The Star Citizen Thread v5

[lysan]

Perhaps though you saying so doesn't make it so. A citation would be needed but yeah - bad management only produces more delays as people don't understand what they're doing, just like in most companies. If they don't have a defined plan crossing all the T's etc, then they need to get one and they needed 2 years ago.

Consider this - The money has never stopped rolling in. 2 years ago did they ever stop and think "what if we keep getting money?" and factor that into their design? Having more cash come in means more things they can do but then they need to put down solid objectives. If we get 50 million, we do this, if we get 60 mill, we do that.... What doesn't stop is work on the main game and they need to work out a way to produce version 1.0 with the addition of version 2.0 coming out in 2 years with these features.... version 3.0 2 years after that if they need to.

It's getting close to the time that all non fanboys are just going to get bored hearing about it. Ever hear of Fighter Ops? LOL 10 years and nothing and everyone just got bored and never bothered to look it up. If SC take too long people will move on. Could you imagine 8 years from now and it's still not out LOL - who's going to bother reporting about it? It'll turn into a massive joke and the people that spent thousands are going to look really stupid.

People also buy drugs, that doesn't make it more healthy.

However you're correct, just because I say so will not make it valid. However in this case anyone with just a basic educational background, can see it unfolding in front of them with their own eyes. You don't need to be a genius to see that.

 

[Jex =TE=]

People also buy drugs, that doesn't make it more healthy.

However you're correct, just because I say so will not make it valid. However in this case anyone with just a basic educational background, can see it unfolding in front of them with their own eyes. You don't need to be a genius to see that.

Actually I think you do and you're a mystic too since there is no way you're privvy to any inside information. At best you can make an educated guess. No "basic education background" is required to know what you can't know and stop using as a synonym for saying "it's obvious for anyone with a brain" because it's not as we can clearly prove by you not being privvy to any information about what's going on with the dev cycle CIG are using.

 

[CMDR_Orlando]

You arent a tiny bit surprised, that in a space ship game that involves travelling between places, that they haven't decided what happens when that happens? After 4 years?

Well since both in networking and technology the Star Citizen engine made major improvements during those years I'm sure that whatever they decided back then as changed. Just like the scope of the game did meanwhile. I would assume that the game design is directly tied to what you can do within your game engine limitations and what current network / cpu/gpu technology allows you. Since the engine got a major upgrade, it allows them to do things now that 4 years ago they wouldn't think it was possible. Like the seamless planetary landings show.

As for design documents, the Robert's are not rookies doing space-games by any stretch of imagination, I'm sure they have a bunch of those updated since the Freelancer/Privateer days and just enhance the mechanics to best use the new design possibilities given by tech advancement.
Since what they are doing with CryEngine was never really done there's a lot of question marks in design but since they have the time and the money they can afford to R&D until they find the best solution. Actually in that german guy interview he said that they had changed around 50% of the engine already so I don't know if calling it CryEngine really should be used but whatever, semantics.

Could you imagine 8 years from now and it's still not out LOL - who's going to bother reporting about it? It'll turn into a massive joke and the people that spent thousands are going to look really stupid.

The thing is that it's already out, people can already play it. They only need to keep delivering the updates to keep the community engaged while they work on it, just like they have been doing for the past 2.5 years. Now Squadron42 is another story and they will have to deliver that sooner rather than later.

 

[AJW]

The thing is that it's already out, people can already play it.

The thing is, the state of SC seems to depend entirely on context. When anyone points out bugs, or the fact that much of what has been promised is missing, we are told it's a pre-alpha. When someone asks for a refund they are told it's almost finished. And now we read that it's 'already out'!

 

[dayrth]

Well since both in networking and technology the Star Citizen engine made major improvements during those years I'm sure that whatever they decided back then as changed. Just like the scope of the game did meanwhile. I would assume that the game design is directly tied to what you can do within your game engine limitations and what current network / cpu/gpu technology allows you. Since the engine got a major upgrade, it allows them to do things now that 4 years ago they wouldn't think it was possible. Like the seamless planetary landings show.

New techniques are developed all the time. Technology advances constantly. What is 'possible' changes every day. If you keep adding stuff because it is now possible to, then you will never finish.

Plan a project. Build that project. Finish that project. Release that project.

All the new cool stuff that became possible while you were doing that you can plan in to your next project/iteration/update/season.

 

[Sir.Tj]

Thread temp closed to allow Mods to sort out this thread of unadulterated joy yet again.

 

[Sir.Tj]

Ok, thread reopened.


Stay on topic please.

 

[Esvandiary]

Thread temp closed to allow Mods to sort out this thread of unadulterated joy yet again.

Excellent turn of phrase.


The Gamescom demo looked very cool indeed, and if they can get something approximating that demo into the online PU by the end of the year I'll be suitably impressed.

... If.

 

[Neo-ST]

What was the 2.6 about again?

 

[lysan]

Actually I think you do and you're a mystic too since there is no way you're privvy to any inside information. At best you can make an educated guess. No "basic education background" is required to know what you can't know and stop using as a synonym for saying "it's obvious for anyone with a brain" because it's not as we can clearly prove by you not being privvy to any information about what's going on with the dev cycle CIG are using.

Just by checking the history will give you a very good educated guesstimate. It's a mess from day one.
Actually they are just successful in the funding area, just like the local drug dealer is successful in selling an over rated product.

You know it's bad, but you buy it anyway, just for the thrill of it

 

[CMDR_Orlando]

New techniques are developed all the time. Technology advances constantly. What is 'possible' changes every day.

