"Beyond" free for Horizon owners - LEP musings

[tomalus]

This might be shocking,but NO I WANT TO PAY FOR SEASON 3.

But I want it to be a proper expansion with content done and doable
after purchase/release.Not "to be released over X months"

 

[JeffRyan]

LEP owner myself, I don't have a problem. I understand why Beyond is free, so... I actually think it's a pretty damned nice thing to do, at least one of the features (Squadrons) could easily be payable, but they've not gone down that route.

 

[WR3ND]

This might be shocking,but NO I WANT TO PAY FOR SEASON 3.

But I want it to be a proper expansion with content done and doable
after purchase/release.Not "to be released over X months"

I think they're trying to sure up Horizons and get everyone, or as many as they feasibly can, on board for further expansion, which I think is a good move on their part.

 

[Juniper]

I don't think that's going to happen. 2.4 isn't even out yet and if anyone thinks a year of coding is going to add the "meat" to the game and they didn't get how long 2.0 took to make then I'm not sure what game we're playing or what information we're seeing.

FDev are either way too slow or have nobody working on ED and given that 2.0 took forever, this "2.4 beyond" is going to take 2 years and then they start work on 3.0 which will likely be 2-3 years but this will be a full release which means it will need bug testing so more likely 3 years (and let's not forget that ED is full of bugs that need fixing ON TOP of the new content they're adding).

If at the end of "2.4 beyond" we have a couple of new shallow features and we still have the bugs, who's going to hang around a few years for 3.0? If you were on the board of directors or a shareholder, would you be comfortable pushing out 3.0 if it was like that?

My memory might be slightly fuzzy on this, but I don't remember 2.0 taking "forever". In fact, I was quite surprised at how quickly planetary landings was turned around... because we'd always been led to believe that this was "for the future". The gap between 2.2 and 2.4 was too long though I agree.

Anyway, we will see what happens with Beyond. I liked most of what I saw and heard at FX17, and the devil will be in the detail and the implementation. I'd like to believe they've learned a few things from their past mistakes, and that 2018 is all about consolidation and overall improvement / rewrites, to set the game up for the next big paid expansion(s).

 

[Stewart_]

Actually, I never said ‘frontier didn’t promise an offline game’. Go back and you’ll see.

I said Elite would continue as long as it remained ‘viable’. Beyond is probably free due to how Horizons went. I don’t think charging for Beyond would go down too well. Who knows - there could be other DLC in the next 12 months that FD aren’t telling us about...

That Frontier didn't promise an offline game. They did. It happened. There we are.



If that were the sole motivation for development, they'd charge for Beyond. The fact they're not doing suggests that this is more than just pure pragmatic capitalism.



Who were backing up their objections with a sizeable amount of cash at the time - cash that was needed by FD to make the game.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

LEP owner myself, I don't have a problem. I understand why Beyond is free, so... I actually think it's a pretty damned nice thing to do, at least one of the features (Squadrons) could easily be payable, but they've not gone down that route.

Arguably squadrons SHOULD be payable. Imo the free stuff should all be DDF stuff as surly this is the core game which effects everyone. Given squadrons looks like a MP only feature it is a perfect fit for those who want it can pay, those who it offers nothing too can pass it by (unless FD U-turn and allow solo players to join NPC squadrons (not holding my breath)

 

[Whitehair]

It is not my conclusion but the fact some think this means FD were a little unclear.

Nothing was unclear. They said 'Beyond' wiil be free to everyone, nothing else. Can't get much more obvious. 4 releases in 2018, all free, gratis and for nothing. Nothing was said about LEP's. Nothing at all.

Here is the quote from the OP:

... FDev should really seriously consider some perks, or partial refunds by now.

Well, I call this reaction to the announcement of FREE CONTENT FOR A YEAR, stupid. Asking for a refund for the 'unused' portion of a LEP I call greedy and stupid. Calling me a troll simply because I am not following the other lemmings and dare to express my disagreement is, I'm afraid, rather typical.

Your opinion obviously differs. Feel free to continue to be upset by FD's generosity if it floats your boat.

