Changes to the 15 second exit-in-danger menu timer? [Poll]

[Jpotter]

Increase it absolutely: it should be impossible to quit during combat without suffering ship loss

Bottom line you shouldn't be allowed to quit during combat when engaged in multiplayer. If they quit, fine, but the result should be insta-death/explosion credit awarded to attacker - not disappearing from the instance to live another day. The fact FD stands behind the current timer as 'legit' causes more exploitation IMO.

IMO these opinions of FD take away from the FUN of the game:
*Being beat fair an square in a battle you committed to - and COMBAT LOGGING (save/exit is combat logging if you are in a battle, I don't care what FD says about that THEY ARE WRONG) - legit says FD
*Robigo run and security almost has a scan of you, just quit to desktop relog. - legit
*Uh-oh, interdiction you dont' want to fight - quit to desktop. - legit
*Oh noes!!!! I jumped into the sun; quit to desktop - you'll be placed safely away. - legit
*Someone waiting/blockade outside a community goal station - undock (stay in the station) and quit to main menu, relog. Your instantly transported out of the station 20km away and can avoid blockade - legit

FD - do you realize how dumb the game becomes when you can avoid all consequences. I haven't died in this game unless pure accident (hitting planet surface, SRV deaths) in MONTHS. And that death was a pure combat accident where I rammed another ship with no shields/low hull. I can't remember the last time I legitimately died in combat. I can high wake any PvP encounter when things go South.

It's waaaayyy tooo easy to escape with in-game mechanics (high waking already completely negates any mass lock, the only way you DON'T escape is if you commit to a fight) let alone the all applicable 'EASY OUT' option for crybabies with being able to save/quit. It's a game - give us some risk/reward for .... sake.

 

[CMDR Vorox97]

I would have to say keep it where it is and allow us to preselect yes. As a volunteer firefighter not being able to do results In me having to end the task because I am not able to wait those 15 seconds during a call.

 

[Whiterose]

Increase it. People need to man up and accept defeat when they are up against a better pilot. Rule 1: there is always somebody better than you. Or alternatively, accept defeat and do a Sir Robin.

 

[frostypaw]

No.. that's not how languages work.. And the phrase "combat logging" is used widely..

That's precisely how languages work - they use some words to describe a concept. You get the wrong idea so they change the wording to more clearly define the concept.

You have no control whatsoever over the concept or right to define it - it's their game.

 

[Nerwan]

When you legitimately quit the game e.g. to menu, a quick snapshot of your game should be sent. This should be less than 100kb.

There should then be a much longer timer - maybe 2 minutes.

If a player genuinely loses his/her internet connection, the snapshot would support that case and he/she could contact support.

This is an issue that many players clearly worry about, and FD seem absolutely blind to. It would take a quick meeting and a day's coding to implement.

Not as simple as that sadly.. because it isn't possible for a PC to know why it lost it's internet connection. Did the user pull a cable or did the ISP have a problem...

 

[TiberiusKirk]

This. I don't get all the kerfuffle about the timer. The only change they can make that'll impact the face of the game is to remove it so people can do a "legit CL", which I for one would find painful.

But the timer is crucial! It means that if you jump out, you are still under attack. How can the timer not be important?

 

[Bostlabs]

Keep it as is.

I just don't see a need to change it any longer. I didn't see a need to have the timer in the first place.

 

[frostypaw]

IIRC it takes 5 secs to jump to supercruise (low wake), subject to mass lock. It takes 15 secs to charge for a system Jump (high wake). I presume the 15 sec timer to log out via the menu is based on this.

It could take a little longer to high wake if you have to first select a system from the left menu, you can align with it while the FSD charges.

I'd have to disagree that only those affected should have a say, surely anyone in open is fair game to be interdicted (whether they like it or not), and anyone not in open is currently being encouraged to do so. So this potentially affects all players, and they should have a say in it.

bingo, just automate this.

 

[StiTch]

When you legitimately quit the game e.g. to menu, a quick snapshot of your game should be sent. This should be less than 10kb if it simply reports location, and whether under attack.

