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To Solo Play Players: If You Could Disable PVP, Would You Play in Open Play Mode Instead?
- Thread starter AMX-008 GaZowmn
- Start date
On CGs participation ranges from about 1200 to 5000 of which 75 %are token participants. I've they deliver 1 or 2 loads and wait to see if they got the rewards. The top 25% will be actively hauling for several days if not the whole week.
IIRC at Alcor on PS4 gankers mentioned that average time between targets was about 20
minutes.
At the recent Salvation CGs however one claimed they'd been sitting staring at each other for 5 hours.
Whilst Alcor was done at a Station the Salvation CGs were done off a megaship.
Delivering a mean tonnage for the CG gets a 25 % finish. Delivering enough to cover your own mean and a couple of token participants gets a 10% finish. Top 10 generally requires 20,000 tonnes delivered per day, ie a carrier load.
IIRC at Alcor on PS4 gankers mentioned that average time between targets was about 20
minutes.
At the recent Salvation CGs however one claimed they'd been sitting staring at each other for 5 hours.
Whilst Alcor was done at a Station the Salvation CGs were done off a megaship.
Delivering a mean tonnage for the CG gets a 25 % finish. Delivering enough to cover your own mean and a couple of token participants gets a 10% finish. Top 10 generally requires 20,000 tonnes delivered per day, ie a carrier load.
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And as others have mentioned, then you would need to publicize the PG in order to get members to join, vet everyone, etc.
But we already know that if Open were defacto PvE, and for PvP you had to go crawl to a PG, you'd be singing a different tune here. This same old song and dance has been done many times before over the years in Hotel California, and it always comes back around to the same issues.
Neither the people in Open are happy that others can play whatever mode they wish and affect the game, and the people who want a cooperative atmosphere without the nonconsensual PvP have to jump through odd hoops in order to play together by creating PG's etc. No one really gets what they want, but we all get a little bit of something we want.
Sooner or later, another developer will offer what they need, and there will no longer be fish available for the proverbial "barrel" to discuss anymore. I do have to wonder what FDev's numbers look like from release till now, and just how many people have quit playing the game over the years, for whatever reason, though.
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Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
The button is indeed in the launcher - however discovering the name of a PG on ones platform that suits ones preferred play-style is not so simple.
People really read and, more importantly, believe system chat?
The inference is opaque - remembering that there'd be a requirement that every member agree to the rules of the Private Group before being permitted to join.
Sales generally only ever increase that potential number of players. Obviously only players who currently own the game can play it.
We don't know how many individual players play on any given platform in a day, all we have are the average and peak monthly figures for Steam - and the average on Steam is just that, an average, i.e. c.4,000 players averaged over the day and players don't play for 24 hours a day, probably more like an average of 1 to 2 hours a day, so the number of individuals will significantly exceed the average.
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Does it help if I point out that there are people who Mobius won't accept as members? They're at least all the ones who have ever been chucked out, and anecdotally there are even more. E.g. if you've ever uploaded a video of yourself ganking someone to YouTube you could be "known".
I'd hope that an Open-PvE mode would be available to everyone, at least until they blot their record. And if they get unjustly accused they could at least try a support ticket.
I think FD need to stop being lazy about this. Something as important as PvE should be curated by FD, not left to a private player group.
I'd hope that an Open-PvE mode would be available to everyone, at least until they blot their record. And if they get unjustly accused they could at least try a support ticket.
I think FD need to stop being lazy about this. Something as important as PvE should be curated by FD, not left to a private player group.
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I think the likes of Mobius should be limited, not by their total size, but by its online concurrency. If there are 40K members, then limit instancing to ~10K of those, or whatever the number is. Splitting Mobius on a hard, prearranged "registered per geo" number is not great. As it is, in my Americas sub group, I don't get to see any cmdrs from Euroasia.
But to the other point, how does a new user find it? The current process is like this:
1. Go on open as a noob and get ganked. Yep.
2. Register for one of the user forums and post a "what?" grievance.
3. People will recommend solo mode, and in an odd chance, Mobius.
4. Go to Mobius, find the "how-to" post, send your application, and wait.
5. Once approved, read through the doc on how to use it in game.
The total registered ~500K accounts have to deal with the above just so the literal few dozen gankers don't ruffle their poor little feathers.
But to the other point, how does a new user find it? The current process is like this:
1. Go on open as a noob and get ganked. Yep.
2. Register for one of the user forums and post a "what?" grievance.
3. People will recommend solo mode, and in an odd chance, Mobius.
4. Go to Mobius, find the "how-to" post, send your application, and wait.
5. Once approved, read through the doc on how to use it in game.
The total registered ~500K accounts have to deal with the above just so the literal few dozen gankers don't ruffle their poor little feathers.
IMO, yes a pvp or pve flag for a unified open mode would be nice. On the other hand as it's supposed to be a dangerous galaxy, maybe ganking ought to lead to unpleasant repercussions, like having to pay the rebuy of the gankee, be excluded from the Pilots Federation, losing permits, becoming a target for system security, getting a bounty, and finally becoming a target for other players looking for pvp..
NoVR - What_The_X_F_Dev
Banned
I'm surprised this is still rumbling along after all these months...
