Is anyone still Xeno-Friendly? If so why?

[Crimson Kaim]

Can I be Xeno-Neutral? I frankly don't care about either Thargs or Guardians. None of them give me good money, materials or modules or I can't otherwise interact with them. WOuld love to trade human weaponary (like AX) for thargoid weaponary (Hyperspace interdictor, shield disruptor, EMP, etc.)

Guardian modules are not really better than human ones, only compared to unengineered modules.

 

[signal11th]

I'm "friendly" with everything until I have reason not to be.

 

[Poseidal]

Right on o7!

Yet another thread where the OP hasn't read enough about the subject yet!

Actually, the OP is probably more up to date than you are. Ram Tah has made further discoveries about them, and judging from what happened last time when people tried to open a dialogue, we are better off trying to find Mycoid 2.0.

These aren't your FFE Thargoids we're dealing with.

 

[OnTheMinute]

If you think communication is still a viable option go and do the newest Ram Tah mission. The records Ram Tah manages to extract from the data collected at these sites paints a clear picture about the Thargoids. Trying to communicate with them is like trying to convert Lions into Christianity. https://youtu.be/GT2yoyaOB7g Here’s a vid of a guy trying to convert lions. Don’t be like this guy.

 

[Daniel Cloudsifter]

That's pretty daft. They know we are sentient, especially since THEY started a war and Humanity ended it with the Mycoid weapon. Now they are back and on the attack, which THEY started.

I have a feeling that a large majority of the current player base has no clue what the history is with the Thargoid. If they did, their would be different songs being sung.
Also, as noted, there is no evidence at all that Aegis is doing anything other than research and development on Thargoid bio and tech. They developed all of our current weapons and defensive capabilities, which is the reason why the Thargoid are attacking stations they have a presence. It's my belief that they are trying to head off another Mycoid type weapon before a larger invasion.

And I have said this before, I'll say it again. Don't count out the INRA Mycoid weapon. The top people in INRA faded into the background, their descendants still have the data, Mycoid will be making a return at some point in the future.

Agreed. All evidence points to them starting the war ages ago and being extremely aggressive. The new Guardian logs show that the same thing happened to them. Further, they were gifted linguists, figured out how to communicate with the Thargoids, and it made NO difference. So the Guardians had to respond with more aggressive measures and - I would assume - managed to drive off or contain the Thargoids. I can't imagine them fighting their final civil war AND the Thargoids at the same time.

And yes, most of the player base doesn't have the full background because they haven't read the novels - or bothered to check the wiki page that sums it up. We know from "Premonition" that the Club knows the Thargoids know we are sentient, that they know our language, and that they know we act as individuals and not as a hive collective. From "Out of Darkness" we actually see a rogue human scientist strike a deal with the Osresians, who build a base for him to conduct his research.

I swear, some of these players want to excuse everything the Thargoids are doing in game and blame humanity first. Some dismiss any and all data - from humanity or the Guardians - under "Victors write the History books." Well taken to that extreme, we might as well toss out ALL history as they are meaningless. Ugh. Yes, there is some bias, but that doesn't automatically refute all facts.

For my part, I'm surprised to learn that the Thargoids were NOT the automated constructs of the Guardians and were a separate, hostile race. After seeing how things went with the Guardian's peace overtures - and the fact that the Thargoids still HATE the Guardians 2 million years later - I'm all for using Mycoid 2.0, 3.0, etc.

The biggest eye-opening experience of all this for me is that I used to watch Sci-Fi movies where a group of people, totally oblivious to evidence indicating caution should be taken, would welcome aliens and get massacred (e.g. Independence day, War of the Worlds, etc.). I figured that was a lazy writing trope. Now I can see that no, there are really people like that. Wow.

 

[JohnRoberts]

If you put a mouse in vivarium with a snake, it will get eaten. Is that the snakes fault? Is that the mouses fault? No, it's your fault for putting a mouse in tank with a snake.