Nothing was said about how Brexit is going to affect the european part of the workforce at FD during the announcements, but I don't see any threads calling for refunds because they may not have enough people in a couple years time to be able to work on ED any more.

Hmmm.... maybe I shouldn't give ideas out.... but then again, if anyone wants to ask for a refund because... Brexit... no-one can actually stop them! We could all just sit by and gasp in wonderment at their stupidity if they did!

 

[babelfisch]

I don't think that's going to happen. 2.4 isn't even out yet and if anyone thinks a year of coding is going to add the "meat" to the game and they didn't get how long 2.0 took to make then I'm not sure what game we're playing or what information we're seeing.

FDev are either way too slow or have nobody working on ED and given that 2.0 took forever, this "2.4 beyond" is going to take 2 years and then they start work on 3.0 which will likely be 2-3 years but this will be a full release which means it will need bug testing so more likely 3 years (and let's not forget that ED is full of bugs that need fixing ON TOP of the new content they're adding).

If at the end of "2.4 beyond" we have a couple of new shallow features and we still have the bugs, who's going to hang around a few years for 3.0? If you were on the board of directors or a shareholder, would you be comfortable pushing out 3.0 if it was like that?

I think it actually is pragmatic capitalism. They noticed how many people were upset by the pricing model of Season 2 (paying upfront, paying so close to release, for features that some argued should be part of the base game, etc.) and tried to do better to please their players so it's more likely they'll buy the next expansion. They didn't expect a 25 pages thread of people complaining that others get stuff for free though, which is a bit naive because complaining is the only thing this community is good at. Must have something to do with our age, we are all bitter old men.

Now get off my lawn!

 

[Juniper]

Actually, I never said ‘frontier didn’t promise an offline game’. Go back and you’ll see.

If you insist...

there was never any indication FD would release some crippled offline version - that existed only in your dreams.

Anyway...

I said Elite would continue as long as it remained ‘viable’. Beyond is probably free due to how Horizons went. I don’t think charging for Beyond would go down too well.

Perhaps it wouldn't have, but they'd be perfectly within their rights to do it. 100+ team working on a product for 12 months... with potentially zero revenue... go figure.

Beyond is likely free IMO because they are using it to improve the underlying code, rework the game mechanics, add features (like the new lighting model) that is all a pre-requisite for what they have planned for 2019 and...er... beyond. You can bet your house that will be chargeable.

Who knows - there could be other DLC in the next 12 months that FD aren’t telling us about...

Possible, but highly unlikely. That's not to say they don't have a stream of developers working on 2019 content already.

 

[babelfisch]

If you insist...



Anyway...



Perhaps it wouldn't have, but they'd be perfectly within their rights to do it. 100+ team working on a product for 12 months... with potentially zero revenue... go figure.

Beyond is likely free IMO because they are using it to improve the underlying code, rework the game mechanics, add features (like the new lighting model) that is all a pre-requisite for what they have planned for 2019 and...er... beyond. You can bet your house that will be chargeable.



Possible, but highly unlikely. That's not to say they don't have a stream of developers working on 2019 content already.

Despite my comment above, I absolutely agree with that

 

[Drelthar]

I get what the OP is saying. I own a LEP too, and am hoping that one day it has paid itself off.

This just means that day will be further away. And yeah, it does bother me a bit.

But Having all this stuff for free seems cool to me, means more people might come back to the game they bought, and also may bring others in too, so I'm cool with that.

 

[Riverside]

Arguably squadrons SHOULD be payable. Imo the free stuff should all be DDF stuff as surly this is the core game which effects everyone. Given squadrons looks like a MP only feature it is a perfect fit for those who want it can pay, those who it offers nothing too can pass it by (unless FD U-turn and allow solo players to join NPC squadrons (not holding my breath)

I'm with you on that, the squadron stuff is a good example of content that not everyone might have any use for, but those that do could pay for (if they didn't have the LEP).

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I don't think that's going to happen. 2.4 isn't even out yet and if anyone thinks a year of coding is going to add the "meat" to the game and they didn't get how long 2.0 took to make then I'm not sure what game we're playing or what information we're seeing.

