Paladin Consortium - Betrayers and Opportunists or the NEW face of once proud faction

[Yodebe]

I have thrown in a couple of comments to this so far, but as you have poked your head up!
@zybr78 I must ask a question as you are the director of the expansion of EGU.
If you come to a system that has an opposing ethos to your group and the MF that is already present has had a single Cmdr supporting it from launch,,, Lets say they only get a few hours a week and have always supported that faction and strongly consider the system their home, Would you bypass it if asked and it did not interfere with your expansion? Or must you conquer all in your path?

As an anarchy PMF that had the Clayakarma HQ dropped just 3 jumps away from my home system, I can answer this for you.
I have just 4 systems with my PMF present, and I'm quite happy with that, I don't have never-ending expansion plans.

They took my home system from one of their control systems, and have put dictatorships in charge of almost all populated systems in my area.
They have threatened to basically wipe me out if I re-take control of a system.
They have threatened to wipe me out if I expand into any other system in 'their' space.
I have tried to negociate letting me control three out of four (leaving my home system for their control/exploitation zones) in exchange for a non-expansion clause, which for them would have meant just ONE anarchy system in each of three of their control systems. This was refused.
I've been in from Beta, in the space 'up the crack' between ADL and hudson, and they've basically shut me down.

I think there's enough non-PMF systems that power players should be able to do their thing around PMF systems, leaving them alone.

The only solution for small PMFs against one of the biggest powerplay bullys is a concerted (and maybe organised?) effort of all the PMFs affected to embark on a mission to install democratic governments into grom space, forcing the loss of fortification bonuses, and even instigating fortification penalties, until the EGP issue a statement that they'll leave PMFs alone.

This can be done completely anonymously, as you're working for democratic MFs, and it doesn't have to be in your immediate vicinity. (it's also quite fun!)

Independently we are weak, but together we might be able to cause enough trouble for them that they might see the benefits of happy PMFs, and a peaceful solution.

I don't even 'do' powerplay, but when your PMF gets shut down, then 'terrorism' (installing democratics? haha ) is the only option left open.

The federation are considering helping out with the organisation of the revolt of the minor factions.

 

[Becky]

I've been in from Beta, in the space 'up the crack' between ADL and hudson, and [EGU] basically shut me down.

Thanks for your report Yodebe.

Paladin Consortium on the other hand have player factions near by (Imperial Nagas) and we do our best to help with the maintenance of their home systems.

The truth starts to come out in the wash.

 

[AL TARF]

Yodebe...

Yet another pile of unspeakable lies from a one-man-army warrior, who didn't even consider any of our propositions and just said - I want this, that, and, tbh, I don't want you to exist at all.

It's too bad you are too deceitful to even mention the fact that we (Me personally) have proposed to help your faction expand in another direction. We litteraly proposed to work for your BGS and that's how you repay us. Galaxy is full of backstabbing riffraff, it seems...

 

[AL TARF]

Thanks for your report Yodebe.

Paladin Consortium on the other hand have player factions near by (Imperial Nagas) and we do our best to help with the maintenance of their home systems.

The truth starts to come out in the wash.

It's sad that Naga doesn't share your optimism. You either have no idea what Paladins are doing or you just so used to lying to everyone that you don't even notice that. You constantly pushing Naga out of systems they're trying to expand to, you are dumping them even in their origin system! So much for knight is shining armor. Face it — You're bloody crusaders, and the only thing you have from a knights is your big mouth.

 

[MottiKhan]

Welcome back Al Tarf. It's good to see your chipper self around these parts.

 

[faceindisguise]

This Al Tarf cat is clearly on the defense. If I where her, I would just delete this thread cause this is looking bad for the EGU crew. She is clearly poor at manipulation.

 

[Yodebe]

Yodebe...

Yet another pile of unspeakable lies from a one-man-army warrior......

Quote from your Wulwula guy:

"The CMDR, on behalf of Yuri Grom, is addressed to you by the Governor of the cluster Wulwula. Monitoring the faction of the Namab Purple Brothers to any cluster system will counteract the interests of the force of Yuri Grom. Your actions in the BD-17 5832 system threaten the leading position of the faction Official BD-17 5832 Justice Parties. In case you continue the struggle for control of the system, I will have to draw a fleet of forces and force the Namab Purple Brothers faction to completely leave the BD-17 5832."

Yodebe...

It's too bad you are too deceitful to even mention the fact that we (Me personally) have proposed to help your faction expand in another direction.

So you want to remove me from my home systems, of which there are just four, and dump me somewhere else after 3 yrs.
How exactly is that 'helping my faction?

Here is your 'offer', so people can make up their own mind:

As you may be aware - Yuri Grom doesn't like anarchy factions on his territory. They decrease systems value and spoil our triggers. Your faction is presented in our cluster - Namab and we wish to ensure our mutual benefit. Our idea is that we are going to help your faction to grow in a certain direction, while you in return do not expand into Grom territory. By certain direction we mean Archon Delaine systems in the closest vicinity. What do you think about that?

