Elite Dangerous is the Largest Empty Sandbox Ever Made

[EvE4evah]

I don't think that's entirely true Jason, I've had more than my fair share of beefs with SDC but, as you'll see from my post in that thread you linked, I thought their proposal was pretty good. The thing is it involves far to much evasion and carrot and not enough stick, it's not about wanting to avoid progress but stearing clear of progress that is only beneficial to criminals.

And the problem SDC, scrub that, any of us have when posting here is our posting history and our action and preferences in game. SDC can't expect a clean slate when suggesting something considering their previous actions any more than a Mobius member can. Rightly or wrongly we all do it, it's happening from both sides in this very thread and in recent posts, SDC shouldn't expect a waiver simply because of a well presented but flawed idea.

Nice to see You don't exactly belong in the echo chamber

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

Well, I mean… you were all joyful talking about how the space is full of disease and danger, and you fancy Open, so I obliviously believed for a moment you'd turned into a 'natural ecosystem' defender.

Sorry for that mistake.

Well see there's danger, and then there's peeing into everyone's corn flakes. It's the latter that's not fun for the larger amount of the player base, my eve-loving friend.

But please do tell me, where's the fun for the explorers/researchers who got their parked ships blown up at an alien wreck site? I mean, it might've been fun for the morons who did it, in the same way a malicious 8-year old might have fun kicking kittens.

In other words - that sort of "PvP" right there - where was the challenge in blowing up tens of parked and inert exploration-fitted ships at an alien wreckage site where due to the particular circumstances of that site, players had no choice but to leave ships parked there? (e.g. dismissing and recalling ships meant they couldn't land nearby, they landed km's away) Where's the challenge and danger for the gankers? A: There was none. Sure, explorers could have recruited other players to guard their ships - but again that wouldn't have worked well, those explorer ships would still have been blown up.

That's what I mean by peeing in the corn flakes. That's absolutely not a mutually fun thing for both parties involved. It's malicious, the intent is to cause grief rather than mutually have fun. And don't pretend otherwise.

 

[EvE4evah]

You mean, 5-7 people trolling up the other 5-7 people?

You're probably right [knocked out]

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

It's been common place in the forums, Jason. It's all about censorship and trying to shut the PvPers up. Mocking, insults, badgering, trolling everywhere. Also, always the same 5-7 people…

Are you calling all PvPers gankers?

That's harsh.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

Sounds about right. "But I do play in Open so there!"

What I found interesting about the SDC prop that I linked to was that they're clearly lobbying for structure and meaningful consequences, and all some of these guys are hearing is "evil PvP!" and going into insult mode. I mean, basically what you have is players wanting to have a legitimate discussion about the multiplayer component of the game sans all the narrow minded malarkey that seems so prevalent, and a small group of forum members who just want to throw tomatoes at them in the hopes of shutting them up.

Anything to avoid progress, basically.

I always enjoy reading your propaganda, jason

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I always enjoy reading your propaganda, jason

I think he replaced Sole Hunter as the SDC Propaganda head executive chief officer

 

[jasonbarron]

I don't think that's entirely true Jason, I've had more than my fair share of beefs with SDC but, as you'll see from my post in that thread you linked, I thought their proposal was pretty good. The thing is it involves far to much evasion and carrot and not enough stick, it's not about wanting to avoid progress but stearing clear of progress that is only beneficial to criminals.

And the problem SDC, scrub that, any of us have when posting here is our posting history and our action and preferences in game. SDC can't expect a clean slate when suggesting something considering their previous actions any more than a Mobius member can. Rightly or wrongly we all do it, it's happening from both sides in this very thread and in recent posts, SDC shouldn't expect a waiver simply because of a well presented but flawed idea.

I appreciate the comment, and I don't consider the fact that someone disagrees with the proposal "narrow minded" at all. Rather it's stuff like this:

Well see there's danger, and then there's peeing into everyone's corn flakes. It's the latter that's not fun for the larger amount of the player base, my eve-loving friend.

But please do tell me, where's the fun for the explorers/researchers who got their parked ships blown up at an alien wreck site? I mean, it might've been fun for the morons who did it, in the same way a malicious 8-year old might have fun kicking kittens.

