.
5. "I get moaned at for being a griefer but...<SNIP> ...better than me and I run away from them. Because I can and plan ahead."
Your description of encounters with other players offers a few interesting insights (apparently my post criticized behavior that you feel the need to defend?), but it
has nothing whatsoever to do with my post, which was NOT about you, and NOT about piracy.
6. "So yeah just because you don't like it or can't defend yourself from someone with EXACTLY the same game options as you. Doesn't make them a griefer."
- You finally make a correct statement. My dislike of their behavior does not make them a griefer. The fact that they actively engage in the behavior known as
"GRIEFING" makes them griefers. I'll explain it using your own logic in reverse: So yeah just because you like it that lots of us can't (or simply don't want to be
bothered to) defend themselves from someone with far more experience and better equipment than they have doesn't make you NOT a griefer.
7. "You wouldn't play a football match and complain to the ref when someone tackled you, would you?"
- This is such a silly non-sequitur it is hard to respond to rationally, but I'll try. Its interesting that you equate ED to playing football. Lots of players think of ED
as being more of a Math Olympics, a good game of Golf (if there is such a thing?), or any of a thousand other pass-times that are NOT the game you want them
to be playing. So to answer your question in a way that actually relates back to my original post: yes, I might just complain to the ref about getting tackled by a
fully dressed-out NFL line-backer when I'm playing a friendly game of flag / touch football with the neighborhood kids. Oh wait! I see the problem now! You
are FINE with dressing out in full pads to tackle the local pee-wee league kids. And, if they don't like it, they should leave, and not say anything to attempt to
fix the problem for those who stay on the field, right?
