The Vive discussion Thread

+1 Vive owner, due May.

Can I ask with the lightboxes...

Does the kit come with any sort of way of mounting them, like maybe a clip to screw into the camera mount hole which you can then clip to a shelf?

If not are the lightboxes expected to just sit on a shelf? It's just with that they're not going to point down without a bit of cardboard or whatever shoved under the back of the unit, which is gonna be a bit of a dodgy solution.
They come with Mounting kit: http://www.htcvive.com/us/support/howto/720442.html#GUID-9DA771AA-29FD-4F9C-AD6B-4A3166F230DF

Info and vids on Installation also on that site. http://www.htcvive.com/us/support/
 
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Quick question , another Vive owner, due May. dose any one know if the the vise`s light house`s will work in a conservatory, being its all glass would this interfere ?
 
So until FDev can come up with further optimizations specifically for the VR experience, I'm going to say that VR isn't going to be a good selling point and that ED is not a very good VR showcase product. Sense of scale is really cool, but without at least 1.5x Supersampling, the games just don't look good enough for things like combat and all the pixely blocky stuff is ugly to the point of distraction and disappointment. Again maybe the issue is driver related. Maybe FDev can explain why I'm only seeing 80% GPU usage out of a 980Ti.

I will say: 1.5x Supersampling should be totally reasonable for explorers as long as landing on planets is a thing you plan on skipping most of the time. Otherwise you'll probably need to actively manage your Supersampling setting.

Look at page 47 of these slides (Alex_Vlachos_Advanced_VR_Rendering_GDC2015):

Scale Render Target Resolution
● Turns out, 1.4x is just a recommendation for the HTC Vive (Each HMD design has a different recommended scalar based on optics and panels)
● On slower GPUs, scale the recommended render target scalar down
● On faster GPUs, scale the recommended render target scalar up
● If you’ve got GPU cycles to burn, BURN THEM

And the following note from the SteamVR Unity plugin docs is instructive:
To combat stretching incurred by distortion correction, we render scenes at a higher resolution off-screen.
Since all camera's in Unity are rendered sequentially, we share a single static render texture across each
eye camera. SteamVR provides a recommended render target size as a minimum to account for distortion,
however, rendering to a higher resolution provides additional multisampling benefits at the associated
expense. This can be controlled via SteamVR_Camera.sceneResolutionScale.

What do you reckon the odds are that
  • this render target size is being set by ED/Cobra to a value that is low - below the Vive's native resolution
  • Textures with high frequency detail being downscaled introduces moire patterns. As these are rendered at different locations on subsequent frames you get shimmer
  • Upscaling the offscreen render to output resolution is creating aliasing

and you using supersampling in ED or NVidia DSR, or setting 'VR High' (which may change some factor the game uses to set this scalar) is compensating?
 
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I believe I have read somewhere that the recommendation is to remove/cover mirrors and other shiny surfaces, can't find the link now...
 
Quick question , another Vive owner, due May. dose any one know if the the vise`s light house`s will work in a conservatory, being its all glass would this interfere ?
Possibly, it depends on the infrared diodes being used. If the lighthouse laser emission frequency is in the right range the glass will reflect it and cause confusing inputs. Hard to say and may be a question for HTC or Valve support.

http://gizmodo.com/this-is-how-valve-s-amazing-lighthouse-tracking-technol-1705356768
 
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Quick question , another Vive owner, due May. dose any one know if the the vise`s light house`s will work in a conservatory, being its all glass would this interfere ?

You need to cover reflective surfaces as they can cause the light to bounce and interfere with tracking. As far as glass, I guess it comes down with how reflective it is. Most people have issues with mirrors and shinny metal surfaces. But glass is not as reflective so I don't know.
 
