Tritium Mining in the black

[StarLord55]

Well, say it to the author of the post I'm not enforcing anything, I'm fine with things as they are now
Mining becomes part of the exploration the moment you need to refuel your FC (which is not the ship you use to explore) and mining is the only way to get it done.
Same way that combat is part of becoming an explorer because you need the materials for the engineers, even if you don't like combat.

The question at this point is, why the hell do you need a FC if the only thing you are interested is flying from a star to another? Just keep doing as you have done until now and stop complaining about one of the few sensible dynamics of the game.

I don't think you're listening, because its not about getting from one star to another. Thats obviously not the point of the journey. Its about being able to get to one star to the other when you are ready without first having to spend an entire play session mining.

 

[Gpaolo]

I don't think you're listening, because its not about getting from one star to another. Thats obviously not the point of the journey. Its about being able to get to one star to the other when you are ready without first having to spend an entire play session mining.

No, sorry, I'm not the one who's not listening.
Can you explore with the FC? No. You need to get your ship off the dock and fly. Do you need to mine for that? No. Has the FC changed anything on that? No.
Then, you decide to move your FC in another system? You need the fuel. If you are in the bubble, you buy it. If you are outside the bubble, you mine it. That has nothing to do with the exploration task, that has to do with moving a FC.
If you want to explore moving the FC it is your choice. Here it's being asked to do it quickly, easily and for free.

 

[StarLord55]

No, sorry, I'm not the one who's not listening.
Can you explore with the FC? No. You need to get your ship off the dock and fly. Do you need to mine for that? No. Has the FC changed anything on that? No.
Then, you decide to move your FC in another system? You need the fuel. If you are in the bubble, you buy it. If you are outside the bubble, you mine it. That has nothing to do with the exploration task, that has to do with moving a FC.
If you want to explore moving the FC it is your choice. Here it's being asked to do it quickly, easily and for free.

You can argue for easy at the expence of more time, but not free. You would pay extra upkeep, uprfront cost and reduced jump efficiency.

I don't mean to sound flippant, but you are asserting that I just want free fuel and to go from one point to another as fast as possible which is not true.

I am of the strong opinion that it does not have to be this way, as do many others. I understand it takes work to move the carrier and i clearly respect that if you read my other comments.

Why are you so reluctant to explore other options??

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

Instead of turning refueling into something that is obviously free for your particular role, how about a suggestion that fits with your role without being an obvious copout.

There could be uss's that you need to scan in your fss that appear sporadically around planets with ice rings in deep space. They're rare but perhaps 1 in 25-50 ringed world's will have these signal sources near them. Inside these sources are concentrated tritium ores. You can then collect them for roughly 50 tons of tritium.

That option fits with exploration without making refueling free.

The balance could be tweaked but I'm sure the average ice rings per 500 ly worth of scanning is well in excess of a couple hundred. You should easily come across enough to refuel the 1-2 hundred tons per jump required for topping off after each jump without taking any exploration time away since investigating signals is part of exploration.

I need to refuel not top up my teacup!

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

No, sorry, I'm not the one who's not listening.
Can you explore with the FC? No. You need to get your ship off the dock and fly. Do you need to mine for that? No. Has the FC changed anything on that? No.
Then, you decide to move your FC in another system? You need the fuel. If you are in the bubble, you buy it. If you are outside the bubble, you mine it. That has nothing to do with the exploration task, that has to do with moving a FC.
If you want to explore moving the FC it is your choice. Here it's being asked to do it quickly, easily and for free.

Maybe,just maybe there's a better way,mining can get dull,limiting player movement to mining is about as tedious a method to get about as i can imagine,and you being all zen about it doesn't change that fact,players don't like it and want it to change.

 

[Gpaolo]

Why are you so reluctant to explore other options??

Because I think it's absolutely reasonable as it is.
FC have not changed anything on how the exploration is done. You still have to get your ship, fly, explore, scoop and come back. FC gives you the chance to have a base nearby for operations, and that has to have a price.

 

[Gpaolo]

Maybe,just maybe there's a better way,mining can get dull,limiting player movement to mining is about as tedious a method to get about as i can imagine,and you being all zen about it doesn't change that fact,players don't like it and want it to change.