 

[Andovar]

Has there been any gameplay yet that has allowed you to actually be xeno-friendly?
Or is the definition of friendly still "I'm ignoring them"

 

[Daniel Cloudsifter]

Can I be Xeno-Neutral? I frankly don't care about either Thargs or Guardians. None of them give me good money, materials or modules or I can't otherwise interact with them. WOuld love to trade human weaponary (like AX) for thargoid weaponary (Hyperspace interdictor, shield disruptor, EMP, etc.)

Guardian modules are not really better than human ones, only compared to unengineered modules.

While I'm pro Guardian and anti-Thargoid, I'm not really do anything about either in game right now. The Guardian modules (so far) are unimpressive and the risk/reward ratio for taking on Thargoids just isn't worth it for me.

It's a game and I'm here to have fun. I'll interact with both when it suits me - probably the former rather than the latter, because the ruins are neat.

 

[Mrat13]

Agreed. All evidence points to them starting the war ages ago and being extremely aggressive. The new Guardian logs show that the same thing happened to them. Further, they were gifted linguists, figured out how to communicate with the Thargoids, and it made NO difference. So the Guardians had to respond with more aggressive measures and - I would assume - managed to drive off or contain the Thargoids. I can't imagine them fighting their final civil war AND the Thargoids at the same time.

And yes, most of the player base doesn't have the full background because they haven't read the novels - or bothered to check the wiki page that sums it up. We know from "Premonition" that the Club knows the Thargoids know we are sentient, that they know our language, and that they know we act as individuals and not as a hive collective. From "Out of Darkness" we actually see a rogue human scientist strike a deal with the Osresians, who build a base for him to conduct his research.

I swear, some of these players want to excuse everything the Thargoids are doing in game and blame humanity first. Some dismiss any and all data - from humanity or the Guardians - under "Victors write the History books." Well taken to that extreme, we might as well toss out ALL history as they are meaningless. Ugh. Yes, there is some bias, but that doesn't automatically refute all facts.

For my part, I'm surprised to learn that the Thargoids were NOT the automated constructs of the Guardians and were a separate, hostile race. After seeing how things went with the Guardian's peace overtures - and the fact that the Thargoids still HATE the Guardians 2 million years later - I'm all for using Mycoid 2.0, 3.0, etc.

The biggest eye-opening experience of all this for me is that I used to watch Sci-Fi movies where a group of people, totally oblivious to evidence indicating caution should be taken, would welcome aliens and get massacred (e.g. Independence day, War of the Worlds, etc.). I figured that was a lazy writing trope. Now I can see that no, there are really people like that. Wow.

And I like sci fi like mass effect, or star trek, or the orville, where humanity and aliens find a way to co-exist with one another. Even the robots are friendly (well, sometimes not on the surface, but underneath, like the geth).

I guess it depends on experiences. I haven't been attacked by a 'goid yet, and the guardian skimmers only seem to come when you vandalize guardian tech, which seems to indicate a self defence system of some kind. I also have never attacked a 'goid, and only know of the guardian interaction through youtube, as I'm not a vandal.

 

[Poseidal]

And I like sci fi like mass effect, or star trek, or the orville, where humanity and aliens find a way to co-exist with one another. Even the robots are friendly (well, sometimes not on the surface, but underneath, like the geth).

I guess it depends on experiences. I haven't been attacked by a 'goid yet, and the guardian skimmers only seem to come when you vandalize guardian tech, which seems to indicate a self defence system of some kind. I also have never attacked a 'goid, and only know of the guardian interaction through youtube, as I'm not a vandal.

Well, there was a potential 'Trek'-like alien race, quite similar to humans being bipedal, and have similar tech. They were good linguists and could have opened dialogue with the humans.

Too bad the Thargoids killed them.

 

[Monk]

I'm still in the "don't care one way or the other" camp.

The Thargoids have created more opportunities for me than obstructions. I'm not their friend but I have no interest in interfering in their affairs with Aegis. Aegis, who acts unilaterally for the whole of humanity, probably deserves to be checked for its arrogance.

