Why do people always play the "I can do what I want!!!!" card in these discussions as if people are trying to stop them? What I am saying is that there are consequences to choices. Do whatever you want, just be mindful of what the consequences can be. If you don't like them, change what you do. Its not that complex a concept. Play however you want, in whatever mode you want, with whomever you want. Demanding anonymous internet strangers adjust their mentality or behavior based on your desires is never going to work so such discussions are pointless. Accept it as a given and deal with it as you please.
Why I and many others will rarely play open
- Thread starter vanishboy
- Start date
The terminology between Griefers, Gankers, seal clubbers etc. has muddied somewhat - I'd argue that perhaps ganking is often a subset of griefing. Certainly, in the context of what we've discussing here it would be.
But point taken.
It's muddied because people on the forums us all three terms interchangeably.
Not just here, to be fair. In my defence, I've rarely seen a gank that wasn't also griefing.
I've seen a lot of griefing that isn't ganking. The Venn Diagram has a lot more overlap one way than the other!
Not just here, to be fair. In my defence, I've rarely seen a gank that wasn't also griefing.
I've seen a lot of griefing that isn't ganking. The Venn Diagram has a lot more overlap one way than the other!
Well as long as humans exist and online games exist griefing, ganking and seal clubbing will happen.
Not sure why OP needed to tell people why they don't open unless they think its within Frontiers gift so clamp down on what amounts to basic human nature.
In ED that is minor nuisance anyway - what can I loose - 5% of my ship's value, eventually some cargo, failed missions, and a small amount of time - that's it, no biggy. But that doesn't change my assessment of the attitude of gankers. It doesn't matter to me, if I loose pretty much nothing or a lot. I'm playing EVE, I can deal with loosing a lot, even I haven't - 2 ships in 13 years and both losses would have been avoidable, it was my own fault. I never got killed so far, but it will happen and when it will happen, it will most likely be my fault as well, being too overconfident or careless - that is the weak point, myself. When I play EVE, I get ganking attempts several times a week, but I have quite good ships and know my way around, someone who wants to kill me, will have to know very well what he is doing - and he will get a "good fight" from me for achieving it.
So, because some people will be abusive, we should just accept that abuse happens?
This is a very similar discussion to one you'll find in art philosophy classes. Lies the value of art in the work itself, or in the intentions/mindset of the creator. You argue the latter, I argue the former.
Lets say I am attacked by someone. I am flying my little Adder in some backwater system, and suddenly some FDL swoops in and attacks me. I hiwake or die, it doesnt matter here. Should I be upset I was griefed? Was this FDL out to upset me? Or did he try to prevent trade in a system for RP or BGS reasons? Maybe he just dislikes Adders. I cannot tell you why he did what he did, only what it is he did.
With your mentality I am supposed to change my appreciation of this exact event if I later find out the FDL was or was not a 'griefer'. To me that makes no sense. Even more so when you realise that you 1) generally have no real insight into why the other person attacked, 2)people hate being griefed and 3) automatically assume it was a griefer.
In that sense, people grief themselves by making up stories in their mind as to what some other gamer may or may not have thought and then get upset about what they just imagined. It makes no sense to me. To me, griefers are like Borg, or Reavers, or Raiders or whatever you have in sci-fi. They are a threat, and I have to deal with it. I am not going to ponder their deepest innermost thoughts, and whatever they turn out to be isn't going to influence my actions or appreciation of what happened.
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If this "abuse" is against the games ToS then report it.
.... Urban dead didn't have NPCs. It was purely factional PvP.
Don't tell me you're one of those people who complained on the wiki about being griefed by zombies?
To quote a wise man from other similar thread:
And everybody, repeat after me, please.
The name of the game is:
Elite.......... DANGEROUS !!!
Now you
You do realise these two statements are hypocrisy and contradictory right?
The 'consequences' are other players demanding you change your ship, your outfitting or your mode or 'git gud' and fight back to suit their game style.
It is pointless to try and discuss with someone who cant see the other persons POV though, the discussion should be whether they agree with it or not but you cant do that with people who cant even see it or acknowledge it is another persons POV and there is more than one POV.
Gankers - part of the game and to some POV they add imaginary 'danger' and 'risk', to another persons POV they are tedious as has been pointed out many times only noobs get ganked successfully, experienced players just get away and its just tedious repetitive behaviour
Griefers - toxic to any community and game because they try and destroy the game itself
Pirates - neither of the above and my POV is they add gameplay and an experience, to another POV they hate it and class it as ganking
Maybe you could try and read my post and understand my point about a group of people coming onto a game with the sole intention of making others quit? And this isn't second guessing their intentions, this from being able to see their posts on the SA forums - and it wasn't just UD they were doing this to, any game there's a Goon Squad, it was largely for the same reason.
The in game PVP and interactions and alliances made and broken with other player groups in Urban Dead, was not an issue - and I certainly enjoyed my days bananagangbanging around as a zombie as much as being a survivor.
So no, I wasn't on the wiki complaining about being griefed by zombies.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Yet, from time to time, when lawful players seek out and destroy particular gankers the complaints of harassment start - seemingly expecting the lawfuls to abide by some form of rules of engagement when the ganker does no such thing....
Err, no? You do what you want, all your actions have consequences and some actions have slim to no chance of success. Deal with it. Interestingly, the people who are most upset about 'griefers' struggle the most with this extremely obvious and simple truth. Makes sense: the less responsibility you take for your own actions the bigger the problem of 'griefing' becomes in ED. And that too is a consequence of one's own actions.
Err, no? Griefers dont demand you change your ship or do anything. Feel more than welcome to be as poorly prepared and unskilled as you want, griefers truly won't mind at all. And pretty much nobody argued even for a second you should 'fight back', anyone giving advice here argues the opposite.
Again: do what you want. Just accept that some actions are more likely to lead to your ship going poof than others. And do with that information as you want as well. If you are the kind of person that gets Very Upset when someone makes your ship go poof, I suggest you don't go unprepared and underskilled near people who want to make your ship go poof. But feel free to disagree and do it anyway, thats cool too!
Deleted member 182079
D
Precisely my experience as well.
I do spend a lot of time in my iCourier - it's the most gank proof ship I have (decent shields, and fast) while keeping its utility - can use it as a planet lander (SRV bay fitted), mat gatherer (8t cargo + 1A collector limpet), bubble jumper (35LY and 3A fuel scoop fitted) and light combat ship that I've used in CG RES and even CZs alike in the past (3x size 2 HP's can do decent damage and allow for some flexibility also). The only ships that can catch it are other Couriers & Vipers, but they won't have the firepower and ToT to even drop my shields.
Number of rebuys: 1 - because while chasing after a ganker at Deciat I accidentally boosted into a cliff
. It's pretty much untouchable, and a joy to fly. As a result, nobody interdicts me except for noob gankers perhaps, and they'll get bored soon enough.932m/s Viper 3 similarly although that one is more risky as it's barely made up of paper even. Exciting to fly around in the danger zone though.
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Yeah it is all about the intention behind it - are they going for some gankers or do they want to ruin the game play of a specific player - the former is ok, the latter eventually not.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Which makes any kind of player response to gankers susceptible to claims of harassment - those seeking out gankers have specific targets to watch out for; the gankers shoot down random ships as and when they feel like it.