There should then be a much longer timer - maybe 2 minutes.

If a player genuinely loses his/her internet connection, the snapshot would support that case and he/she could contact support.

This is an issue that many players clearly worry about, and FD seem absolutely blind to. It would take a quick meeting and a day's coding to implement.

Let me just read that back...

If you legitimately lose your connection...it sends a screenshot to...

 

[TiberiusKirk]

Not as simple as that sadly.. because it isn't possible for a PC to know why it lost it's internet connection. Did the user pull a cable or did the ISP have a problem...

No. Elite is constantly communicating with the server, all it needs to know is whether you are under attack and your location. Those data packets are very small. FD could implement that.

(Why don't they implement it? The reason is that they have scant concern for players of the game. Sorry to say that, but it is pretty obvious by now.)

 

[Nerwan]

That's precisely how languages work - they use some words to describe a concept. You get the wrong idea so they change the wording to more clearly define the concept.

You have no control whatsoever over the concept or right to define it - it's their game.

If Frontier said that they wanted to use the term "kill" in the game to mean something other that how it's normally understood would that be ok? Languages evolve by group think and word meanings slowly gain acceptance by communities until they're eventually codified in dictionaries. "Combat logging" or to give it it's uncontracted meaning "Logging out during combat" already has a well defined meaning which frontier cannot change any more than they can change "kill". What they may of course do is define rules as to what form of "Combat logging" they consider acceptable according to the rules they have the power to enforce.

 

[Thetele]

Increase it absolutely: it should be impossible to quit during combat without suffering ship loss.

I voted for this as its the best option of given in poll.

I would suggest that they keep the 15 s timer but it gets reset every time shot is fired in instance (weapon, scanner or limpet) or if you take damage. So even if the shot doesn't hit the one that want to combat log it reset timer to 15 s. This would be good middle ground.

If i could choose it i would make it that if there is two or more CMDRs in same instance and those aren't in same wing. Logging out via menu would be impossible or that it send request to other CMDR to allow other one to log off and he could say no, so logging would be denied. The only exception would be station instances.

 

[Cosmos]

Elite: Care Bear... .

Did I just see someone saying they want to preactivate the 'yes' option during the countdown... in case of emergency, like their wife calling them? You're wife can wait fifteen seconds mate... and if she can't you should reorder your list of priorities so that losing a space ship in a computer game isn't a big deal.

This game is being ruined by care bears.

Indeed. Yet Frontier have crafted themselves an echo chamber here through their various forum and moderation policies. I think its worth raising the possibility that its actually Frontier who are the carebears. Naturally, they've attracted a certain following. I say this based upon years of observation and how almost all consequences in game are avoidable and historic statements on 'griefing' and pvp etc.. Sadly, I think we are fighting a battle that can't be won.

The game is a treadmil for special snowflakes. It offers zero jeopardy, everything is optional, and avoidable. Have any problems? No worries, FD will molleycoddle you so you can 'enjoy the game'. Its nauseating, the game often feels like I'm being read a bed time story.

I mean look at this poll.. The vast majority of players use Open yet Frontier continues to cater heavily towards the solo and private groupers.. Talk about being totally out of touch.

https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/4kw6r9/elite_dangerous_game_mode_survey/

 

[frostypaw]

What they may of course do is define rules as to what form of "Combat logging" they consider acceptable according to the rules they have the power to enforce.

:thumbsup: we got there. now if people keep complaining then they might clarify that with extra terms such as 'graceful exit' which they have - but we're still here arguing over whether they get to define their own rules :/

 

[Bostlabs]

Let me just read that back...

If you legitimately lose your connection...it sends a screenshot to...

Bears repeating.

LOL!

 

[Varrag]

I am not quite getting something here. So, ED is based on p2p network; alright.