I think that Star Citizen is living proof of that because most of what they are doing is cutting edge tech and we see them partnering with the companies that lead the way (Intel / AMD / NVIDIA etc). From the way they make the ships work with multiple people inside, how they have a seamless large map without loading screens, how they integrated the views of both first person and third, that grabby hands thing, the graphics effects for ships: shaders, lightning, decals, damage states and now the much need networking overhaul. All that is pushing their tech, ofc other company's are doing the same in their own way to achieve their vision so it's good for us gamers as dev's keep pushing each other to make bigger and better games.

 

[lysan]

I think that Star Citizen is living proof of that because most of what they are doing is cutting edge tech and we see them partnering with the companies that lead the way (Intel / AMD / NVIDIA etc). From the way they make the ships work with multiple people inside, how they have a seamless large map without loading screens, how they integrated the views of both first person and third, that grabby hands thing, the graphics effects for ships: shaders, lightning, decals, damage states and now the much need networking overhaul. All that is pushing their tech, ofc other company's are doing the same in their own way to achieve their vision so it's good for us gamers as dev's keep pushing each other to make bigger and better games.

Sorry but nothing is cutting edge, well maybe in Cry Engine, but not regarding games, grabby hands is done before its not new at all.

 

[Osmanthus]

Are you talking about the official Gamescom video or which one?

This one specifically. Is there a better one?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1wX1Kk3Ajg#t=2m20s

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

The thing is, the state of SC seems to depend entirely on context. When anyone points out bugs, or the fact that much of what has been promised is missing, we are told it's a pre-alpha. When someone asks for a refund they are told it's almost finished. And now we read that it's 'already out'!

This is my beef as well. When told that the current state of the game makes it "better than many AAA games", then pointing out its gamebreaking bugs is somehow not fair game because it's "prealpha". You can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[Asp Explorer]

I'm sorry - but much of this isn't new or groundbreaking. Picture-in-picture was done absolutely ages back - think Starglider and Carrier Command. A huge map without loading screens, try Hunter or Midwinter. Grabby hands thing? Actually I can't think of one. Grabby object try Jetpac or Thrust I suppose. But none of this is new or groundbreaking.

 

[CMDR_Orlando]

Sorry but nothing is cutting edge, well maybe in Cry Engine, but not regarding games, grabby hands is done before its not new at all.

Well that's your opinion, many pros from the gaming industry including David Braben think otherwise.

 

[BurnyBurns]

because most of what they are doing is cutting edge tech and we see them partnering with the companies that lead the way (Intel / AMD / NVIDIA etc).

...just like any other big game company. Very few games that aren't labelled as best "played on" and whatnot. At worst a whole lot of eyewash, at best, optimized drivers. Only there's nothing optimized about Star Citizen currently.

From the way they make the ships work with multiple people inside,

... as does Space Engineers, an indie game with a fraction of their budget and dev force.

how they have a seamless large map without loading screens,

... which is impressive, until you realize that there's Infinity: Battlecape which does about the same, with a smaller team.

how they integrated the views of both first person and third

... Err, by switching the camera? Just like ARMA?

that grabby hands thing

...could be impressive, if it wasn't still absent from the game after four years.

the graphics effects for ships: shaders, lightning, decals, damage states

...look very cool, but ought to be expected with that budget and amount of devs. And in terms of the art, they're not better or worse than any of the other "AAA" games I've seen. The quality is mostly unique for a space game, but not really in the AAA space in general (Naughty Dog anyone?).

the much need networking overhaul

... is a sad and pretty telling story, four years, 119$ Mio. and various alpha product slices into an MMO project.


Why am I constantly getting the impression Star Citizen's believers are taking every bloody little tidbit about this game and blow it completely out of proportions?



Regarding the overselling of things:

"Unlike a lot of other games, including those with PG'ed planets, there is no specific draw distance. In 3.0 the curvature of the planet is the horizon."

Seriously? And the other PG planet games just replace everything a few dozen meters from the camera with a flat 2D texture, amiright? (Edit: While Star Citizen's draw distance is magically infinite of course. That pebble in fron tof your feet? SC's magic tech and optimized engine will render it the same, even if it's two hundred kilometers away from your camera currently! Yes, it's smaller than one pixel, but it'll be rendered all the same, believe me! )

 

[Barking_Mad]

Well that's your opinion, many pros from the gaming industry including David Braben think otherwise.

Well Im pretty sure that was based on his view at the time - on what was being attempted, not what has been actually done.

 

[Cynaqq]

Sorry but nothing is cutting edge, well maybe in Cry Engine, but not regarding games, grabby hands is done before its not new at all.

BTW, what is this 'grabby hands' everyone is talking about? Is it the character's hands adapting the environment such as holding the handrail on stairs or dampening the impact by pressing its palm if you run straight into a wall? Because if that's the case, it really isn't ground-breaking. Even firewatch does it and does it wonderfully.

Edit: NVM, I checked it. Yes, it's the thing firewatch also does, and does it infinitely better. Holy Crap! Firewatch is like the gold standard in grabby hands apparently!

 

[CMDR_Orlando]

Well I do think what they are doing is "trailblazing" as DB said and the Gamescom demo showcased a glimpse of that, now that is not the same thing as saying that they are the only ones doing it, which I never said.

Congrats on the 120$million btw!

Spoiler

 

[Stigbob]

BTW, what is this 'grabby hands' everyone is talking about? Is it the character's hands adapting the environment such as holding the handrail on stairs or dampening the impact by pressing its palm if you run straight into a wall? Because if that's the case, it really isn't ground-breaking. Even firewatch does it and does it wonderfully.

Shifting crates around is apparently a totally new concept (deus ex 16 years ago).