The Planetary landing and planetside missions discussion Thread

[Lobstris]

Actually I did play the previous 2 games. And for me landing on planets got old pretty quick. Like I said, it was no different from being on a station. 10/10 for eye-candy, 0/10 for meaningful gameplay.

<Stares mournfully at MS FlightSim, FFE and Space Engine> Sorry guys, I've got to let you go. Someone on the internet gave you 0/10 for gameplay...

 

[ZeeWolf]

Don't I remember reading that when FD model a ship, they also do the interior as well, as a form of 'future proofing'? Or did I dream it?

If they do, it'd be on a very superficial level. They certainly have rendered some of the detail around the cockpit such as the lift in the Type 9. I really can't imagine they would need to render that kind of detail for every room just to get the ship in the game (it certainly isn't in the model files people have exported) so if they have - it would exist internally. I just can't imagine any logical reason they would put in the effort to render those assets in that kind of detail just yet.

However, it's not just the assets. It's the game logic that would have to be added. Hit boxes, animations and interactions with each room. It's a massive amount of work to undertake. Not to mention the complexities with adding first person movement mechanics, new control schemes etc.

Planets, I imagine, start of as height fields. Detailed height fields sure, but height fields are not difficult. Then there is a bunch of challenges around scaling, texture loading whatever. Altering the ship handling to cope with gravity perhaps, maybe add some assets to build outposts and features (much like the stations we already have). Weather effects, new sound profiles... I can imagine lots of challenges but nowhere near the ridiculous amount that adding FPS is going to bring. Planets feel like an expansion to the framework already in the game to me. FPS feels like a new game.

 

[Rubbernuke]

I like the idea of having to approach at the correct trajectory sadly I think there is utterly ZERO chance of that being added as the moans of people who destroyed their ship entering the atmosphere would melt the forums. So it's going to have to be dumbed down so you just fly at the planet I guess.

I would like it to be graphically similar to interdiction, in that you have an escape vector style indicator for your destination, and if you wander you heat up....until you pop.

 

[StoneFeet]

The Gamescom announcement must be one of these!

 

[Obsidian Ant]

Planetary Landings - Why Should I want it? (Here's a few reasons...)

Spoiler

[video=youtube;bGVEAH07Td0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGVEAH07Td0[/video]

Planetary landings are the thing I have been most excited about for Elite. A lot of the stuff in the video is way into the future - as planetary landing will be released in stages (probably multiple expansions). But some of those things will almost certainly be in for initial release. Can't wait!

 

[Coolgroove]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGVEAH07Td0
Planetary landings are the thing I have been most excited about for Elite. A lot of the stuff in the video is way into the future - as planetary landing will be released in stages (probably multiple expansions). But some of those things will almost certainly be in for initial release. Can't wait!

Can't wait! And very excited! Nice video!
Owww, it would be so great to fly in from space down to the surface, then into a canyon and then past the mountains... with incredible sounds from ED audio team! WoW!

 

[PiLhEaD]

Good list +1

The only element I'm not bothered about is walking around in ships, mostly because there would have to be so much additional 'First Person' content built up and around into Elite to make this element enjoyable and of real merit. I'd be concerned that this would dilute the Elite '(wo)man in a ship' ethos, and undermine the game's core appeal.

I think planetary landings give the opportunity to really flesh-out exploration - e.g. detailed planetary scanning gives a number (zero or more) 'sites of special interest' that require you to land/enter the atmosphere and sample the soil/rock/gas. If they can get working weather per environment, then this element could be epic as you ride through storm clouds down to your SSI, or fly blind bouncing through a gas giant heading for the SSI.

As for Thargoids, be very afraid... David Braben has said "I want them to be as terrifying and as alien as we can make them"...

 

[STRONTIUM DOG]

excellent hopes there and very well presented, regarding landing on gas giants would have thought the gravity would be in escapable much like a singularity what with mass lock
Goldie locks size planets & moons should be primary goals and thrust to weight ratios considered due to escape velocity requirements(keeping the science in fiction)
frontier 2 had thrust to g ratios back then see last pages http://www.lemonamiga.com/games/docs.php?id=679
elite print an cut trump cards based on those statistics with Mobius art would be just the ticket
for lavecon type events

 

[[VR] Deggial]

It is already confirmed that landing on gas giants will never be possible as the super dense lower atmosphere would simply crush your spaceship (a vehicle created for zero atmosphere).

But entering the upper atmosphere will definitely be possible and I am looking forward to stunning visuals and exiting new gameplay experiences!