However, to be honest this is my first online game I've played which was built on such premise. Other games I was/am playing, like for example EVE, Mortal Online, World of Tanks etc have central server which tracks the players all the time, and can keep their character/ship/tank/whatever in the game for as long as the devs want: ALT/F4, cut the cable, your computer explodes... it doesn't matter - you will stay where you were, basically.

With p2p this seems to be impossible. Is there any other p2p game which actually managed to solve the issue of combat logging?

 

[Kyokushin]

Increase it absolutely: it should be impossible to quit during combat without suffering ship loss

Bottom line you shouldn't be allowed to quit during combat when engaged in multiplayer. If they quit, fine, but the result should be insta-death/explosion credit awarded to attacker - not disappearing from the instance to live another day. The fact FD stands behind the current timer as 'legit' causes more exploitation IMO.

IMO these opinions of FD take away from the FUN of the game:
*Being beat fair an square in a battle you committed to - and COMBAT LOGGING (save/exit is combat logging if you are in a battle, I don't care what FD says about that THEY ARE WRONG) - legit says FD
*Robigo run and security almost has a scan of you, just quit to desktop relog. - legit
*Uh-oh, interdiction you dont' want to fight - quit to desktop. - legit
*Oh noes!!!! I jumped into the sun; quit to desktop - you'll be placed safely away. - legit
*Someone waiting/blockade outside a community goal station - undock (stay in the station) and quit to main menu, relog. Your instantly transported out of the station 20km away and can avoid blockade - legit

FD - do you realize how dumb the game becomes when you can avoid all consequences. I haven't died in this game unless pure accident (hitting planet surface, SRV deaths) in MONTHS. And that death was a pure combat accident where I rammed another ship with no shields/low hull. I can't remember the last time I legitimately died in combat. I can high wake any PvP encounter when things go South.

It's waaaayyy tooo easy to escape with in-game mechanics (high waking already completely negates any mass lock, the only way you DON'T escape is if you commit to a fight) let alone the all applicable 'EASY OUT' option for crybabies with being able to save/quit. It's a game - give us some risk/reward for .... sake.

Exactly this is not a game about starships, but about relogging.
Everything you can workaround by reloging. Sad. This is just dumb.

 

[Nerwan]

:thumbsup: we got there. now if people keep complaining then they might clarify that with extra terms such as 'graceful exit' which they have - but we're still here arguing over whether they get to define their own rules :/

I think most acknowledge that Frontier have the right to define their own rules, however many would seek to influence those rules ;-) That's all part of being a gaming community I guess :-D

 

[Jpotter]

I would have to say keep it where it is and allow us to preselect yes. As a volunteer firefighter not being able to do results In me having to end the task because I am not able to wait those 15 seconds during a call.

This would only apply in combat - and as is, ending task is not what we are discussing - that is combat logging and reason for FD to ban your account if you do that in PvP encounters, regardless of your job or commitments (not trying to sound harsh, do appreciate what you do!!).

But I really think the above comment is 'smoke and mirrors' - this argument has been raised before. If something serious happens you aren't going to wait for ANY timer, regardless of the game (unless you have mental problems and your priorities revolve around gaming). And if it really did happen and the consequences are bad, I'm sure a ticket to FD would restore your losses given your good reason.

But if you regularly do it, you should be punished. Quitting during combat should be the exception, not the norm as keeping the timer would/does promote.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Indeed. Yet Frontier have crafted themselves an echo chamber here through their various forum and moderation policies. I think its worth raising the possibility that its actually Frontier who are the carebears. Naturally, they've attracted a certain following. I say this based upon years of observation and how almost all consequences in game are avoidable.

or perhaps the game is just not primarily built around forced PvP??? This is not a WRONG thing to do, and those who do not like PvP should not be subjected to taunts such as carebear. Take EVE.. great game in principle sadly ruined imo from my POV by the people who play it......
Same with DOTA2.. great game... TOXIC most unwelcoming bunch of players i have ever come across, worse than my experiences in Counterstrike as well, which was not that much better....

my experience in ED when playing however has been very positive.... mostly because those i see tend to prefer to play with me, not just blow me up.. shame this had to happen outside of open