And my response:

Greetings.
I appreciate that you have at least attempted to find an amicable solution, but your offer is un-acceptable.
I think we should clarify exactly who is on who's 'territory'
You'll find a clue in the name 'Namab Purple Brothers'
We were here from before the Grom power even existed, and we're staying.
I do have an alternative proposal for you though, based on 'you leave us alone, and we'll leave you alone'
In detail:
You can keep Namab. We'll always have a presence there, as we're native, but do what you want with it.
I want Drevlyada.
I already have LTT 8001, and want to keep it.
I want BD-17 5832

Drevlyada is in 'your' Namab zone.
LTT 8001 is in your Ngbato zone
BD-17 5832 is in your Wulwulla zone.
As I understand it, Anarchy's are neutral to you, in terms of fortification bonusses & stuff, and you've already pretty much cleaned up with dictatorships & Feudals in all of those zones, so I propose you leave me those systems, and I will not expand further in any direction, nor will I do anything to hinder your operations, by interfering with those other controlling factions.
You'll have one anarchy in each, that's it.
You might even find that I let you know of any strange occurances, or any significant imperial / federal activity that I come across.
Despite our differences, I believe we can both live in this area without conflict.
I'm aware that you could quite easily extinguish Namab Purple Brothers from the map, but that would not be conducive to peaceful relationships between Grom & the minor factions.

to which i received no response.

 

[Yodebe]

You know what? there's nothing wrong with being a 'one-man-army warrior' in a game like Elite.
There's lots of people here, with lots of different styles of playing.
I don't even 'do' powerplay, yet you come barging in asking me to move out of 'your' space.
Can you not see how obnoxious that is?
From the amount of messages I've had from other PMFs, this is far from an isolated incident.
What is it you want? for everyone else to leave for Colonia or something, so you can have the bubble for yourself?
I suggest you re-consider your methods when dealing with PMFs and concentrate on your powerplay thing, or you're going to see a major revolt of the minor factions.

 

[Marshall...]

Interesting thread indeed!

The one thing that i find disappointing is that Frontier implemented PG/Solo, so folks can effectively bypass direct confrontation with opponents. Back during the Dangerous Games, when I was leading PalCon as part of GalCop, we laid elaborate plans to blockade systems etc. Which was a waste of time as EGU all play in Private Group.

A missed opportunity. The same as what is going on with the BGS.

 

[Sentenza]

Interesting thread indeed!

The one thing that i find disappointing is that Frontier implemented PG/Solo, so folks can effectively bypass direct confrontation with opponents. Back during the Dangerous Games, when I was leading PalCon as part of GalCop, we laid elaborate plans to blockade systems etc. Which was a waste of time as EGU all play in Private Group.

A missed opportunity. The same as what is going on with the BGS.

Just consider PG/Solo like dropping paratroopers at night behind enemy lines. A lot of time passed since armies charged at each other with bayonets

 

[rrobes]

It seems to me that EGU is guilty of what that group is accusing others of doing.

Self-righteous, condescending, insulting, is that what passes for diplomacy in EGU?

Remember the children's tale, where the bullfrog wanted to be the biggest frog in the pond? It blew itself up bigger AND BIGGER, til POP!

No more frog.

 

[zybr78]

The one thing that i find disappointing is that Frontier implemented PG/Solo.

PG and solo are the only problems of this game? True?
Leave only Open and fix it all? This is ridiculous.


The game is full of bugs and without balance.
They perfectly repeated the old Elite in a new graphical environment.
All the rest is a snag, there is no economy, no dependencies.
What they have done is unbalanced in all its manifestations.
Power Play simply can not be described as something thoughtful.
Bring some goods from point A to point B and repeat them in a circle.
Apparently this is what we want from the game (sarcasm)


All this will not correct the refusal of solo. Everything needs to be altered.




Well, the fact that you played in some other game, which they themselves invented, not the problems of other players. And in my opinion, we won only because we were able to organize everything correctly, which other groups did not take care of or did not do it at the proper level.

 

[Marshall...]

PG and solo are the only problems of this game? True?
Leave only Open and fix it all? This is ridiculous.


The game is full of bugs and without balance.
They perfectly repeated the old Elite in a new graphical environment.
All the rest is a snag, there is no economy, no dependencies.
What they have done is unbalanced in all its manifestations.
Power Play simply can not be described as something thoughtful.
Bring some goods from point A to point B and repeat them in a circle.
Apparently this is what we want from the game (sarcasm)


All this will not correct the refusal of solo. Everything needs to be altered.




Well, the fact that you played in some other game, which they themselves invented, not the problems of other players. And in my opinion, we won only because we were able to organize everything correctly, which other groups did not take care of or did not do it at the proper level.

Totally agree with you. Lots of missed opportunity/potential there.