What I am especially hoping for is, that all these small ships (up to the Cobra, but especially the Eagle variantes) will have an edge when it comes to atmospheric flight. This would give all the commanders in their "end game" (I know, I know!) a reason to mount the small, nimble ships and descent into the rough and shaking tides of all this aeriform matter enveloping these celestial bodies.
I mean... do you really want to try landing with a behemoth like the Anaconda? Hey, switch to your dinghy and use this for landing! Because, honestly, this is the main reason why a small ship docking at a larger one would make sense. Without doubt, it isn't for being superior in space-fighting! But maybe they will be superior athmospheric fighters! I would love this!

 

[lysan]

This is a must have, we need it now!

 

[STRONTIUM DOG]

if I had a "precious" landings would top it
"i only wish to Land a fish so juicy sweet"

 

[Steph]

I wasn't bothered about planetary landings until I bought a DK2 - now the thought of atmospheric entry [after the first pass planets with no atmospheres etc] is something that I am very much looking forward to seeing.

 

[StuartGT]

Planetary Landings ~ what we know (and don't) so far of the eagerly awaited expansion

Spoiler

I posted this information collection on the ED Reddit late Friday, there are some great comments including a novel use of an Orca...

Seamless planetary landings (PLandings™ from now on) were a fantastic feature in the previous two Elites:

• Frontier: Elite II (footage courtesy of FA-Off Storytelling Legend Isinona)
• Frontier: First Encounters (footage courtesy of space fan Scott Manley)

Simply put, with Atmospheric Shielding fitted to your ship you could fly from space, down through and around a planet's atmosphere, and land practically anywhere, stations being the preferred locations. Like the galaxy, all the planetary surfaces' were procedurally generated, mountains, cities, etc.

Spoiler

Pubquiz Fact: Frontier Elite II was developed entirely by David Braben himself, all 250k lines of assembler code, and released on a single floppy disk...

Now onto the stuff we know as described by the FDev team...


Described as a key expansion in the ED Kickstarter, under Future Plans:

The initial release of Elite: Dangerous doesn't mark the end of development. We intend to continue expanding the game both with new content and new features. A good example of this is planetary landings. We have an ambitious goal for landings to include new gameplay and a rich variety of worlds to explore. To achieve our goal we want the planets to come to life. We also want to add leaving the ships so you can explore space stations or board enemy vessels or even just to look around your own.
The main reason for treating these as expansions is so we can approach these with the proper development resources that we require to do them well. We don't plan or desire to just tick a box, we want to make these additions something significant.

Really big expansions are likely to be paid for while we also intend for some smaller free updates. If you have pledged to to £80 tier or above you will receive all expansions for free.

David Braben discusses PLandings in the Elite Dangerous Development Plan video (at 1m11s):
[video=youtube_share;EM0Gcl7iUM8]https://youtu.be/EM0Gcl7iUM8?t=1m11s[/video]
PLanding features will include: cities, animals, trees, plants, hunting animals.


Ashley, Sandy & Michael Brookes' comments on the expansion back in April 2013:

Ashley: There are of course some updates that we have already announced will be coming. The most notable and anticipated of these is of course seamless planetary landings. Whilst it wouldn’t be sharing anything new with you to confirm this feature post-launch, I can confirm that we hope to implement it within a year of release, if possible

Sandy: Definitely yes. Hopefully (barring issues) within the first year post-release

Michael: Yes, we’ll be looking to add landings in updates after the game’s intial release. We’ll provide more details nearer the time.

David Braben's responses to PLandings development queries in the June 2014 Q&A:

DevonX: I am very interested to hear more about the planetary landing. What is planned? How much detail will there be on the planets? Are they going to be limited in any way?

Planetary landings won't be a single thing. I think I've said before - it is what is down there that makes planetary landings compelling - and please remember all of this will be after first release of the game.

I imagine we will start with landings on airless moons. You would be able to see heavy industry, craters up close, and ultimately be able to deposit things on the surface (stash cargo or mining machines). Atmospheric worlds are a bigger challenge - whether rocky or gas giant in nature - and a key element there is the atmosphere. They should have rich cloudscapes with lightning, turbulence etc.

The biggest challenge is with what we call 'outdoor worlds'. I would want rich and varied vegetation, wildlife, and so on.

Granite: How much of a technical challenge do you think planetary landings will be?

The landings themselves are not the technical issue, it is the vast size of planets, and the prodigious amount of content required to make them interesting. We can generate the landscapes procedurally, but you need interesting things there to make them compelling.

Granite's question and a trimmed version of David's answer was also posted in the Nov 2014 Q&A.


Newsletter 32 (with lots of artwork/screenshots):

But that won’t stop development. We plan to continue to significantly enhance the game via further expansions after the launch date, using the same incremental development philosophy that we’ve used so far.

Major new features will include planetary landings and even walking around inside ships, stations, and planet surfaces with time.