 

[Mrat13]

Well, there was a potential 'Trek'-like alien race, quite similar to humanoids and had their tech. They were good linguists and could have opened dialogue with the humans.

Too bad the Thargoids killed them.

People thought the protheans were dead too....

And it's been up for debate whether they were killed by the 'goids or their own civil war. And even if it was 'goids, whose to say the guardians didn't fire first?

 

[Daniel Cloudsifter]

Well, there was a potential 'Trek'-like alien race, quite similar to humans being bipedal, and have similar tech. They were good linguists and could have opened dialogue with the humans.

Too bad the Thargoids killed them.

You're correct on all points but the last one. The Thargoids didn't kill the Guardians. The Guardian's AI controlled weapons decided that the Guardians were too violent and decided to wipe them out - and did so in one massive strike. Interestingly, it was the Civilian AI/constructs that came to this conclusion and they had to convince the military ones to do it (who were very reluctant to do so).

From Cannon's website:

Spoiler

10/28 : Civil War Log – Annihilation

Spoiler

This log concerns the end of the second civil war. Remarkably, it seems the artificial intelligences developed during the conflict became fully self aware at some point, and were horrified by the destruction unfolding around them. It’s difficult to get a sense of exactly what happened next, as the Guardians were not privy to the Constructs’ thoughts. But reading between the lines, I believe the Constructs determined that even if peace was restored the Guardians would never be able to transcend their violent natures. I believe they decided that the only way to preclude further violence – while giving their own burgeoning society the best possible chance of survival – was to destroy what remained of the Guardians’ civilisation. By this time, the Constructs had complete control of the Guardians’ munitions and automated war machines. Their attack, when it came, was swift and merciless. Strategic nuclear and chemical-weapon strikes were executed with a precision that only a machine race could accomplish. The few that survived were able to record what had happened, but they soon succumbed to radiation poisoning. The Guardians were utterly destroyed.

and

Spoiler

27/28 : Body Protectorate Log – Discord
Okay, from the Guardian sites we’ve previously investigated, we know that the Guardians’ artificially intelligent Constructs were responsible for controlling the war machines and other military apparatus, as well as overseeing civilian technology and infrastructure. And we know that these Constructs eventually gained sentience and destroyed the Guardians. But it appears that it was not the military Constructs that made this choice. The Constructs for civilian utility and those for military operation were independent of one another, and it was the non-military Constructs that decided to attack the Guardians. The military Constructs were opposed to this decision, but somehow the non-military Constructs won out, forcing their military counterparts to comply with the attack. What a remarkable discovery. It makes me wonder what happened to these Constructs, and what they eventually became. Were they destroyed? Or do they still exist, somewhere in the vastness of space?

[Edit: I have tried to fix the spoiler tags 8 times now, and the forum is just not co-operating. It keeps putting tags in that I remove. I give up]

 

[Poseidal]

You're correct on all points but the last one. The Thargoids didn't kill the Guardians. The Guardian's AI controlled weapons decided that the Guardians were too violent and decided to wipe them out - and did so in one massive strike. Interestingly, it was the Civilian AI/constructs that came to this conclusion and they had to convince the military ones to do it (who were very reluctant to do so).

Oh interesting. I guess that's why people were guessing the Thargoids were the Guardian AI?

 

[The Lawful]

When considering our reaction to the Thargoids, we should also consider the experiences of the Guardians - who didn't want to take up arms and went to great lengths at trying to communicate with the flowers.

Guardian Codex #3 "Unsuccessful Truce" says it all.

https://imgur.com/a/TuRCi#9jEs9fd (courtesy of CMDR Tanarin)

Communicating with the Thargoids did the Guardians little good. The Thargoids were in fact "determined to continue hostilities".

This is completely in line with CMDR Jameson's assessment of the previous threat and other findings throughout the Pleiades, namely the various ship logs.

So all in all, the story of the peaceful Thargoid is a myth yet to be proven.