...Not going to lie, I havent read the OP or the 122 pages of discussion, but I'm going to shoot from the hip and answer the question posed in the title. Having seen tens of thousands of merits vapourised when instances have broken and I or folks I've been flying with end up deinstanced from our wing and get ganked by 3 or four hostile CMDR's I can see why so much PowerPLay and BGS is done in Solo/PG, leaving only PvP muderboats out looking for blood in Open, further detering "carebears" from going there.
But having tried to oppose a fedneck CG, and been in the delivery system with a few from SPEAR and we were all bored as while the fednecks plugged away the cargo drops in solo / PG, immune to my attacks, and or SPEAR's support, that was soul destroyingly boring. And worse still as their delivered cargo tally continued upwards there was the sense of inevitable defeat to compound the boredom.
What would it take to get me back in open all the time, solid networking, instance with other players without performance drop which is barf inducing in VR< no rubber bandingyou cannot fight that which appears to be in two or three places at once, competition - make it so that combat bonds / CG cargo/mats /merits evaporate, never to be recovered, the minute the CMDR steps into PG/Solo. If I knew that I could be in open, not as one sheep amongst a hard of murderboats, but reliably linked to my buddies, I'd be more inclined to "play that game".
...Not going to lie, I havent read the OP or the 122 pages of discussion, but I'm going to shoot from the hip and answer the question posed in the title. Having seen tens of thousands of merits vapourised when instances have broken and I or folks I've been flying with end up deinstanced from our wing and get ganked by 3 or four hostile CMDR's I can see why so much PowerPLay and BGS is done in Solo/PG, leaving only PvP muderboats out looking for blood in Open, further detering "carebears" from going there.
But having tried to oppose a fedneck CG, and been in the delivery system with a few from SPEAR and we were all bored as while the fednecks plugged away the cargo drops in solo / PG, immune to my attacks, and or SPEAR's support, that was soul destroyingly boring. And worse still as their delivered cargo tally continued upwards there was the sense of inevitable defeat to compound the boredom.
What would it take to get me back in open all the time, solid networking, instance with other players without performance drop which is barf inducing in VR< no rubber bandingyou cannot fight that which appears to be in two or three places at once, competition - make it so that combat bonds / CG cargo/mats /merits evaporate, never to be recovered, the minute the CMDR steps into PG/Solo. If I knew that I could be in open, not as one sheep amongst a hard of murderboats, but reliably linked to my buddies, I'd be more inclined to "play that game".
Let me tell little secret, many (not all but many) gankers are kind of carebears, when it comes to their stuff. And they do know their anti-gank stuff. So when they see something nasty enough on their trail they pull various brave sir robin schemes, ranging from high jump, menu log, to clog. And properly equipped PVP ship is basically undestructible if player decides not to stay in fight.
Many of those gitgud leet ganksta's seek out just easy targets. Easy test, get to shinrarta, choose a noobboat, look what happens. Now do same in FdL, and suddenly it is peacefull like in pacifists convention.
This. It all boils down to this.
This seems a bit silly.
"If the game was different, we'd talk about it differently"
Seems a bit obvious.
Hence the differences in opinion.
Can we note that PvP enabled is the 'logical' state? PvE only in an open game requires a magical shield that prevents specific other ships from using their weapons.
It has implications for Co-Op PvE as well. Friendly ramming damage and friendly fire would no longer be a concern at all (as if player ram damage still hurt other players, griefers would just ram people to death)
![[VR] Bulbulunufus](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/261/261245.jpg?1671230473){kind=avatar}
Don't forget BBFA (and probably others) too! - yes these exist. But what's missing IMO is a proactive freight protection service - you don't need to blow up anyone, you just need to get the freight through. SPEAR are focused on winning fights and "hunting bad guys", not on directly mitigating present hazards for haulers, and have some problematic qualities/biases of their own.
If someone was running a proper "freight-outrider" service, how would you know, too? How do you connect to them without knowing which discord to join or or being in the system where they broadcast to sys chat (you need to organise with them in advance of entering a hot system)? There are in-game tools missing, perhaps.
Weird that most of the time the bad guys are actually better than the good guys which apparently are not that goodThey are just not very good at it.
Merry Xmas every1
It's open in a "binary" state, either 1 or 0, rather. (There is no other "option")
As to the game and shields, etc... they have a purpose as a deterrent, not a prevention. And the deterrent serves not just for PvP purposes, but rather PvE as well. NPC's will also attempt to lower your shield and disable your vessel, not just other players.
As to your last question, Why would players need to be concerned with "friendly fire" and "ramming damage" from each other to begin with, in a cooperative game mode? Kinda contradicts the point of a cooperative game mode when you have the ability to do so, doesn't it?
Now it makes me wonder if NPCs obsess over ramming and shooting each other as much as the players do. Hmm...
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Its a magical shield, not in the sense of actual ingame shields, but rather a 'sorry, you cannot activate your weapons, this ship is piloted by a CMDR' magic 'shield'.
And ramming your buddy or accidentally shooting them in the face with a full spread of plasma accelerators should hurt them, as its really stupid and immersion breaking if it does not.