Clipper, Mamba.
New ship: Gutamaya Corsair
- Thread starter Rubbernuke
- Start date
Clipper, Mamba.
The Corsair being as fast and agile as the Clipper was an out of context fabricated expectation. Frontier didn't say that. Partners didn't say and show that - the partner previews I saw showed the Corsair at 600 max.
Frontier said it was fast. It is. Frontier said it was agile. It is debatable if this is true without context, but if you compare a multirole Krait with a multirole Corsair build, it is pretty much as agile. While carrying twice the cargo. Of course it is compared to the Clipper, because it is the Gutamaya medium the Clipper should be. But all the Clipper brings to the table is speed and agility. Everything else basically sucks compared to the Corsair. Latching onto the (in a comparable multirole build miniscule) speed difference is... I don't know what it is.
As I understand it, the one thing you can't do with the Corsair is minmax it. Because it comes minmaxed stock.
They said it’s a successor to it and compared it to the clipper. It certainly doesn’t compare to the clipper’s agility, not even close, so maybe that leaves the clipper’s speed? How else do you compare it to something that’s unique to the clipper?
A hair over 600 with full cargo holds or in full battle dress.
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A “punch ships in the face” kind of build.
The large and two mediums on top converge beautifully and can hit the same module target easily. The beam is used between volleys to bring the heat down. The multicannons are added to the beam when shields are down so you can pick off small ships that aren’t worth the effort to hit with projectiles.
Other have mentioned this, but I believe the gripe (besides the obvious silliness of the hardpoint and the mass lock which should be fixed) is that it’s kind of badly designed.
By that I mean that they put obvious, gamey limits on the ship that are very easy to reach so they just stand out like a sore thumb. Other ships allow for various designs and depending on the design you make you see a different performance and you get a different gameplay. This ship is fake-limited in such a way that the only thing that make sense to do with it is pack it with a heavy build because you don’t get any benefits to building anything light.
Every sensor for example is going to be A rated long range because you get nothing for making it D rated or light weight.
Every hull is going to be heavy duty because you don’t get any extra speed or agility for doing light weight. It’s just really stuck like that.
By that I mean that they put obvious, gamey limits on the ship that are very easy to reach so they just stand out like a sore thumb. Other ships allow for various designs and depending on the design you make you see a different performance and you get a different gameplay. This ship is fake-limited in such a way that the only thing that make sense to do with it is pack it with a heavy build because you don’t get any benefits to building anything light.
Every sensor for example is going to be A rated long range because you get nothing for making it D rated or light weight.
Every hull is going to be heavy duty because you don’t get any extra speed or agility for doing light weight. It’s just really stuck like that.
Not the Viper III, but the Viper IV. The Clipper is (still) the fastest non-small ship in the game with a max boost of 605-ish when fully engineered, and out-corners the Viper IV and everything less nimble than that. FDEV didn't say this would be better per se, they said it would have plenty of speed and agility and be considered the Clipper's successor. We read what we wanted to into that, since we've been wanting the Clipper to be medium all along, to think this would be a power-crept, medium Clipper. It isn't. It almost matches the speed, and corners better than its competitors, but not like its predecessor.
EDIT-- sorry, page of responses I didn't see.
Sigh... so I rewatched the FU segment.
Some quotes and paraphrases from that section, all from Zac except where noted:
- "It is a medium multirole ship"
- "It is a next generation ship [...] and somewhat better [than the other ships]"
- "The Corsair really is a successor to the Clipper"
- "definitely superiour to the original Python"
- "if you really just take what you really like about that original Python, it's basically that but with better firepower, cargo capacity, jump range"
- "It is the first medium Gutamaya ship"
- "first medium ship with size 7 thrusters, so pretty speedy, it's pretty fast"
- "It does inherit that low drift flight model of the Clipper, so even if you don't engineer it it feels like it is on rails"
- "this looks like a ship I'd like to see hooning through canyons" (Arf)
- "suitable for all pillars of play"
- "it is better than the original stock Python" (Arf)
Make of that what you will. I heard it way more compared to the Python than the Clipper except the flight model, which I cannot comment on (edit: Specifically the drift part).
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Again with a late reply.
Mine boost 598-599 and weighs in somewhere between 900 and 950 tons (Can't remember exactly). Can't coax it to 600 with a second boost.
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Actually, they said it was nearly as fast as the clipper. And honestly, it's speed is fine. I was expecting faster. My point is the agility, where they kept talking about it flying on rails and being great for Canyon running. More below...
To continue, this is is the problem. People heard that sales pitch and translated it to the terms were used to for these ships (pitch/roll/top speed). It's pitch rate is .5 degrees better than a Krait MK II. However... that isn't the whole story. This is where the "flight on rails" and vertical thrust come in. Because it has nearly no drift, and that incredible vertical thrust, you can use other tricks to outmaneuver foes. I'm better at getting on an enemies six in this ship than in my Python Mk 2.
So yes it's a good ship, with very different properties than anything we've seen before. So while the ship can live up to most of the hype, you have to know how to get it there... because it flies different.
Also, this is one of the first ships I've seen where the convergence is good and fixed weapon people are happy, but the firing arcs aren't great, so gimballed weapon users are seeing under performance. And some are having issues with missiles from the bottom C2 hitting the hull.
Summation: The ads were misleading, but not dishonest. This ship is very fast (but not as fast as the clipper). It is very maneuverable because of the zero drift, yet the low pitch rate leads people to think it's a brick until they realize how to utilize the vertical thrust and low drift to maximize the corsair's potential. Also, it doesn't help the some streamers - I specifically remember Cmdr Mechan - stating that this ship pitched much better than the Krait MK II. In reality, it does when you factor in using the vertical thrust in your turn. But in pure, standard pitch rate values... half a degree isn't "much better' in anyone's book.
Ok, I think I've said all I need to say on this. I hope they add 2 or 3 degrees to the pitch, but I'll be fine if they don't. I really hope they fix the problem with missiles from the bottom point smacking the ship.
In addition to that, they said it's the first medium ship with class 7 thrusters. The player may be at fault for expecting logic after all this time, but in our defense FD sometimes provides it.
No, they didn't. Not on stream (see above). If elsewhere, provide a source.
To reinforce: They talk about a "high boost speed". 600 is a high boost speed. It is at 12:07 in the Corsair segment above. That's the only mention of the boost speed, unless I missed one (which is possible).
Conclusion: Don't trust ship salesmen. 
DuhConclusion: Don't trust ship salesmen.
This did surprise me. A lot. Pitch into the enemy with vertical thrust, and the NPC AI can't cope.
This thread is getting long to go through all these posts...
I hope the OP will take responsibility and write a nice summary on the first page
I hope the OP will take responsibility and write a nice summary on the first page
Ok, fine, they didn't say it was as fast as the Cliiper. That doesn't really matter for me, since as far as I'm concerned it's close enough: 470 cruising, and 600 boost. My contention was all the comments about the maneuverability, which you did list in your summation.
I have seen this as one of the major complaints.
I can't really comment on that because I have yet to fly it. How is the drifting and the vertical assisted turning of the Corsair?