Thanks Genar; I knew we'd get to the intolerant, narrow minded name calling sooner or later. Sooner, apparently.

 

[MadDogMurdock]

Because they are stuck in 1984.

I think he replaced Sole Hunter as the SDC Propaganda head executive chief officer

With gems like this, I can't think why.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

I appreciate the comment, and I don't consider the fact that someone disagrees with the proposal "narrow minded" at all. Rather it's stuff like this:



Thanks Genar; I knew we'd get to the intolerant, narrow minded name calling sooner or later. Sooner, apparently.

Thanks jason, I knew someone would step up and only focus on part of what I wrote, conveniently ignoring the whole. I hope that one stung hard though.

 

[EvE4evah]

Well see there's danger, and then there's peeing into everyone's corn flakes. It's the latter that's not fun for the larger amount of the player base, my eve-loving friend.

I love EvE and ED equally. I equally ain't currently playing either

But please do tell me, where's the fun for the explorers/researchers who got their parked ships blown up at an alien wreck site? I mean, it might've been fun for the morons who did it, in the same way a malicious 8-year old might have fun kicking kittens.

The same fun you'll feel when you live in Brazil and let your Porsche with doors open at midnight on a random street. Don't do it. If you were eventually stupid enough to do it, don't repeat it. "dismiss your ship" comes into mind.

In other words - that sort of "PvP" right there - where was the challenge in blowing up tens of parked and inert exploration-fitted ships at an alien wreckage site where due to the particular circumstances of that site, players had no choice but to leave ships parked there? (e.g. dismissing and recalling ships meant they couldn't land nearby, they landed km's away) Where's the challenge and danger for the gankers? A: There was none. Sure, explorers could have recruited other players to guard their ships - but again that wouldn't have worked well, those explorer ships would still have been blown up.

It's not the gankers' fault that there's no challenge. The game refuses to provide any, 4 years after launch. Oh how I'd love to face opposition when hunting the pure, innocent explorers in research sites …

That's what I mean by peeing in the corn flakes. That's absolutely not a mutually fun thing for both parties involved. It's malicious, the intent is to cause grief rather than mutually have fun. And don't pretend otherwise.

What exactly is the problem with NOT CARING if prey has fun or not? The Devs have the obligation to enable fun for the players, not the players themselves. Why would you fly in Open and talk about the 'dangers'of space, if you advocate Tharg danger, still your against Player danger?

Are you calling all PvPers gankers?

That's harsh.

That's yours (and the others') agenda

Oh wait that was your point from the beginning

Gz

 

[verminstar]

Of course you did.

So did I haha...I see their name in the title and thats usually enough to justify blocking the entire thread...I dont even care what the threads about ^

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Thanks jason, I knew someone would step up and only focus on part of what I wrote, conveniently ignoring the whole. I hope that one stung hard though.

This is where I am having a little trouble. When I talk to these guys on the forum, they're good guys. You can discuss stuff with them, they're intelligent, funny, most don't take themselves too serious.

And then they go and act like morons. And this is a perception thing I guess. When you treat Elite like a shoot-em-up, you shoot anything that moves. Because that's what you do in shoot them ups. It's not that they are being morons, they're inconsiderate of other people's play styles. They don't give a frog you spent ages out in the black gathering data and trying to get it back. And they don't have to. But from our perspective they are acting like morons. The only thing that doesn't jive with that is that their mission statement is to ruin other people's games.

The juicy part comes when they complain those carebear forum dads don't care about their play style. Karma sure can be a female dog. They can't take what they dish out. Tough

That's yours (and the others') agenda

Oh wait that was your point from the beginning

Gz

Not true. The discussion was about gankers (SDC), you included all PvPers in that category.

That was all you.

edit: By the way, of the 3 CMDRs I regularly talk to in game, 2 are PvPers and are always on my case when I'm not in Open. They display none of the characteristics people are addressing here.

 

[EvE4evah]

This is where I am having a little trouble. When I talk to these guys on the forum, they're good guys. You can discuss stuff with them, they're intelligent, funny, most don't take themselves too serious.