Mining can get dull, indeed. And exploring can get deadly boring and tedious too.
Which is why being able to combine both is a lot better! Variety of activities!
And still, it looks like none of you is listening to this point: you still have to explore exactly as you were doing before. FC is not your explorer, it's you base.

 

[OldManKnott]

I like the fact there's a bit of a downside to owning a Fleet Carrier, and that's the mining. For me it adds to the game, you have to plan for it, find a bit of Tritium and spend time getting it back to the carrier. It's perfect.

 

[Gpaolo]

I have asked it already previously, but as far as I could see no one has answered.
Why are you using a FC for exploration? What advantage do you have by using it if you want to do only exploration compared to the way you were exploring before?

Considering that when you jump 500LY with the FC you don't explore anything, if I just wanted to explore I would get my exploraconda, I do 500LY in... 8 jumps? Probably quicker than the 15 minutes + 5 minutes cooldown of the FC, plus I can do a FSS of the systems, and I scoop while I fly around the star. And I have done my exploration. No FC needed.

So, why do you want the FC if you just want to explore?

 

[OldManKnott]

I have asked it already previously, but as far as I could see no one has answered.
Why are you using a FC for exploration? What advantage do you have by using it if you want to do only exploration compared to the way you were exploring before?

Considering that when you jump 500LY with the FC you don't explore anything, if I just wanted to explore I would get my exploraconda, I do 500LY in... 8 jumps? Probably quicker than the 15 minutes + 5 minutes cooldown of the FC, plus I can do a FSS of the systems, and I scoop while I fly around the star. And I have done my exploration. No FC needed.

So, why do you want the FC if you just want to explore?

Cartographic data my good man.

 

[Gpaolo]

Cartographic data my good man.

Good. So to make it easier.
And people here are suggesting that you should carry with you a whole base without any drawback?
In this case FC is not a limitation with its refueling, it's just an additional benefit that doesn't affect in any way all the possibilities you already had before.

 

[cheesenbiscuits]

Mining can get dull, indeed. And exploring can get deadly boring and tedious too.
Which is why being able to combine both is a lot better! Variety of activities!
And still, it looks like none of you is listening to this point: you still have to explore exactly as you were doing before. FC is not your explorer, it's you base.

And yet i'll still run out of fuel and find the prospect of grinding so unappealing i'll decommission,is that the sort of game play you want players to experience. Because that sounds broken to me.

 

[yianniv]

The question at this point is, why the hell do you need a FC if the only thing you are interested is flying from a star to another? Just keep doing as you have done until now and stop complaining about one of the few sensible dynamics of the game.

I don't need an FC. I want an FC, and I can think of better ways to enjoy it while I have it. Maybe later, when this skeleton crew that's left behind gets better or bigger, FD will develop more ways to fuel FCs than the good-for-everything method of mining.

I've got almost 22bn. I will get an FC, even with the current fueling methods. I just think FD aimed low again, like they did at the beginning when no UC was included. They just push for as little as possible.

Also, there is nothing sensible about mining from rocks a gas that would normally be found in the upper atmosphere. I'm becoming tired of seeing mining being used as the swiss army knife in E D. "Why the hell" aren't you?

 

[StarLord55]

Good. So to make it easier.
And people here are suggesting that you should carry with you a whole base without any drawback?
In this case FC is not a limitation with its refueling, it's just an additional benefit that doesn't affect in any way all the possibilities you already had before.

I am listening, and I understand your point which has been well aticulated by your posts. An FC is the base, not the exploration vessel. There should be a drawback to moving a base full of ships and facilities. I agree with this.

My argument is that the drawback is time, as it should be. It takes an extreme amount of time to move the carrier, even with a small buff which is my point.

I want to explore with my FC for the same reason you do, to have access to the facilities and ships. A small, passive buff does not eliminate "activities". It does not nullify the need for mining. It just aids players who dont have quite as much time and who do not wish to spend what little time they have mining to move their FC.

Why do you give a damn how I fuel my carrier if the gains of the passive buff are negligable compared to mining? You would run circles around the galaxy before I get to my destination. Im just trying to get to the root of the arguement here. Are you saying that I am not working as hard if I dont mine, therefore I don't deserve to move a miniscule distance compared to what you can achieve?