O7,
[noob]

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

I'm in the 'Xeno-don't care' camp and have been since my nephew told me about the wire framed menace some 30 years ago, as to who's right and who's wrong I'm thinking along the lines of... the first time they showed their heads recently a bunch of hillbilly's went ganking, and this behaviour has continued and has been supported since, now with many stations acting as labs to develop antibug guns we're surprised when they get 'Disabled'...

Ho Hum!

 

[Daniel Cloudsifter]

Oh interesting. I guess that's why people were guessing the Thargoids were the Guardian AI?

Yes. I was one of those people. The facts seemed to support that hypothesis:
1. Guardians have detailed culture. Thargoids seem to only replicate and want to fight.
2. Guardians were masters of biotech and made advanced constructs.
3. Two factions of Guardians. Two factions of Thargoids.
4. Thargoids react violently to Guardian tech. Guardian tech doesn't react to Thargoid tech at all (until the new ruins, and even then, not hostile)
5. Thargoids adapted to our weapons, but are still vulnerable to weapons derived from Guardian tech 2 million years later! (designed flaw in their creations?)

However, that wasn't the case, as the new logs prove. They were completely separate races. And the Guardians tried to make peace with the Thargoids and Thargoids didn't care.

 

[Mrat13]

Yes. I was one of those people. The facts seemed to support that hypothesis:
1. Guardians have detailed culture. Thargoids seem to only replicate and want to fight.
2. Guardians were masters of biotech and made advanced constructs.
3. Two factions of Guardians. Two factions of Thargoids.
4. Thargoids react violently to Guardian tech. Guardian tech doesn't react to Thargoid tech at all (until the new ruins, and even then, not hostile)
5. Thargoids adapted to our weapons, but are still vulnerable to weapons derived from Guardian tech 2 million years later! (designed flaw in their creations?)

However, that wasn't the case, as the new logs prove. They were completely separate races. And the Guardians tried to make peace with the Thargoids and Thargoids didn't care.

You made me realise something.....

What if the 'goids aren't truly sentient like we think they are. What if they're just like an advanced bumble bee. Will defend itself if provoked, but has no clue about sentient terms like war or peace. This whole thing could simply be one giant communication misunderstanding. The guardians also feel foul of this, and believed the goids understood terms they were simply indifferent to. How would you even have a truce when the being attacking you treats what you see as 'war' as merely self defence.

Heck, maybe the guardian AI accidentally attacked the goids at some point, which made the 'goids go berserk on them, and the guardian's built in specific features so only with a required code would the weapons fire on 'goids say (explains why the don't fire now), and tried to do the above truce which failed, and without understanding, the 'goids now just see guardian tech as always a threat. Maybe that's why more neutral commanders are reported being attacked, as the ' goids start to believe all of humanity is a threat, not just small groups or individuals.

Maybe instead of trying to truce, we need to just state "we intend no harm", to make it simple for the 'goids that we as individuals don't want to hurt them....

Oh dear, I just rambled didn't I?....

 

[OnTheMinute]

If you put a mouse in vivarium with a snake, it will get eaten. Is that the snakes fault? Is that the mouses fault? No, it's your fault for putting a mouse in tank with a snake.

Any chance you can enlighten us mere mortals to what this grand wisdom means?

 

[MadDogMurdock]

When considering our reaction to the Thargoids, we should also consider the experiences of the Guardians - who didn't want to take up arms and went to great lengths at trying to communicate with the flowers.

Guardian Codex #3 "Unsuccessful Truce" says it all.

https://imgur.com/a/TuRCi#9jEs9fd (courtesy of CMDR Tanarin)

Communicating with the Thargoids did the Guardians little good. The Thargoids were in fact "determined to continue hostilities".

This is completely in line with CMDR Jameson's assessment of the previous threat and other findings throughout the Pleiades, namely the various ship logs.

So all in all, the story of the peaceful Thargoid is a myth yet to be proven.

O7,
[noob]

But they would say that wouldn't they.
Much the same as Galnet tries to claim that the Thargoid attacks are unprovoked.