The other issue we had with the dangerous games was purely down to timing. Each CG was announced during Russian/east eurooe prime time. So by the time west europe and hours later the states (where most of GalCop members were based), EGU would already be in the lead.

Another example of poor planning/implimention from FD is the PvP Icarus cup. I was involved in a focus group with FD and several other group leaders (SDC, EIC and others), which laid out the plans. 2 years later its still not happened.

 

[rrobes]

It may be worth noting that FD may set these events up with a view towards marketing/sales, to target certain demographics. Wouldn't surprise me.

Still, that BGS is unbalanced in:re Open versus Solo/PG, absolutely, no doubt. It's a shadow war of fetch and carry with almost 0% live interaction between the players of opposing forces. This is at odds with FD's apparent purpose to increase Open activity.

Changes for more live interaction to cement BGS results are needed.

 

[zybr78]

The other issue we had with the dangerous games was purely down to timing. Each CG was announced during Russian/east eurooe prime time. So by the time west europe and hours later the states (where most of GalCop members were based), EGU would already be in the lead.

We are told that a bad dancer is prevented from dancing even his balls
Out of 6 confrontations in 2 games, we won everything. 6/6
Checkmate.


Those who did not participate in these competitions, but want to check the reliability of this statement, look, for certain on the forum there are Google tablets with exact figures who did what by the hour for each of the tasks. The figures speak for themselves.


In one of the tasks, it is quite possible. But who knows. If the issue of rare goods remained at the same level, our opponents would be able to maintain such a pace.


In general, here is another saying.
After a fight, they do not wave their fists


I hope Google interpreter translates it so that at least the meaning remains))

 

[zybr78]

This is at odds with FD's apparent purpose to increase Open activity.

in my opinion, the main thing that the fd wants is to either leave the sales at the same level, or increase them. This is right for business.


But do players want to leave only open. As far as I know, no poll of the players was conducted. To with a large number of participants, there are 20-30% of players at least. Then it will be clear what the players want.


In my humble opinion, the majority of players do not see this as their interest. just want to come home after work, pour yourself a cup of tea, or open a bottle of beer and just fly from station to station, or from star to star.


And all this mouse fussing them to one place.


Yes, what to talk about, look at your faction. You cleaned, apparently deleted the dead accounts, some players just went away. Out of 2000, you have 150 left. I see the impact figures in the systems, I see the numbers of conflicts. 150 involved in the game is clearly a strong exaggeration.


So ask yourself, who should the FD focus on?


All in all, it's more likely that anyone who decides to leave an open game only after the nearest board of directors gets kicked in the , and will be fired.


Can be wrong. Quite possibly. Let the FD vote on this issue, as a result it will be clear what the players are.

 

[rrobes]

The issue remains, BGS is unbalanced.

A faction can operate strictly in Solo/PVT and circumvent the entire "Dangerous" part of the game. So you're left with the "Elite" part.

What exactly is a faction that refuses to fly in Open and engage other players? Certainly not "Elite". You're just fetch and carry players.

In other instances, where certain game characteristics greatly unbalance play, it is called an "EXPLOIT".

FD has addressed "EXPLOITS" before and should do so again.

These BGS tactics fully meet the definition of exploit: "make full use of and derive benefit of a resource".

Thereof...

EXPLOITERS.

 

[Sentenza]

I am rather under the impression that "exploit" around here means "anything I am unable to beat".

BGS is a strategy subgame in ED. In a strategy game, you don't have to meet the other players, you don't have to even know who they are and where they are, all you need is to be able to detect their moves and play your countermoves. Anything they can do, you can do better if you think better. It's a game between minds not guns.

On a side note, I have to say that russian sayings sound great can we have more?

 

[MottiKhan]

I agree with Sentenza here. The BGS isn't an Open/Private/Solo issue. It can be played in all modes. Even in Open, you won't see the majority of players. The most likely player you'll see is the one who's attracted by the uptick in activity and wants to PvP for the jollies.

Killing a CMDR has little effect on the BGS. It's almost exclusively a PvE activity.

If a group can muster a lot of CMDRs to do what needs to be done and they do it right, they're deserving of the win.

 

[rrobes]

I am not the only one that has the same thoughts regarding BGS/Solo-PVT, it has been a common item of discussion for some time.

So if a larger group exterminates all of the smaller groups in it's path, it's OK. Seems to me that this is the tyranny of the majority, not a desired outcome IMHO.

And considering how splintered responses may be, any checks and balances appear out the window.

And speaking of "deserving", utilizing tactics that have had negative connotations attached, the killing off of weaker by stronger, with no real chance of survival by the weaker, doesn't elicit anything but contempt from me.

If you're the stronger, come out and fight, if you're superior in skill and equipment and you beat me, you have my respect, well done. If not, refer to the last part of the previous sentence.

Just to be clear, I speak for myself, not for anyone else.