For those who have a Lifetime Expansion Pass (included in Premium Beta and Alpha, and also still available here until 29th July 2014) all such significant expansion will be included. Those without the Lifetime Expansion Pass will be charged for each expansion as they are released.

We have made no secret that our ultimate ambition is to be able to land on the surface of planets, as you were able to in the other Elite sequels Frontier and Frontier: First Encounters.

We want this feature to push the boundaries as we believe we are doing in other areas of Elite: Dangerous already, like space flight, combat, trading, sound, online, visual fidelity etc.

That means rich, varied experiences. Not just landing pads, but rich content on the surfaces, surface vehicles, the ability to stash things there, to explore. Clearly ‘doing it right’ like this will take time, but we have a plan and will get there via a series of meaningful releases.

We believe that each stage will be incredible, and the result truly breathtaking. What you will see on the worlds will be a mix of procedurally generated content, particularly the landscapes, cloudscapes, compositions and so on, mixed with hand-crafted elements.

Eurogamer's interview with David Braben on ED, March 2015:

I would like to see me building on it forever. For a very long time. There is so much more we can do, that I've already talked about - we've talked about landing on planets, walking around inside your spaceship, ship to ship boarding, all of those things. We've also said we'd have free updates, and paid for updates. It's all very exciting!

Art Director Jon Bottone in Newsletter 83:

All our planets are built using a sophisticated simulation so that one day you can get close to them. Really close. Right now every planet can only be observed from afar, but Elite: Dangerous is designed for the future, and by sticking to the simulation and constantly improving it to make it as real as possible, we can be sure the canyons and mountains you see from space will accurately be reflected when you skim close to the surface, or even land upon it.

I'll add more stuff to this as I find it. /u/SpyTec13 (Spytec on ED forum) feel free to copy relevant stuff to the ED Wikia


Summary of PLandings™ key facts:

• When FDev discuss ED's expansions, it's predominantly mentioned first/only
• Paid for DLC, like all expansions
• Free to KS/early backers who purchased the Lifetime Expansion Pass
• Release approximately 1yr after ED's release
• Being developed and released in stages: dead planets/moons, planets with atmosphere, planets with life
• Landing pads, rich content, surface vehicles, ability to stash things
• Combination of procedurally generated content, landscapes, cloudscapes, compositions, etc, mixed with hand-crafted elements

Speculation & Questions about PLandings:

• Beta access available to beta-backers with Lifetime Expansion Pass? (very high chance)
• Beta access available to beta-backers if they pre-order it? (high chance)
• New missions incoming e.g. photographing colony sites, bombing structures?
• Dramatically different atmospheric flying abilities of ships?
• Gated in-game via Atmospheric Shielding ship module - ships without one will burn up in plantary atmosphere as in FE2 & FFE?
• Big announcement and demo at Gamescom??
• Release of the first stage between late 2015 and early 2016?

 

[Si Waters]

The big announcement isn't going to be planetary landings, its going to be something to do with missions and NPC overhauls.

My opinion, of course.

 

[Kirk-Fu]

Hah, PL in the first year. I'm almost hoping they delay it, because it'll be another few bones to throw on the distinctly meat-less pile, but we know what they're like with deadlines. Especially as this is a paid expansion, they really need to make sure it adds content and lots of it, otherwise nobody's going to fork up for it. I know I'll certainly be waiting to see what it looks like in detail before I go near it.

Also, "stashing" things on a planet's surface. Why, that almost sounds like commodity storage! The heresy! :O

 

[Obsidian Ant]

This is a must have, we need it now!

Can't come soon enough. Maybe this year, maybe announced at Gamescom.

Then again, I would be pretty happy if anything from the first post is announced at Gamescom.

 

[Kirk-Fu]

Oh my god, those concept art images. Particularly the one flying through a city with rain splashing off the canopy. Why can't the real game look more like those

 

[Ziljan]

If it's a paid DLC, I hope FD does another kickstarter. I regret that I didn't know ED was released until it was on steam, so I was never able to support them as a backer. Maybe they don't need the money any more, or are trying to keep their team size down to a sustainable level. The team looks pretty large already in the latest pic which is a very good sign.

 

[StuartGT]

The team looks pretty large already in the latest pic which is a very good sign.

Latest pic?

FDev had a little over 300 staff at Christmas, with well over 100 at that point working on Elite - which is now larger as stated in the latest Newsletter.

 

[Derthek]

My prediction for planetary landings :
As with all new implementations there will be a myriad of bugs. Some will be patched, others left in for months.

Some of you will cry out to the devs:
"Please! Every time I land on an ice planet I get <insert bug here > please fix before adding new content!"

And they will simply reply:
"Sorry m8, Sony wants an easy bake oven module exclusive for ps4 to a peal to the under 13 female demographic. we'll get to it later though we promise "

and you can then join the rest of us begging for fixes before new content