And then they go and act like morons. And this is a perception thing I guess. When you treat Elite like a shoot-em-up, you shoot anything that moves. Because that's what you do in shoot them ups. It's not that they are being morons, they're inconsiderate of other people's play styles. They don't give a frog you spent ages out in the black gathering data and trying to get it back. And they don't have to. But from our perspective they are acting like morons. The only thing that doesn't jive with that is that their mission statement is to ruin other people's games.

The juicy part comes when they complain those carebear forum dads don't care about their play style. Karma sure can be a female dog. They can't take what they dish out. Tough

It's so easy to understand really.

It's a game.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

It's so easy to understand really.

It's a game.

I know it's easy to understand. I just explained it

Not sure what it being a game has to do with anything.

 

[Darkfyre99]

It's been common place in the forums, Jason. It's all about censorship and trying to shut the PvPers up. Mocking, insults, badgering, trolling everywhere. Also, always the same 5-7 people…

There's a world of difference between PvPers, and GSPers.

PvPers are fun to play with, GSPers are not. PvPers are interested in a good fight. GSPers are only interested in killing easy targets. PvPers are happy about the three modes, since they make it is easier to find a good fight in Open without arranging one ahead of time. GSPers wail and moan about how solo and private groups are "ruining" the game. PvPers are gracious in victory or defeat. GSPers combat log the instant you get the upper hand, and will harrass you all the way to the station if you outfly them, and then try to ram you to death.

GSpers claiming to be PvPers has been common for thirty years, but its a bit like stolen valor. It doesn't take long to tell they're full of it. GSPers claim to be filling a necessary niche in the game, but at the end of the day they're so poor at it, NPCs are more fun to play with. Given how poorly NPCs are fleshed out in this game, that's really saying something.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Simple. Unlike reality the prey doesn't really die and next time will, most likely, avoid the wolf.
Do it often and the wolf is getting out of prey.
The wolf's problem in the end, created by the wolf himself.

Plus the wolf is asking the prey to care about their fun.

 

[jasonbarron]

Thanks jason, I knew someone would step up and only focus on part of what I wrote, conveniently ignoring the whole. I hope that one stung hard though.

No, it didn't sting at all. My approach to the game and the forum are both kind of "big picture" oriented and I never succumb to those kinds of provocations. I just happen to think that your definition of the people blowing up parked scientists who are not sensible enough to take even the most basic preventative measures as "morons" is the very definition of narrow minded, and I feel like it deserves a bit of pushback.

 

[EvE4evah]

I know it's easy to understand. I just explained it

Not sure what it being a game has to do with anything.

You said you were having a little trouble, pointing out the disparity between 'these guys' behavior on the forum and they being 'morons'in the game. And I said, "it's a game".

Which means exactly that. It's an ar-pee-gee game. I can roleplay. I don't have to CARE or BE CONSIDERATE about any player's playstyle, very much UNLIKE Real Life(TM), exactly because it's a game.

What's your little trouble again?

 

[ALGOMATIC]

There's a world of difference between PvPers, and GSPers.

PvPers are fun to play with, GSPers are not. PvPers are interested in a good fight. GSPers are only interested in killing easy targets. PvPers are happy about the three modes, since they make it is easier to find a good fight in Open without arranging one ahead of time. GSPers wail and moan about how solo and private groups are "ruining" the game. PvPers are gracious in victory or defeat. GSPers combat log the instant you get the upper hand, and will harrass you all the way to the station if you outfly them, and then try to ram you to death.

GSpers claiming to be PvPers has been common for thirty years, but its a bit like stolen valor. It doesn't take long to tell they're full of it. GSPers claim to be filling a necessary niche in the game, but at the end of the day they're so poor at it, NPCs are more fun to play with. Given how poorly NPCs are fleshed out in this game, that's really saying something.

LOL, no pvpier is happy with the 3 modes, because there is not even a single piece of content for this play style, when you come up with one you become a griefer (not that I care if I am one).

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

You said you were having a little trouble, pointing out the disparity between 'these guys' behavior on the forum and they being 'morons'in the game. And I said, "it's a game".

Which means exactly that. It's an ar-pee-gee game. I can roleplay. I don't have to CARE or BE CONSIDERATE about any player's playstyle, very much UNLIKE Real Life(TM), exactly because it's a game.

What's your little trouble again?

Calling them morons. It's a little less simple than that. I put it down to perspective.

Care to try again?