Hi All,

I've been playing ED on the oculus rift DK2 for over a year, since beta. Ive struggled through the framerate issues and incompatablities with the various SDK/RTE versions but still loved every minute of it. Only with the release of 1.3 a couple of weeks ago were all these problems ironed out and it ran perfectl

This where Oculus has out coded the Valve team. Asynchronous time warp (even supported in the positional tracking plane) Its magic and really amazing. Playing on my DK2 used to always have some kind of judder issue. Now with 1.3 None. Vives Interleaved Reprojection (on by default for every vive game) system drops fps down to 45fps when it can not hit 90 fps consistently. Issue with that is you probably will see judder before its drops to 45 fps. Also the developer needs to account for when the FPS goes to 45, which i'm not sure if frontier implemented.

https://steamcommunity.com/app/358720/discussions/0/385429254937377076/


And yes as I posted before, for elite the Fresnel lenses cause major issues. Frontier needs to address it. Right now the game is barley playable because the glare caused by this is so distracting
 
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This where Oculus has out coded the Valve team. Asynchronous time warp (even supported in the positional tracking plane) Its magic and really amazing. Playing on my DK2 used to always have some kind of judder issue. Now with 1.3 None. Vives Interleaved Reprojection (on by default for every vive game) system drops fps down to 45fps when it can not hit 90 fps consistently. Issue with that is you probably will see judder before its drops to 45 fps. Also the developer needs to account for when the FPS goes to 45, which i'm not sure if frontier implemented.
FWIW, I'm not seeing much in the way of judder in ED with Interleaved on. But I agree that ATW is helping cover over a number of sins that would otherwise also be affecting the Rift. But really, the SteamVR/OpenVR implementation in ED needs some work. It doesn't use 100% of the GPU, you can't change how it looks with SweetFX or the standard resolution settings adjustments. All of these are available in the Rift presently. When the SteamVR implementation is improved to match the Oculus implementation, the game will run properly for all without having to brute force performance.


And yes as I posted before, for elite the Fresnel lenses cause major issues. Frontier needs to address it. Right now the game is barley playable because the glare caused by this is so distracting
Speak for yourself here. The lenses are causing absolutely no issues for me. If you're having brightness issues, turn down the brightness of the UI in the game. Or turn down the overall brightness. Or both. 0 problems with glare, though if you have a Rift it may be more problematic because of how the glare works on those lenses.
 
Look at page 47 of these slides (Alex_Vlachos_Advanced_VR_Rendering_GDC2015):



And the following note from the SteamVR Unity plugin docs is instructive:


What do you reckon the odds are that
  • this render target size is being set by ED/Cobra to a value that is low - below the Vive's native resolution
  • Textures with high frequency detail being downscaled introduces moire patterns. As these are rendered at different locations on subsequent frames you get shimmer
  • Upscaling the offscreen render to output resolution is creating aliasing

and you using supersampling in ED or NVidia DSR, or setting 'VR High' (which may change some factor the game uses to set this scalar) is compensating?
My guess is you are right. The resolution is clearly being set *somewhere* and it's clearly a very low resolution that is only improved with Supersampling.

I'll offer a cookie for anyone who figures out where E:D is interfacing with "SteamVR_Camera.sceneResolutionScale."
 
Possibly, it depends on the infrared diodes being used. If the lighthouse laser emission frequency is in the right range the glass will reflect it and cause confusing inputs. Hard to say and may be a question for HTC or Valve support.

http://gizmodo.com/this-is-how-valve-s-amazing-lighthouse-tracking-technol-1705356768

I originally set it up in my office, which is a converted bedroom. One entire wall is a mirrored door closet. I kept getting tracking glitches the closer I got to the mirrors. Sometimes a controller in my hand would appear several feet away. Or I'd be below the floor. Turning towards the mirror would often lead to the world spinning. Not a good thing. I mentioned this on the Vive subreddit, and got downvoted as the devs say they'ved fixed mirors (I'm guessing small ones).

So, I'm guessing you may have some problems.
 
Speak for yourself here. The lenses are causing absolutely no issues for me. If you're having brightness issues, turn down the brightness of the UI in the game. Or turn down the overall brightness. Or both. 0 problems with glare, though if you have a Rift it may be more problematic because of how the glare works on those lenses.

I Have a Vive. So you are seeing no Fresnel rays while out in dark space in your space craft? I find that hard to believe. Other people have commented on this board and also reddit. Did you have it and then fix it? if so how?
 
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I Have a Vive. So you are seeing no Fresnel rays while out in dark space in your space craft? I find that hard to believe. Other people have commented on this board and also reddit. Did you have it and then fix it? if so how?
I'm not, no. Or, certainly not enough to notice.