Jex, you so self centred here that you don't even recognize why FD took longer route for Horizons. Because they added way more than they planned, especially to core game. That's what they planned. They intended to do that right after 2.1 update. After it were no delays, it was all planned. It is called reorganization. It happens a lot and it is why good management is essential in big software projects - to call it, to make that unpopular change.

They have 1 year planned ahead, and most likely already plan for 2019, when next paid for extension will be rolled out.

As for Horizons content, I think people don't really realise what's done in background, and what kind of improvements and changes they added due of longer schedule.

I'm with you on that, the squadron stuff is a good example of content that not everyone might have any use for, but those that do could pay for (if they didn't have the LEP).

Considering it is only one of features they talked about for Q4 (and it is more than year ahead), expect way more in that patch besides Squadron gameplay.

Each update contains something I don't use or pay for. Not going around claiming I should get something extra.

 

[Stewart_]

Zero revenue... please!

You seem to suggest there’s been ‘almost’ zero purchases of elite in the last 12 months..., even with the PS4 release.

but yet we know FD has been profitable even with out the cash inejection recently. PLanet C has not been generating all the revenue / profit alone.

If you insist...



Anyway...



Perhaps it wouldn't have, but they'd be perfectly within their rights to do it. 100+ team working on a product for 12 months... with potentially zero revenue... go figure.

Beyond is likely free IMO because they are using it to improve the underlying code, rework the game mechanics, add features (like the new lighting model) that is all a pre-requisite for what they have planned for 2019 and...er... beyond. You can bet your house that will be chargeable.



Possible, but highly unlikely. That's not to say they don't have a stream of developers working on 2019 content already.

 

[Juniper]

Zero revenue... please!

You seem to suggest there’s been ‘almost’ zero purchases of elite in the last 12 months..., even with the PS4 release.

but yet we know FD has been profitable even with out the cash inejection recently. PLanet C has not been generating all the profit alone.

I said potentially zero revenue. These announcements extend the life of Horizons for a year, so one would assume people will still buy it.

But it's been out for quite a while now (on all platforms) so sales are naturally going to trickle off... on the basis that most people who want the game will have it already.

That leaves "second accounts" and cosmetics.

 

[starman]

People have my respect for helping to fund the game. Not for acting like spoiled brats.

Thanks for proving my point.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

This might be shocking,but NO I WANT TO PAY FOR SEASON 3.

But I want it to be a proper expansion with content done and doable
after purchase/release.Not "to be released over X months"

Then you will be happy to know that next paid for expansion certainly will be full release, not released over months.

 

[WR3ND]

Thanks for proving my point.

What exactly was your point again?

 

[madbilly]

I think this thread has run it's course. There are many, many people who've posted in this thread with genuine concerns about the future development the game, existence or not of paid-for expansions and therefore what the point of buying a LEP in 2015 was; but all these people are continually shouted down by a small group of people who disagree with the sentiment of the majority, some of whom unfortunately use insults and aggressive wording to make their point. Soon the only people left will be the small, rude minority, violently agreeing with themselves, all the while completely missing the valid point that the OP and many, many others have made.

I know, it's called Dangerous Discussion for a reason

My final words: I'm optimistic. I think there will be a season 3 in 2018 that is paid for. All that was shown at FX17 is only what will be available without cost to owners of season 2, just like 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, etc were available without cost to owners of season 1 (base game). Paid-for season 3 will be awesome

See you in the black commanders.
Cheers

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

My final words: I'm optimistic. I think there will be a season 3 in 2018 that is paid for. All that was shown at FX17 is only what will be available without cost to owners of season 2, just like 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, etc were available without cost to owners of season 1 (base game). Paid-for season 3 will be awesome

See you in the black commanders.
Cheers

And here is my point about FDs Comms . Either madbilly (no relation) is correct and we are all chatting / stressing over nothing OR a group of folk are setting themselves up for disappointment (which un less you are horrible person no one should want that no matter what side of the fence you sit)