 

[Cmdr Aeries Hunter]

You comission, beeline straight out into unsettled space, and then decommission because you don't want to source fuel? And someone (who?) forces you to do this?
That does sound pretty masochistic... I'm not sure what you mean with calling it a game loop though. If I ram a star and die, are FD not accounting what unfortunate game loop this creates for navigation? If I constantly press the self destruct button, are FD not accounting for the terrible game loop this has created for UI interaction?

A lot of people, enough to seriously populate empty space atleast, are moving out into empty space. Call them masochists, but they seem to be doing quite well to me. Have you considered that you maybe are not one of these persons? Maybe you should do something else with your fleet carrier. It's a literal mobile base. There are so many possibilities, whenever I read about what different people are planning to do I am baffled. How did I not think of that! etc. And in the worst case you can get pretty much all of your credits back and spend them on something else. Palladium showers! Ludicrous ship builds!

This is part of the problem. People mistake "forcing me to do it" with "unreasonable time to do it". Its not the game loop that is the issue. I like the idea. Its the number of hours needed to mine just to make one jump that is the issue. Just to get back from Beagle point would require (for me) a lifetime (game career) worth of mining just to refuel the carrier. To me that is incredibly unreasonable.

 

[CNC drill press]

A PvP player with a carrier does not need to mine fuel, in fact, they would have to be the most stupid person alive. You would buy it for 4k a ton from a station

Explorers cannot buy fuel in the black - Fact

Saying something false does not make a base for discussion.

Quote my post where i said u can buy fuel in the black.
I kept saying multiple times (but u ignored taht part of my posts) that explorer carrier can fly veeery long until it requires refuelling.
In fact it can travel so far in the black and return that u cannot say fc are (totally) useless for exploration and require mining. ANd such impression i have from your posts.

 

[Nutter]

Quote my post where i said u can buy fuel in the black.
I kept saying multiple times (but u ignored taht part of my posts) that explorer carrier can fly veeery long until it requires refuelling.
In fact it can travel so far in the black and return that u cannot say fc are (totally) useless for exploration and require mining. ANd such impression i have from your posts.

Explorers live in the black, i'm an explorer. I can understand that you may not understand explorers.

I'm speaking from an explorers point of view.

People seem to fixate on distance and speed, I can go 34,000ly? I don't want to be chained to the bubble.

I can get to Colonia in 75mins in my extreme reach Anaconda - Guess what, that is NOT Exploring, that's going to colonia.

I've covered well over 1 million light years exploring and about 300,000ly traveling. So when you say I can go 34,000ly it's a bit of a insult.

o7

 

[CNC drill press]

Explorers live in the black, i'm an explorer. I can understand that you may not understand explorers.

I'm speaking from an explorers point of view.

People seem to fixate on distance and speed, I can go 34,000ly? I don't want to be chained to the bubble.

I can get to Colonia in 75mins in my extreme reach Anaconda - Guess what, that is NOT Exploring, that's going to colonia.

I've covered well over 1 million light years exploring and about 300,000ly traveling. So when you say I can go 34,000ly it's a bit of a insult.

o7

Dont u think u are exagarating when saying 34 ly is an insult? That is 34kLy of moving your personal outpost. Exploring would obviously visiting surrounding systems and returning to carrier only from time to time. So u will cover much more distance than carrier itself. Travelign to every system by carrier doesnt make sense obviously.

Also remember about DSSA - its great thing for explorers, enabled by carriers. Isnt it?

Naturaly i understand what u mean - u just wanna be selfsufficient .

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Just testing out mining.. in a pristine just one hotspot..

• The frequency of laser mining is just right.
• Subsurface things only seem to pop a few chunks?

It seems like a waste of limpet time to only go for beyond mining.

Definitely i could get better in the subsurface accuracy, but it seems so far off what people were reporting before id like to check. Thanks.

 

[Nutter]

Naturaly i understand what u mean - u just wanna be selfsufficient .

Now we are on the same page, I find some great places and wish I had other ships, deep canyons I can race my Courier in, which I can only do with a carrier. Also I can have all my tools for when I find interesting stuff. Mining is doable with a strip miner, but you need a carrier for that too. Thing is the balance is wrong, to keep the carrier in fuel v's exploring. Currently to keep exploring it's 85% mining and 15% Exploring.

o7