Again, I recommend you adjust the in-ship brightness. Right panel, last tab.

in-game brightness might be worth you having a look at too. I'm having 0 issues with glare. My issues are firmly with framerate, image quality, and the overarching need to Supersample. I even deleted and reinstalled the game from scratch just to be sure it wasn't something I customized that broke the game. Nope, it's just poorly implemented VR and until FDev takes the time out to bring it up to spec, it will only be good enough for the most powerful of rigs for Vive owners. Incredibly disappointing for me.
 
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Is anyone using the Vive together with an AMD card?
I got a Vive on it's way to me (yay). I have a very decend rig:
Intel i7 3770K @ 4.7ghz
16GB RAM
AMD Fury X

The problem is that elite does not run very well on AMD cards sadly. Performance was not so great with the DK2.
I hear it is a non issue with the rift and asyncronous timewarp but how is it with the vive? Does the Vives variation of reprojection even work with ED?
How is performance with AMD cards?
 
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I'm not, no. Or, certainly not enough to notice.

Again, I recommend you adjust the in-ship brightness. Right panel, last tab.

in-game brightness might be worth you having a look at too. I'm having 0 issues with glare. My issues are firmly with framerate, image quality, and the overarching need to Supersample. I even deleted and reinstalled the game from scratch just to be sure it wasn't something I customized that broke the game. Nope, it's just poorly implemented VR and until FDev takes the time out to bring it up to spec, it will only be good enough for the most powerful of rigs for Vive owners. Incredibly disappointing for me.

If you want to see how clear VR graphics can be, just look at the menus in Project Racing. They are crystal clear in the DK2, I'd reckon even better in the Vive or CV1. The clarity is startling.
 
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I originally set it up in my office, which is a converted bedroom. One entire wall is a mirrored door closet. I kept getting tracking glitches the closer I got to the mirrors. Sometimes a controller in my hand would appear several feet away. Or I'd be below the floor. Turning towards the mirror would often lead to the world spinning. Not a good thing. I mentioned this on the Vive subreddit, and got downvoted as the devs say they'ved fixed mirors (I'm guessing small ones).

So, I'm guessing you may have some problems.


As long as it doesn't mess up with mirrored ceilings in the bedroom... all is good *snicker* ;P I could live without a mirrored closet (Joking!!)




On a different note - Waiting for my Vive to arrive, hopefully by early May. The wait is dreadful. In the meantime trying to figure out whether to try out ED+SweetFX and how that would work out with VR. I may need to dig through some threads as I suspect this has been discussed already.
 
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Vive is here on Friday. And this "subsampling" talk fills me with profound sadness.


VV -- I said that as a joke given everyone is having a lower that it's set resolution apparently, as though it's sampling a lower resolution :).
 
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Vive is here on Friday. And this "subsampling" talk fills me with profound sadness.
Supersampling.

It's fine as long as you have an ample rig. I'm not sure how well the 970 or lower will hold up. I feel like I'm barely hanging on with 2x Supersampling (see rig in sig).

and I mean BARELY hanging on. With occasional, very irritating stutters. I could walk it down to 1x Supersampling but the game starts to look like Minecraft when looking at distant objects. No bueno. And no options like SweetFX to save us.
 
I have had the Vive for about a week. Do not try to use it near mirrors or windows. You may not immediately get an issue, but over time you will realize the tracking is not rock solid. I initially used my living room with windows along one side and plasma TV at one end. I would occasionally get the controllers floating away from my hand. Also, there seemed to be a very slight shake to the controllers (which was barely noticeable). Once I closed all curtains and covered the TV, the controllers were perfectly still and haven't floated anywhere. I also think the HMD's tracking has improved. The VR world is just better with no reflective surfaces nearby.
 
New settings suggestion:

try

VR Low
Supersampling 1.5x
TXAA x2 or x4

Was pretty smooth for me even on planets though of course not as clear as any of us would like. Until FDev fixes this, that will probably be my VR config. I made $50 mill in a few hours in the headset, but I really don't know if it's worth looking at the poor resolution, even when supersampled.

The unique issue with ED IMO is that so many important objects are small so often. Really tiny things are not the forte of gen 1 VR, so trying to visually spot things like planetary outposts feels like a strain. Though again that might be more related to the sub-par resolution in ED more than the headset. Not sure. I will hold out hope that once the resolution and settings issues are fixed, the visual clarity on small objects will fix itself.
 
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