The Star Citizen Thread v5

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Because they were obviously playing it live.
That doesn't answer the question: why would it be ridiculous for them to fake it? Put more clearly: why must me categorically and unquestioningly believe that CIG is somehow quintessentially different from all other companies that are trying to build up hype for their product?

You're offering an unsupported argument that they didn't do so, but that's a completely different question, and as explained earlier, the bugs fails etc. don't really disprove the possibility that it's faked. Not that it matters — since the question is “why?”, not “did they?”
 
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They can show off absolutely anything they like. Presenting that stuff as in-game, however, and it not being in-game, leads to a slightly whiffy Colonial Marines motif.

Please provide a single example of something presented as being available in-game not being available in-game, can't be that hard as there should be plenty of examples, right?
 
That doesn't answer the question: why would it be ridiculous for them to fake it? ...

I'm sorry but this is on par with moon-landing conspiracy logic and I don't have the time/energy to explain/argue the obvious things in the video (like the guys physically sitting there with the controllers... But no.. the controllers probably aren't plugged in... and PC Games magazine who got to independently test 3.0 is probably lying as well... Makes total sense... it's all a conspiracy.. you got me...)
 
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So they aren't allowed to show off stuff before releasing it to the public?

Of course they can - and they absolutely should.

They knocked it out of the park in terms of showing stuff off - and you know for sure at citizencon they will launch the hype into orbit - this is expected.

The point that is being made here - unless I simply don't understand points being made - is that it means doodlysquat till it works in game - and that is the bit that we can all see they are having a serious problem with.
 
Oopsie - I don't think you understand hearsay evidence!

Basically - it's anything you haven't witnessed yourself. So - when you - and I - see the same video - we can only give evidence as to what we have seen. A video.

Our opinions as to how that video came to be are inadmissible as evidence because we didn't witness how the videos were made as they were being made.

Therefore we cannot give any admissible evidence as to their authenticity.

Look it up if you don't believe me.

So have you witnessed the presentation being fake? Or is it indeed hearsay?
 
Please provide a single example of something presented as being available in-game not being available in-game, can't be that hard as there should be plenty of examples, right?
For one, nothing they showed in the presentation yesterday is in-game. Now, we get to quibble as to whether anyone has claimed that it was in-game. :D

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I'm sorry but this is on par with moon-landing conspiracy logic and I don't have the time/energy to explain/argue the obvious things in the video (like the guys physically sitting there with the controllers... But no.. the controllers probably aren't plugged in... and PC Games magazine who got to independently test 3.0 is probably lying as well... Makes total sense... it's all a conspiracy.. you got me...)
You're still not answering the question: why would it be ridiculous for them to fake it? You're just starting to pile on ad hominems and strawmen rather than address the actual point… this is not a good sign.
 
So they aren't allowed to show off stuff before releasing it to the public?

As long as they say it's what they hope to get out but theres no guarantee for it and put that in big block fonts over the screen as in gameplay may not resemble final gameplay. Also don't drink two bottles of wine and plough more money into this as I hope BriGuy didn't.
 
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These conspiracy theory's straight from the rabbit hole crack me up. Maybe we need a refresh with the clean version without cuts and just admire the amazingness of what they've shown.

[video=youtube;3l-epO6oUHE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3l-epO6oUHE[/video]

Bonus:
[video=youtube;7eiiKECxkBI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7eiiKECxkBI[/video]
 
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Please provide a single example of something presented as being available in-game not being available in-game, can't be that hard as there should be plenty of examples, right?
star marine.

PG was pretty basic when compared to something like Elite or Space Engine. Basically a perlin noise height-map (or two) with light scattering to simulate an atmosphere (on the first planet). It is only the first iteration though, as CR said we will get much better surfaces when 3.0 hits.
Shouldn't this be rather concerning?

After all that's exactly what was said about it when we saw exactly the same thing many many months ago in the last great PG reveal but where's the improvement since then? Looks identical - with an elevator :party: gotta worry really
 
For one, nothing they showed in the presentation yesterday is in-game. Now, we get to quibble as to whether anyone has claimed that it was in-game. :D

No, we get to quibble about the definition of the terms in-editor, in-engine and in-game. But i don't see anything of this as reasonable discussion about the subject... I thought the claims of most people in here are well sourced.
 
What is happening at the 9 second point in your bonus vid? The blast grenade slows down time as the corpse floats up the stairs? I didn't know they were incorporating Silent Hill into the game now? ;)
 
I'm sorry but this is on par with moon-landing conspiracy logic and I don't have the time/energy to explain/argue the obvious things in the video (like the guys physically sitting there with the controllers... But no.. the controllers probably aren't plugged in... and PC Games magazine who got to independently test 3.0 is probably lying as well... Makes total sense... it's all a conspiracy.. you got me...)

You're ignoring the question though.

This is commonly observed when people try and deflect an accusation by ridiculing it.

You said it would be ridiculous for them to fake it. But when challenged you have no answer as to why.

And it's missing the point anyway.

The current question is - whether they did or didn't fake it - discussing the merits of to fake or not to fake are irrelevant to whether they did or didn't fake it.

How about explain your reasons for claiming it wasn't faked?
 
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No, we get to quibble about the definition of the terms in-editor, in-engine and in-game. But i don't see anything of this as reasonable discussion about the subject... I thought the claims of most people in here are well sourced.
There's nothing to quibble about. It's just a simple fact: what they showed off in that demo is not in the game. That's all there is to it. So we're right back at the key concern that AspE has brought up: was it presented as being in-game when it was not?

Don't make it that hard for me, give me another one, there's plenty.
Moving the goalposts, huh? You asked for a single thing, he gave you a single thing. Wish fulfilled and point made in full.
 
Is there any difference here though? I mean I've posted some fairly reasonable explanations but because I'm not critical of the game and/or the company, I get labeled as a cultist. Tell me, how is that different than the RSI forums or /r/starcitizen subreddit?

Additionally, all I see is a bunch of illogical statements about how "fake" the presentation was or trollishly over-exaggerated comments. I'm all for criticism but at least have some unbiased evidence to support them!

Every forum has its extremes, your apparent lack of any criticism of the game and its development is as extreme as some of the folks here who criticise everything about it. Whatever the cause, there's some clearly worrying or disturbing trends surrounding the development of Star Citizen that are seemingly not even being acknowledged by a large part of its fanbase. I'm not saying people should blindly condemn CIG for the stuff they do, but at the very least publically raise an eyebrow and call them out on some of the stuff.

I've seen big publishers like EA, Ubisoft, Sony, Microsoft and Activision declared Satan incarnate for lesser things than what CIG seems to get away with.

I play Elite with some other folks, all of us absolutely love what this game represents but you wouldn't be able to tell from some of our conversations. The fact we are so critical of it is borne out of our passion for it to succeed into becoming what it has the potential to be. Yet, this also means we feel the need to point out what we think is holding it back.

This is what you don't see on the RSI forums at all, and sparsely on the SC subreddit, frequently padded with the required "I love this game and all of you and have the deepest respect...but...". It's just a bit uncanny, especially in light of the recent NMS drama over hype fueled by blind faith and fanboyism...

It's the same thing where people desperately try to avoid comparing SC, Elite and NMS at all because "they do different things". That's just wrong, they have massive similarities between them and discussion on which one did a certain feature better is not only natural and healthy, but might actually turn out to improve the genre as a whole. (Provided the discussion remains somewhat respectful and sufficiently supported with arguments, subjective or otherwise)

An umbrella statement like "the entire demo was fake" is as much ignoring the facts as pretending there was nothing questionable about it.

Examples of imo obvious and fair questions following this demo:
- Why does the FPS gameplay seem to be so incredibly unpolished/alpha when SQ42 is supposedly coming out by end-of-year.
- Why was there no actual AI beyond stationary NPCs, even though SQ42 is a singleplayer that's going to heavily rely on such tech.
- This entire sequence was choreographed/scripted, how are these quests going to be without player-driven gameplay?
- Voice acting everything like this takes an insane amount of work, is the release going to feature more than 3-5 hours of these quests?
- If so, how much time are they expecting to spend on them? (SWTOR took over 5 years to get all their writing and voice acting done)

I could go on, but I think my point is clear.

Being passionate about a game means not only cheering when things turn out right, but also questioning or criticising things that don't. Otherwise you come of as... a bit of a cultist. (The inverse is also true though)

Edit: apologies for wall of text :eek: got carried away typing.
 
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You're still not answering the question: why would it be ridiculous for them to fake it? You're just starting to pile on ad hominems and strawmen rather than address the actual point… this is not a good sign.

I already gave you reasons showing how ridiculous it would be for it to be faked. Like any good skeptic, debating with conspiracy theorists with exaggerating speculations that goes counter to all the evidence is pointless. They didn't fake anything for 2.0 during last Gamescom, Citizencon, etc. And like with those, there are plenty of flaws and visuals in the live footage here not indicative of it being faked. So there's no reason to think it's faked either. Feel free to speculate all you want without evidence though. Just note that I won't spend more time on it, starting now.
 
Don't make it that hard for me, give me another one, there's plenty.
This conversation took an unexpected turn.

I don't think the demo was a static video it's just not the actual game. For a multiplayer experience like this there's a lot you can get away with when the computer are all right there on the same LAN which you simply can't once things get laggy, and besides there was really nothing to excite there for me. Same grey 'proc gen' planet, a lift... vehicle or two... same kinda voiced missions that terminally limits their variety and variation.... meh

Sorry. I do want to be excited by SC stuff - I was hoping for a real looking planet to show off, that'd have been a good two fingers to everyone - but... meh.
 
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